Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[RandomGuy.]

22 minutes ago, The Saintee said:

Why was Millar frozen out for a bit though?TW couldn't trust his fitness. You, in fact, would lose your shit when he was subbed off after 10 minutes.

I don't think Tommy goes full on bitter Mourinho for no reason.

I made the point about training because TW seems to take hold the good trainers in high regard.

Remember he did an interview stating how good Pates was? His attitude in training was amazing and he'd never missed a day off sick etc etc.

Those far more ITK were suggesting it was more personal, I'm maybe gullible but I believe them. Im wrong about a lot of things, happy to admit I'm wrong most times and capable of changing my opinion. 

20 minutes ago, The Marly said:

And had loads of assists including vital assists in European games.  Stats aren't the be all and end all.  I personally wouldn't judge Scougall or any midfielder on goals, more on how much they influence a game.  Scougall hasn't done that enough for me or more importantly to convince the manager that he's worth a place.  That's the bottom line.  I realise that you think Scougall is some sort of Scottish Messi - he isn't though.

As I say, Scougall hasn't done enough. I'm not debating that. I'm of the opinion he's more to offer, and, like others, given a run of starts in his preferred position could bring that out of him. 

If I'm wrong I'm wrong, I just think it's harsh he's not getting that chance.

Edited October 5, 2018 by RandomGuy.

[john1962]

BawbagGuy forgets what he posts sometimes though 

You could do with seeing a therapist about this obsession you have

[Kyle]

2 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

Over Swansons first 26 games at the club, he scored 3 goals..

If you exclude Scougalls goals for being "lucky", it's unfair to include Swansons penalties, so his record is 9 goals in 68 games. 

In terms of Wotherspoon, he's had two 2000+ minute seasons and the most goals he's contributed is 3.

Agree with your general point but Wotherspoon but he did manage 9 or 10 goals in a season a few years back. If he's done that in less than 2000 minutes, that's a brilliant return. 

I quite like the idea of Scougall and want to see him succeed but he's only played about 9 minutes of league football so far this season (all of that before we signed Swanson, Callachan and Nydam) and only started in home games against lower league teams in the league cup. He doesn't seem to be anywhere near the squad, never mind a starting berth. He came directly from Sheffield United and had offers to stay in England and the chairman said at the time that pushed the boat out to get him. The frustration is he got plenty of chances last season in a team which didn't really suit the way he plays. This season's team has much more pace, better movement in attacking areas and, minus Maclean, more intelligent footballers in the final third and central midfielders that are more confident and comfortable going beyond the striker. Scougall could work in this team in the number 10 role in a 4-2-3-1 IMO,  but it's hard to see where his chance will come from. 

 

[The Marly]

As I say, Scougall hasn't done enough. I'm not debating that. I'm of the opinion he's more to offer, and, like others, given a run of starts in his preferred position could bring that out of him. 
If I'm wrong I'm wrong, I just think it's harsh he's not getting that chance.

Having been in hospitality at Dave's testimonial and witnessed the interaction between Tommy and Midge, I would be astounded if there were any personal issues between them. Why would Midge have stayed if Tommy was treating him so poorly and he was being paid a pittance as some have suggested?

As for Scougall, I wouldn't be averse to giving him a run in the Midge role as some have suggested. He might be good in there. If he is going to sit in the stand then I would rather he left given the wages he's probably on.

[RandomGuy.]

Just now, Kyle said:

Agree with your general point but Wotherspoon but he did manage 9 or 10 goals in a season a few years back. If he's done that in less than 2000 minutes, that's a brilliant return. 

 

His 9 goal season saw him play just over 3100 minutes.

I feel like people will start to think I'm wanting Scougall to be first choice regardless of form, I'm not, I'm simply saying his form last season is close to the form of others in their first season, yet he's been treated harsher. That doesn't seem fair to me.

[RandomGuy.]

3 minutes ago, The Marly said:

Having been in hospitality at Dave's testimonial and witnessed the interaction between Tommy and Midge, I would be astounded if there were any personal issues between them. Why would Midge have stayed if Tommy was treating him so poorly and he was being paid a pittance as some have suggested?

