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Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread


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3 minutes ago, ali_91 said:

Cracking viewing on Saints TV of our promotion winning match at Ayr in 1990. Strange hearing Saints fans belting out Hail Hail, glad that’s slipped from our song book. 
 

Any of you old duffers there? How many did we have? 

I wasn’t there 🤦‍♂️ but I believe we took about 4,500 that day. We had a bit of a rivalry with Ayr at the time with us both coming out of D2 the same season (they won the league, we were runners up).

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I was there as a young lad, always seems like there were thousands there when think back to games like this but genuinely think there was then. Can remember Totten walking round afterwards, shaking hands with a load of fans. He was brilliant at PR.

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I could google this, but I can’t be bothered. Was the league a formality? Or was that a must win? 


Definitely wasn’t a formality prior to the famous Airdrie game! That was a must win, they lost game in hand to Clydebank and the momentum shifted. After Ayr we played Forfar at home so presumably that could have clinched it too but all the build up was for Ayr. As folk have said we had fair bit of beef with them from second division days which just added to it.
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A point would have done Saints at Somerset, in theory, as we were 3 points clear with 2 games left (2 points for a win) but had a notably superior goal difference.  And as it happened anyway, Airdrie only drew 1-1 at Morton on the same day.  They imploded after we beat them, only taking 2 points from 6 games.

2096178576_Screenshot_20191018-0812202.thumb.jpg.e47cf59cafb6d38fd3212beafff19a4f.jpg

It's great to see some of these players that I saw but was too young to appreciate. Know enough of guys like Allan Moore but Sammy Johnston looked a pretty classy midfielder. Why did Totten jettison him so early the next season? 

Hoping they stick the Scottish Cup semi-final at East End Park on Saints TV. 

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11 hours ago, ali_91 said:

Cracking viewing on Saints TV of our promotion winning match at Ayr in 1990. Strange hearing Saints fans belting out Hail Hail, glad that’s slipped from our song book. 
 

Any of you old duffers there? How many did we have? 

We took around 3000 to that one.

We had a big rivalry with Ayr getting out of old division 2, we were the two biggest clubs in the division by a long way, and we're battling it out for the title.  We'd both had average first seasons in division one, our last one at Muirton though we reached the Scottish Cup semi and drew with Rangers.  But the rivalry was wearing off by the time we clinched the title down there. That season we drew Rangers again in the early rounds of the cup.. Mental to think we got the upper tier of the Broomloan that day and took 2-3000 to that one as well. Got pumped about 3-0 I think.

I think of Ayr as a bit of a benchmark for us.  We were at the same level, getting the same sized crowds and similar sized towns. Then we moved to McDiarmid at a time when football was beginning to become sexy again, and we've become a Premiership/ occasional top end championship side, whilst they've pottered about between the second and third tier ever since. 

Cracking day that never really felt in doubt.

We sung 'hail hail the Saints are here' and also used to sing 'Hello hello we are the Muirton boys'. They were just football songs to us back then.  As you say, thankfully they're long gone from our repertoire.

As Tam mentioned, football was brilliant to follow then. I know there's nothing worse than some old c***s going on about how good things were, but we averaged 6000 in the second tier, without any Dundee/ Dunfermline or big clubs in the division to boost the average, with full houses against Thistle and Airdrie.  I'm sure we took around 1000 to away matches (but might be rose-tinted glasses on that one).  The football we played was fast, attacking and with loads of goals. I suppose the newness of McDiarmid made it seem exciting as well.  

McDiarmid always felt like it was rocking. Probably a lot to do with playing well and winning. I remember when we had our unbelievable spell in the premier the following season, Totten describing it as a "lions den".

Still, st Mirren away on Saturday ...

 

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3 hours ago, Radford said:

A point would have done Saints at Somerset, in theory, as we were 3 points clear with 2 games left (2 points for a win) but had a notably superior goal difference.  And as it happened anyway, Airdrie only drew 1-1 at Morton on the same day.  They imploded after we beat them, only taking 2 points from 6 games.

2096178576_Screenshot_20191018-0812202.thumb.jpg.e47cf59cafb6d38fd3212beafff19a4f.jpg

It's great to see some of these players that I saw but was too young to appreciate. Know enough of guys like Allan Moore but Sammy Johnston looked a pretty classy midfielder. Why did Totten jettison him so early the next season? 

Hoping they stick the Scottish Cup semi-final at East End Park on Saints TV. 

Hate seeing Livingstone in that table....it was Meadowbank Thistle

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Really good piece on the BBC website by Stuart Cosgrove on Tommy Wright and Saints. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50081826

I think the lack of panic is both freshing and interesting. Of course there are some folk unsettled but then I don't think it's unfair to say this isn't the first time that a lot of them have wanted TW sacked... 

