Edinburgh City

[newcastle broon]

1 hour ago, 1320Lichtie said:

 

What's Ally etc away to do then? Season tickets back? Pretty sad.

Wonder if this will have an affect on attendances. Already thought they might go down a bit as there's no new buzz this year but this might be even more of a blow.

 

They can always head oot to Rosewell  for WW  in the LL, new fans always made welcome  

[GordonD]

1 hour ago, newcastle broon said:

They can always head oot to Rosewell  for WW  in the LL, new fans always made welcome  

Isn't that where the flying saucer crashed in 1947?

[SimonLichtie]

 

On 30/06/2017 at 18:14, football maniac said:

Nah he should never get a good job again in his life. Cant believe what I'm seeing. These clubs should be embarrassed signing Goodwillie/Thomson. Least the Edinburgh City fans have some decency and are gonna do something about it. The Clyde fans celebrated Goodwillie which was just horrible

Someone makes a mistake at a young age and in your opinion they should never be allowed to have a good job in their lifetime?! Out of interest, what do you consider a good job?

Should drug dealers be allowed 'good jobs' once their conviction is spent? Does it depend on the drugs/ the amount? What about people who commit ABH/ GBH. Do you decide based on the circumstances, or is there a black and white line? Am I correct in assuming you must be disgusted everytime you hear of someone who has committed series crimes being rehabilitated and helping others/ working within the community/ working in 'good jobs'?

I know the vast majority view sex offenders as the lowest of the low, and understandably. However, to not believe in rehabilitation for people is truly bizarre to me. I fully understand the reaction of Clyde/ Edin City fans to signing Goodwillie/ Thomson and that it would put some people off going to see their team (I mean the reaction of disgust, the 'celebrating' comment you've made is nonsense, a minority of Clyde fans made some shitty comments but the majority weren't happy).

Personally I believe people should be held accountable and made to pay for their crimes. I also believe once people have been punished for their crime then in the majority of cases the individual should be rehabilitated and intergrated back into society.

[Jason King]

The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 (Exclusions and Exceptions) (Scotland) 2013 (as amended) sets out that you can not discriminate against an individual on the basis that the individual has what is deemed to be spent vetting information.

Now I'm not 100% sure of what the actual piece of legislation he was convicted under but he was placed on the register for 5 years in 2011 so that is now deemed to be spent and can not be used against him if he applies for a job. If he was looking to work with Children or Protected Adults then I suspect his conviction would remain for 15 years, but would need to know the actual legislation.

Convicted murderers are allowed to work with vulnerable groups so not sure why a nonce working in a role where he isn't working directly with children is causing so much frothing at the mouth.

[cowdenbeath]

19 hours ago, GordonD said:

Isn't that where the flying saucer crashed in 1947?

Aye and they all stayed on

[EmbraJam]

To recap; Dunsmore, See and Cummings have left City but what's the latest on Harrison, Donaldson, Stobie, Makofo and Allan? Apologies if I've missed an update on here.

[AllyMonc]

To recap; Dunsmore, See and Cummings have left City but what's the latest on Harrison, Donaldson, Stobie, Makofo and Allan? Apologies if I've missed an update on here.

Harrison has a new 1 year deal, Allan has been realised by Hibs but there are rumours he'll be back (would be a great signing). I've not heard about the rest to be honest

[AllyMonc]

As some of you know over the weekend I met with board members, management and playing staff to discuss Craig Thomson and put forward the view of those of us who are opposed to his signing. The meeting lasted almost 2 hours and I'll try and summarise it as best I can below:

First of all I would say that I do now believe the board did not come to this decision lightly. There has been a large amount of due diligence done and for all I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth the decision was made on the basis that first of all Craig Thomson is not a threat to children, that he is genuinely sorry for his actions and that he deserves a second chance at being a senior footballer having been heavily punished over the last 6 or so years.

Board members have visited Kelty games to gauge the crowd reaction to Craig Thomson as they were concerned about the atmosphere when he plays for us, but their belief is that as at Kelty it won't be as bad as people expect.

The players have been consulted and all of them are on board, all potential signings have been made aware of the situation.

The main sponsors have been consulted and are comfortable with the club's stance.

People within the club's youth department, contacts at Hibs and at Spartans have also been talked to and again are comfortable.

We did discuss the morals of signing someone with his record but to be quite honest their minds were clearly made up, although as I said I do believe it was at least a difficult decision for them.

In terms of the damage to the club's reputation they are aware that the adverse publicity will affect crowds. The belief is that the initial furore will die down and people will drift back, especially when City start winning games. Again they are saying this from a position that Craig Thomson deserves another chance at some sort of football career.

One thing that was very clear to me is that this is an ambitious club and that senior people at the club see Craig Thomson as a vital part of where they want to be.

From my point of view I think the lack of communication with fans when the signing leaked (almost a month ago) has been a huge issue (the club have said their hands were tied by him still being a Kelty player) and if we all get through this as City fans I think it's imperative we band together and create a formalised fan group. If we want our voices heard we need to be organised, I would be happy to work with anyone to discuss how this might work.

