Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[RandomGuy.]

7 hours ago, PauloPerth said:

In terms of the advantage on the park it would make f**k all difference, it's already a home game for them due to the apathy amongst our own support.

All this shite about OF fans ruining the experience etc is mostly pish, unless we're talking about folk taking young kids along.  

Are you too dense to not understand the link between the home support dropping, and people not wanting to take their kids to the game?

We respected Ricksen before, and during, the match, yet theres still reports of children being hounded with abuse by Rangers fans. That'll be another number of our support next time. Since my dad stopped being able to go I go in a group of 3, me, my mate, and his daughter, he doesnt want to take her to Old Firm games, and his season ticket being able to get me a ticket was the only reason I went on Sunday. If he decides to just stay at home next time, I wont be paying almost £30 to go.

I'd be surprised if the majority of people who miss these games aren't doing so because they, or people they attend with, dont want children to be involved in it, and instead find something else to do that weekend. If they enjoy that more and it's cheaper, are you going to convince yourself it's worth going back to McDiarmid?

I think its wrong to blame being people not wanting to take their kids to that, I'd rather we took a financial hit and made it a comfortable place for St Johnstone supporters to come to, as I think we'd see an upturn in home support for these games, and, rightly or wrongly, you might even end up attracting more home fans because they want to see names they recognice in the Rangers squad. If McDiarmid becomes a place they enjoy then theyll maybe try it again the next week.

I doubt the club will do that though, it would take them standing up to the Old Firm, and it would take them having to actually organise themselves in regards to who they sell tickets too. I've never seen anything to suggest they would do either solely to benefit the home support.

Edited September 24, 2019 by RandomGuy.

[tree house tam]

43 minutes ago, Fifespud said:

 

Every cloud etc - at least you’ll not have to worry about ticket allocations to the Old Firm next season

 

^^^ somecunt give him a charity bet

 

Better bet his wife too, just in case.

[Dons_1988]

Alienating your home support through ‘cashing in’ on OF fans and handing over the majority of the stadium to them is why the league, the SFA and many clubs wanted a club that cheated and sent themselves bust admitted straight into the top league.

As soon as clubs give up on attracting the local support it’s time to pack it in.

[tree house tam]

4 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

 

I think its wrong to blame people not wanting to take their kids to that, I'd rather we took a financial hit and made it a comfortable place for St Johnstone supporters to come to

If they both fucked off, Scottish football would go from strength to strength. That is the best scenario I can envisage. 

[RandomGuy.]

4 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

Alienating your home support through ‘cashing in’ on OF fans and handing over the majority of the stadium to them is why the league, the SFA and many clubs wanted a club that cheated and sent themselves bust admitted straight into the top league.

As soon as clubs give up on attracting the local support it’s time to pack it in.

Aye.

We apparently had 66,000 fans at McDiarmid in total last season. 17,000 of them were games against Celtic and Rangers. Take away the home fans from them games, and you're under a quarter, almost at a fifth, of our seasonal support being Old Firm fans. 

Yet here we are with folk claiming we'll pile up losses and slip down the league if we dont let more of them in.

[tree house tam]

1 hour ago, RandomGuy. said:

Aye.

We apparently had 66,000 fans at McDiarmid in total last season. 17,000 of them were games against Celtic and Rangers. Take away the home fans from them games, and you're under a quarter, almost at a fifth, of our seasonal support being Old Firm fans. 

Yet here we are with folk claiming we'll pile up losses and slip down the league if we dont let more of them in.

Home crowds would go up,  certainly for Saints. Scottish football would be better off, in fact if we could just get rid of the chunk of Scotland let's say from Ayr to the bottom of loch lomond and across to around bathgate, you know the bit with the Nasal high pitch rough accent full of rat pussed bigoted individuals,  aye that would be great.

[andrewh]

Does this inform any of what we’re discussing here?

Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons
I noticed the discussion about OF ticket allocation over on the St Johnstone thread and remembered that we'd "cut" their allocation this season.
There was a fair bit of chat at the time about how it'd affect us (if at all), so on and so forth.
Having a quick check it'd appear the policy change made no material difference to our reported attendance. Barring the opening day of the 17/18 season the difference is a few hundred either way over the past few seasons:
19/20
10/08/19 - Motherwell 2 - 5 Celtic Att: 8822
18/19
26/08/18 - Motherwell 3 - 3 Rangers Att: 9545
05/12/18 - Motherwell 1 - 1 Celtic Att: 8433 (mid-week)
07/03/19 - Motherwell 0 - 3 Rangers Att: 9200
17/18
06/08/17 - Motherwell 1 - 2 Rangers Att: 9974 (Opening game of the season)
29/11/17 - Motherwell 1 - 1 Celtic Att: 9164 (mid-week)
18/03/18 - Motherwell 0 - 0 Celtic Att: 8717
31/03/18 - Motherwell 2 - 2 Rangers Att: 8915
16/17
16/07/16 - Motherwell 0 - 2 Rangers Att: 6951 (LC group)
03/12/16 - Motherwell 3 - 4 Celtic Att: 8535
02/01/17 - Motherwell 0 - 2 Rangers Att: 7902
So there you go...

https://www.pieandbovril.com/forum/applications/tapatalk/index.php?/topic/230925-Motherwell-FC---A-Thread-For-All-Seasons/page__view__findpost__p__13221565

[RandomGuy.]

@andrewh This is our current squad, with ages and senior career appearances (according to transfermarkt)...

Spoiler

Goalkeepers

Zander Clark (27) - 214 appearances

Elliot Parish (29) - 153

Max Johnstone (21) - 1 

Average Age: 26 - Total appearances: 368 (average: 123)

Defenders

Wallace Duffy (20) - 7

Scott Tanser (24) - 153

Madis Vihmann (23) - 203

Jason Kerr (22) - 164

Anthony Ralston (20) - 54

Liam Gordon (23) - 65

Callum Booth (28) - 296

Average Age: 23 - Total appearances: 942 (average: 135)

Midfielders

Ross Callachan (26) - 222

Drey Wright (24) - 171

Murray Davidson (31) - 376

David Wotherspoon (29) - 401

Danny Swanson (32) - 348

Ali McCann (19) - 30

Jason Holt (26) - 246

Liam Craig (32) - 494

Matty Kennedy (24) - 212

Average Age: 27 - Total appearances: 2500 (average: 278)

Strikers

Chris Kane (25) - 188

Stevie May (26) - 269

Michael O'Halloran (28) - 207

Callum Hendry (21) - 41

Average Age: 25 - Total appearances: 705 (average: 176)

If any can't be arsed looking through every individual player, heres a summary...

Spoiler

0-50: (4) - Max Johnstone, Wallace Duffy, Ali McCann, Callum Hendry

50-100: (2) - Anthony Ralston, Liam Gordon

100-150: N/A

150-200: (5) - Elliot Parish, Scott Tanser, Jason Kerr, Drey Wright, Chris Kane

200-250: (6) - Zander Clark, Madis Vihmann, Ross Callachan, Jason Holt, Matty Kennedy, Michael O'Halloran

250+: (6) - Callum Booth, Murray Davidson, David Wotherspoon, Danny Swanson, Liam Craig, Stevie May

No comment from me on any of it, just putting it in an easy to view way.

[jimmy boo]

9 hours ago, tree house tam said:

Home crowds would go up,  certainly for Saints. Scottish football would be better off, in fact if we could just get rid of the chunk of Scotland let's say from Ayr to the bottom of loch lomond and across to around bathgate, you know the bit with the Nasal high pitch rough accent full of rat pussed bigoted individuals,  aye that would be great.

Sorry but that's utter pish. Anyway I don't buy this thing about home fans not going to games against the OF with their kids because of the big bad bigots saying bad words.  When mine were young they would always come to every game against the OF and why not when there's a chance of getting it up them. 

[tree house tam]

14 minutes ago, jimmy boo said:

Sorry but that's utter pish. Anyway I don't buy this thing about home fans not going to games against the OF with their kids because of the big bad bigots saying bad words.  When mine were young they would always come to every game against the OF and why not when there's a chance of getting it up them. 