I wonder if part of it is also down to how we are playing? It's everyone's favourite thing again, it's xG, but Saints underachieving/not getting the results our play merits. 

516553397_xGpoints.PNG.397bae96367fd6d37ecd97260fc672b7.PNG

Hopefully things start to turn in the next few weeks. 

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In case of that xG, it could be a worry. I've no idea but if we're above average just now, it means there would be a dip coming soon. If that coincides with fixtures against St Mirren/Hamilton/Hearts...

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Just now, RandomGuy. said:

In case of that xG, it could be a worry. I've no idea but if we're above average just now, it means there would be a dip coming soon. If that coincides with fixtures against St Mirren/Hamilton/Hearts...

I really don't see why? If anything, it should improve further against teams nearer the bottom of the table. 

If our points total was notably higher than our "points based on xG" , you'd expect a dip in the former. Is that what you mean? But as we are underachieving, that hardly applies here. 

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1 hour ago, Radford said:

I really don't see why? If anything, it should improve further against teams nearer the bottom of the table. 

It doesnt seem to work like that, in some cases, for some reason. Man U had a mammoth xG last season, which continued this season against Chelsea, and its now "reverting to the mean" by being below average despite the quality of opposition not necessarily being higher.

I think their highest is against Chelsea, and their lowest is against Newcastle.

If our xG this season is "above average", and I've no idea if it is, then it likely means a dip is on it's way. Even Celtic have suffered xG dips over the past few seasons to bring them back to normality.

Edited by RandomGuy.
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1 hour ago, Radford said:

Really good piece on the BBC website by Stuart Cosgrove on Tommy Wright and Saints. 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/50081826

I think the lack of panic is both freshing and interesting. Of course there are some folk unsettled but then I don't think it's unfair to say this isn't the first time that a lot of them have wanted TW sacked... 

I wonder if part of it is also down to how we are playing? It's everyone's favourite thing again, it's xG, but Saints underachieving/not getting the results our play merits. 

516553397_xGpoints.PNG.397bae96367fd6d37ecd97260fc672b7.PNG

Hopefully things start to turn in the next few weeks. 

Good article. Not sure about Wright presiding over the most Saints players that have gone onto play international football statement.  Is that right?

Only May and Wotherspoon so far by my reckoning, as others had caps before Tommy, Kennedy still to gain first cap, and others are underage level.  I must be forgetting a few.

 

I get the fear when the xG type stats like that get rolled out. I would imagine every league in history has teams relegated with tremendous stats, too good to go down etc.  

On the flip side, our team that finished fourth the season after the cup win might  be well down such a table, as I remember we were lucky if we saw two shots in a game for much of that season!

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49 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

Good article. Not sure about Wright presiding over the most Saints players that have gone onto play international football statement.  Is that right?

Only May and Wotherspoon so far by my reckoning, as others had caps before Tommy, Kennedy still to gain first cap, and others are underage level.  I must be forgetting a few.

 

I get the fear when the xG type stats like that get rolled out. I would imagine every league in history has teams relegated with tremendous stats, too good to go down etc.  

On the flip side, our team that finished fourth the season after the cup win might  be well down such a table, as I remember we were lucky if we saw two shots in a game for much of that season!

xG is about quality of chance, not number.

I'm sure during that spell we conceded a shit tonne of shots, but most weren't from dangerous positions.

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1 hour ago, RandomGuy. said:

It doesnt seem to work like that, in some cases, for some reason. Man U had a mammoth xG last season, which continued this season against Chelsea, and its now "reverting to the mean" by being below average despite the quality of opposition not necessarily being higher.

United were massively outperforming their xG. They were winning games that, by rights, they shouldn't have been. Folk were pointing out that's why it was folly to offer Solskjaer the job. 

I think Saints have had a higher xG in a couple of heavy defeats to Rangers which I guess is what you are pointing at with United? That is individual games though rather than a trend. 

All the xG does for me here is back up the feeling that we aren't really playing like a team at the bottom of the league and, in turn, I think that's why there doesn't seem too much unrest. 

We need to start turning stats into points though, no doubt about that. 

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5 minutes ago, Radford said:

United were massively outperforming their xG. They were winning games that, by rights, they shouldn't have been. Folk were pointing out that's why it was folly to offer Solskjaer the job. 

I think Saints have had a higher xG in a couple of heavy defeats to Rangers which I guess is what you are pointing at with United? That is individual games though rather than a trend. 

All the xG does for me here is back up the feeling that we aren't really playing like a team at the bottom of the league and, in turn, I think that's why there doesn't seem too much unrest. 

We need to start turning stats into points though, no doubt about that. 

I'll be honest, I'd misread the stuff about United last season as having a high xG, instead of them outperforming it, which is where my thought process has fallen down.

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