From a personal point of view I still believe it is the wrong decision and I told the board so. I fear they have gravely underestimated the reputational damage this will do to the club, Edinburgh City's fan base is small and boosted by casual observers and those who consider us their second team, the casual fan by their very nature is quick to walk away. Goodness me it's hard enough to get people along to games in the first place now. Of course some of the 'hardcore' are ready to walk away themselves and will not go quietly.

I tried to drive the point home that the club cannot control the narrative on this, Craig Thomson will forever be tarred as a child sex offender. There will be no nuance to this story, Edinburgh City will have signed a 'nonce', a 'beast' a 'paedo'. Irrespective of what members of the board feel about those terms, those are the terms that will be used. The club will be stained by those terms.

As for the moral question of whether a convicted sex offender should be allowed to resume a football career? Well that's a question that each of us have to answer for ourselves. My natural reaction is no, but as someone who believes in the rehabilitation of those who have erred I accept I am wide open to accusations of hypocrisy.

I've hated this last few weeks, I still don't know what I'll do when the season starts.

I am very much not the voice of the board and to be honest there are a few of them that really don't like me (in their defence I am an ars@hole) but I wanted to make sure I'd passed on what I was told. I hope it's answered some of your questions.

Peace, love and empathy.

[superlichtie87]

Did you guys re-sign Riordan?

[The Grass Is Greener.]

Is that Thomson official?

[tamthebam]

9 minutes ago, The Grass Is Greener. said:

Is that Thomson official?

I believe he's a Grade 1 referee employed by the SFA so yes he is an official. 

[tamthebam]

10 hours ago, Jason King said:

The Rehabilitation of Offenders Act 1974 (Exclusions and Exceptions) (Scotland) 2013 (as amended) sets out that you can not discriminate against an individual on the basis that the individual has what is deemed to be spent vetting information.

Now I'm not 100% sure of what the actual piece of legislation he was convicted under but he was placed on the register for 5 years in 2011 so that is now deemed to be spent and can not be used against him if he applies for a job. If he was looking to work with Children or Protected Adults then I suspect his conviction would remain for 15 years, but would need to know the actual legislation.

Convicted murderers are allowed to work with vulnerable groups so not sure why a nonce working in a role where he isn't working directly with children is causing so much frothing at the mouth.

An interesting wee piece of legal info- if you're placed on Probation (Community Payback Order as it is now) for an offence and it is one that comes under certification in regard to the Sex Offenders Register then the registration period only lasts as long as the Probation e.g. for 2 years even if the offender breaches the Probation and returns to the Court to be sentenced which could be a jail sentence. 

If you get a fine however the period of registration is a minimum of 5 years. It can be said that Probation/CPO is usually regarded as a more serious sentence than a fine.

 

 

[Bay Citizen]

Is that Thomson official?

Yes just announced on Facebook

[1320Lichtie]

Great post from you Ally.

Unfortunately I don't share the boards view that the reaction in the SPFL will not be as bad as you think. Much much much bigger stage than Kelty. He'll be getting it bad every game from now until the end of his career rightly or wrongly.

I could only imagine the reaction if you were to play Hibs away for example..

[ecfcnorthfield]

5 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said:

Great post from you Ally.

Unfortunately I don't share the boards view that the reaction in the SPFL will not be as bad as you think. Much much much bigger stage than Kelty. He'll be getting it bad every game from now until the end of his career rightly or wrongly.

I could only imagine the reaction if you were to play Hibs away for example..

I agree top marks to Ally for a superb post like that. 

However I'm done. Can't bring myself to go back whilst he is there 

[The Grass Is Greener.]

Fucking hell

 

Had hoped fan reaction might have seen this deal get pulled. What the f**k are they thinking. Hope City get pumped rotten all season, back to the Diddy leagues.

[Lordy]

3 hours ago, AllyMonc said:

As some of you know over the weekend I met with board members, management and playing staff to discuss Craig Thomson and put forward the view of those of us who are opposed to his signing. The meeting lasted almost 2 hours and I'll try and summarise it as best I can below:

First of all I would say that I do now believe the board did not come to this decision lightly. There has been a large amount of due diligence done and for all I don't want to put words in anyone's mouth the decision was made on the basis that first of all Craig Thomson is not a threat to children, that he is genuinely sorry for his actions and that he deserves a second chance at being a senior footballer having been heavily punished over the last 6 or so years.

Board members have visited Kelty games to gauge the crowd reaction to Craig Thomson as they were concerned about the atmosphere when he plays for us, but their belief is that as at Kelty it won't be as bad as people expect.

The players have been consulted and all of them are on board, all potential signings have been made aware of the situation.

The main sponsors have been consulted and are comfortable with the club's stance.

People within the club's youth department, contacts at Hibs and at Spartans have also been talked to and again are comfortable.