Get in the sea, take your accent with you.

[jimmy boo]

5 minutes ago, tree house tam said:

Get in the sea, take your accent with you.

Oh dear, tam is back on the potato home brew again.

[tree house tam]

Wrong again

[Valentino Bolognese]

30 minutes ago, jimmy boo said:

Sorry but that's utter pish. Anyway I don't buy this thing about home fans not going to games against the OF with their kids because of the big bad bigots saying bad words.  When mine were young they would always come to every game against the OF and why not when there's a chance of getting it up them. 

Why not? Because what sort of parent would expose their kids to it? 

Mine don't go and I'm not the only one. I'd say about half the parents I know are exactly the same. It makes no difference if you 'buy it', because it's a fact. 

Basically it's the same reason you don't let them watch horror films or porn. It's because you care about not warping their brains when they don't have the maturity to deal with it. You know, because you're a parent and at least while they're young you want to protect them from the utter scumfuckery that they'll have plenty of adult years to be appalled by. 

They sang the 'bouncy' song on Sunday. Explain that to a 10yo. 

[jimmy boo]

7 minutes ago, Valentino Bolognese said:

Why not? Because what sort of parent would expose their kids to it? 

Mine don't go and I'm not the only one. I'd say about half the parents I know are exactly the same. It makes no difference if you 'buy it', because it's a fact. 

Basically it's the same reason you don't let them watch horror films or porn. It's because you care about not warping their brains when they don't have the maturity to deal with it. You know, because you're a parent and at least while they're young you want to protect them from the utter scumfuckery that they'll have plenty of adult years to be appalled by. 

They sang the 'bouncy' song on Sunday. Explain that to a 10yo. 

I'd suggest the songs of the scum go over the majority of kids heads and they will hear more bad language in the school playground or from fellow fans so maybe it's parents being over protective? I've obviously heard the **** singing 'bouncy' but have no idea what it means or why it would corrupt children.

[PauloPerth]

12 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

Are you too dense to not understand the link between the home support dropping, and people not wanting to take their kids to the game?

We respected Ricksen before, and during, the match, yet theres still reports of children being hounded with abuse by Rangers fans. That'll be another number of our support next time. Since my dad stopped being able to go I go in a group of 3, me, my mate, and his daughter, he doesnt want to take her to Old Firm games, and his season ticket being able to get me a ticket was the only reason I went on Sunday. If he decides to just stay at home next time, I wont be paying almost £30 to go.

I'd be surprised if the majority of people who miss these games aren't doing so because they, or people they attend with, dont want children to be involved in it, and instead find something else to do that weekend. If they enjoy that more and it's cheaper, are you going to convince yourself it's worth going back to McDiarmid?

I think its wrong to blame being people not wanting to take their kids to that, I'd rather we took a financial hit and made it a comfortable place for St Johnstone supporters to come to, as I think we'd see an upturn in home support for these games, and, rightly or wrongly, you might even end up attracting more home fans because they want to see names they recognice in the Rangers squad. If McDiarmid becomes a place they enjoy then theyll maybe try it again the next week.

I doubt the club will do that though, it would take them standing up to the Old Firm, and it would take them having to actually organise themselves in regards to who they sell tickets too. I've never seen anything to suggest they would do either solely to benefit the home support.

Even by your levels of drama queenery that's a decent effort.

I acknowledged that some folk with young kids possibly don't like going to OF matches because of their fans. Far from ideal, and an issue Scottish football has failed to deal with forever. Unlike UEFA now making a stand thankfully.  

Whether we give them 5000 tickets or 7000 tickets, it won't make any difference whatsoever to that issue. In reality, Saints fans would all be in a stand separate from the OF supporters.  Unlike the current arrangement,  where they share the Main Stand with 1000 of them.  

And where is our family section moved to when we play the OF clubs...?  The Main Stand.  So your argument about protecting young kids from the bigots is nonsense when you're asking for us to keep them in the same stand as that lot.