We did discuss the morals of signing someone with his record but to be quite honest their minds were clearly made up, although as I said I do believe it was at least a difficult decision for them.

In terms of the damage to the club's reputation they are aware that the adverse publicity will affect crowds. The belief is that the initial furore will die down and people will drift back, especially when City start winning games. Again they are saying this from a position that Craig Thomson deserves another chance at some sort of football career.

One thing that was very clear to me is that this is an ambitious club and that senior people at the club see Craig Thomson as a vital part of where they want to be.

From my point of view I think the lack of communication with fans when the signing leaked (almost a month ago) has been a huge issue (the club have said their hands were tied by him still being a Kelty player) and if we all get through this as City fans I think it's imperative we band together and create a formalised fan group. If we want our voices heard we need to be organised, I would be happy to work with anyone to discuss how this might work.

From a personal point of view I still believe it is the wrong decision and I told the board so. I fear they have gravely underestimated the reputational damage this will do to the club, Edinburgh City's fan base is small and boosted by casual observers and those who consider us their second team, the casual fan by their very nature is quick to walk away. Goodness me it's hard enough to get people along to games in the first place now. Of course some of the 'hardcore' are ready to walk away themselves and will not go quietly.

I tried to drive the point home that the club cannot control the narrative on this, Craig Thomson will forever be tarred as a child sex offender. There will be no nuance to this story, Edinburgh City will have signed a 'nonce', a 'beast' a 'paedo'. Irrespective of what members of the board feel about those terms, those are the terms that will be used. The club will be stained by those terms.

As for the moral question of whether a convicted sex offender should be allowed to resume a football career? Well that's a question that each of us have to answer for ourselves. My natural reaction is no, but as someone who believes in the rehabilitation of those who have erred I accept I am wide open to accusations of hypocrisy.

I've hated this last few weeks, I still don't know what I'll do when the season starts.

I am very much not the voice of the board and to be honest there are a few of them that really don't like me (in their defence I am an ars@hole) but I wanted to make sure I'd passed on what I was told. I hope it's answered some of your questions.

Peace, love and empathy.

 

Cheers for that mate, My thoughts are the club have made a massive mistake in making this signing and it will backfire big time, the club think it will all blow over once they start winning games, what if they don't and child groomer is having a shocker in games due to the barrage of abuse he will get at every game, here's a wee thought, where will City be training through the week, if it is down in Pilton/Spartans, then a good chance some of the locals who have booked a pitch on training nights might just think to have words with him, recipe for disaster.

Not a worry for me now though, I won't be back.

[football maniac]

13 hours ago, SimonLichtie said:

 

Someone makes a mistake at a young age and in your opinion they should never be allowed to have a good job in their lifetime?! Out of interest, what do you consider a good job?

Should drug dealers be allowed 'good jobs' once their conviction is spent? Does it depend on the drugs/ the amount? What about people who commit ABH/ GBH. Do you decide based on the circumstances, or is there a black and white line? Am I correct in assuming you must be disgusted everytime you hear of someone who has committed series crimes being rehabilitated and helping others/ working within the community/ working in 'good jobs'?

I know the vast majority view sex offenders as the lowest of the low, and understandably. However, to not believe in rehabilitation for people is truly bizarre to me. I fully understand the reaction of Clyde/ Edin City fans to signing Goodwillie/ Thomson and that it would put some people off going to see their team (I mean the reaction of disgust, the 'celebrating' comment you've made is nonsense, a minority of Clyde fans made some shitty comments but the majority weren't happy).

Personally I believe people should be held accountable and made to pay for their crimes. I also believe once people have been punished for their crime then in the majority of cases the individual should be rehabilitated and intergrated back into society.

Tbh there are crimes which are forgivable and crimes which should result in a lifetime of misery. This I feel is the latter. Certainly shouldn't be allowed on a football pitch where plenty of youngsters idolise these people.  Theres no coming back from it tbh. Just like theres no coming back for Edinburgh City for signing this guy unfortunately.

[CitizenSmith]

Arranged for season ticket money to be refunded for both my own and son's STs.  Stopped my direct debits. Over £1000 of income lost annually alone from my side of things. 

That's me done with over 20 years of involvement including one as chairman five or so years back. I have helped out on match days when required in the last few years but generally just gone along and supported the club I truly cared about, simply as a fan. This effectively clears out the old guard from the club the guys who have been going along for decades. The club's soul has been sold and all for a 1 year contract for a convicted child sex offender.

Ally thanks for meeting up with and passing on the details of your meeting with the board. You're a sound guy and whilst I have made my mind up, as you say we all have decisions to make, I'll judge no one if they carry on attending games.

One final moral dilemma? What to do with my £25 ew @ 25/1 on City to win the league. Answers on a postcard...

 

Edited July 4, 2017 by CitizenSmith
Typo

[JakeSAFC]

Shocking from Edinburgh, doon ye go.