I'm all for Saint trying initiatives to get more of our crowd back along to these (and all) matches. If successful, and we were getting over a couple of thousand home fans then great, let's go back to the arrangement we currently have.  But sadly it's not going to magically change anytime soon.

 

 

 

[RandomGuy.]

15 minutes ago, jimmy boo said:

I'd suggest the songs of the scum go over the majority of kids heads and they will hear more bad language in the school playground or from fellow fans so maybe it's parents being over protective? I've obviously heard the **** singing 'bouncy' but have no idea what it means or why it would corrupt children.

One of our fans on our forums granddaughter was a ball girl on Saturday and was called a "fat wee c**t" by Rangers fans, for absolutely no reason.

They regularly screech at the Saints support calling us "****** b*****ds", kids will ask what it means.

Why should they be subjected to that?

[RandomGuy.]

16 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

Even by your levels of drama queenery that's a decent effort.

I acknowledged that some folk with young kids possibly don't like going to OF matches because of their fans. Far from ideal, and an issue Scottish football has failed to deal with forever. Unlike UEFA now making a stand thankfully.  

Whether we give them 5000 tickets or 7000 tickets, it won't make any difference whatsoever to that issue. In reality, Saints fans would all be in a stand separate from the OF supporters.  Unlike the current arrangement,  where they share the Main Stand with 1000 of them.  

And where is our family section moved to when we play the OF clubs...?  The Main Stand.  So your argument about protecting young kids from the bigots is nonsense when you're asking for us to keep them in the same stand as that lot.

I'm all for Saint trying initiatives to get more of our crowd back along to these (and all) matches. If successful, and we were getting over a couple of thousand home fans then great, let's go back to the arrangement we currently have.  But sadly it's not going to magically change anytime soon.

I'd be giving Rangers/Celtic the end stands, at best, same as the Dundee sides get when they're bringing big crowds. 

We wont agree here. I cant find the figures to back it up but I'm fairly certain Sunday was our lowest home support of the season.

I'd rather the club identify why home supporters are being turned away and try and rectify it, you seem happy for them to ignore the issue home fans have and try and make as much money as they can. I believe restricting thebaway support size, and keeping them more isolated, would help the home fans enjoy the day and in turn encourage more along. Would be worse for away fans but, frankly, that's not our priority. 

As I say, we wont agree on this, so continuing it is pointless.

Edited September 24, 2019 by RandomGuy.

[jimmy boo]

8 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

One of our fans on our forums granddaughter was a ball girl on Saturday and was called a "fat wee c**t" by Rangers fans, for absolutely no reason.

They regularly screech at the Saints support calling us "****** b*****ds", kids will ask what it means.

Why should they be subjected to that?

That is of course utterly scummy behaviour but could happen at any game from any away support.  My son came intermittently from about age 10 but full time from 14 and his sister from age 12. Never considered not taking them to OF games and they'd have been raging if I had.

[RandomGuy.]

Just now, jimmy boo said:

That is of course utterly scummy behaviour but could happen at any game from any away support.  My son came intermittently from about age 10 but full time from 14 and his sister from age 12. Never considered not taking them to OF games and they'd have been raging if I had.

Well that's a lovely story, but you're one bloke who, let's be honest, has a history on this site of going around defending scumbag supports. I know of a lot of adult Saints fans who, with their children, have suffered verbal abuse unsuitable for children at Old Firm games and refuse to take them.

Whether you believe it's a problem or not, it's the reason our home crowd drops for Old Firm games.

[jimmy boo]

2 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Well that's a lovely story, but you're one bloke who, let's be honest, has a history on this site of going around defending scumbag supports. I know of a lot of adult Saints fans who, with their children, have suffered verbal abuse unsuitable for children at Old Firm games and refuse to take them.

Whether you believe it's a problem or not, it's the reason our home crowd drops for Old Firm games.

Eh? When have I defended 'scumbag supports'?

If that's your experience and that of your fellow supporters then that's fair enough and not doubting your word. Just telling it from my perspective though and it's not done my family any harm.