As for Scougall, I wouldn't be averse to giving him a run in the Midge role as some have suggested. He might be good in there. If he is going to sit in the stand then I would rather he left given the wages he's probably on.

I don't know, as I say, maybe I'm naive but there's definitely posters on here who get close to players and get told things people like me don't. I'm willing to believe some of what they say.

Agree with the final point though, Scougall sitting in our stands is completely pointless. If he hasn't played by January id happily see him leave, for his sake and ours.

[Kyle]

1 minute ago, RandomGuy. said:

His 9 goal season saw him play just over 3100 minutes.

I feel like people will start to think I'm wanting Scougall to be first choice regardless of form, I'm not, I'm simply saying his form last season is close to the form of others in their first season, yet he's been treated harsher. That doesn't seem fair to me.

I think the expectation of greater returns stem from Tommy's 'jewel' chat of last summer, the fact the chairman said that he pushed the boat out to get him (coupled with the fact he's said some players are on 6 figure basic salaries - I'd imagine Scougall will be one of them given where he's come from) and the fact he was really supposed to replace Swanson in terms of creativity/output. Beyond the odd flash, he's fallen quite significantly below the expectations of the manager and the support which is maybe why he's found himself out in the cold more than a Wotherspoon would have who came in with more modest expectations. He's also not as versatile and, whilst he works hard for the team, he's not as effective defensively as the likes of Alston.

I don't want to shit on Scougall - I feel sorry for him as the move to Saints could end up hindering his career - but we do need more from marque signings and players collecting a top bracket wage. He probably needs more of a chance than he's gotten so far this season though - hopefully he gets it before the January window.

[tree house tam]

Scougall hasn't justified his large wage, that's not in doubt. We still pay that wage though and he's better at football than quite a few who are in the side imo. Obviously Tommy doesn't for whatever reason.

 

Big daft Irish c**t that he is.

[7-2]

5 hours ago, The Marly said:

I never said that at all.

I agree with a lot of what you said in your subsequent posts but to me the term 'can't cut it' means the person isn't good enough for that level. Not performing and not being good enough are obviously two different things though. I fully with your opinion of stats though!

[The Marly]

I agree with a lot of what you said in your subsequent posts but to me the term 'can't cut it' means the person isn't good enough for that level. Not performing and not being good enough are obviously two different things though. I fully with your opinion of stats though!

Yeah "can't cut it" is maybe a bit harsh, but I was quoting someone else's post. I was as excited as anyone else when we signed Scougall, but I feel he has been a massive let-down. How much of that is his fault or the manager's is not important to me. And people quoting stats won't convince me that others, including Spoony, haven't made a far greater contribution to St Johnstone than Scougall. Similarly with the argument about Tommy not picking him or playing him in his preferred position. Tommy is the most successful manager in the club's history and has made a much more significant contribution to St Johnstone and I fully trust his decisions on playing matters.

[steve55]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-north-east-orkney-shetland-45758018

 

A 13-year-old boy from Shetland faces a 700-mile round trip to realise his football dream after signing for St Johnstone.

Striker Finn Regan is flying down for Friday training and weekend games in Perth all the way from his home just 200 miles off the Norwegian coast.

The Anderson High School pupil said he is "very happy" and hopes to become a professional.

Edited October 5, 2018 by steve55

[jamamafegan]

“St Johnstone Football Club have made the surprise signing of a 13 year old boy from SHETLAND! UP THERE IN SHETLAND!”

[Tibbermoresaint]

Let's hope he's good in the box.

[RandomGuy.]

I know there's lot of "yer da" types who despise anything resembling a stat, but this is an interesting thing to look at. 

Our games seem to open up nearer the end of the game, while the majority of goals have been conceded down the left side.

[NYD1997]

4 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

I know there's lot of "yer da" types who despise anything resembling a stat, but this is an interesting thing to look at. 

Our games seem to open up nearer the end of the game, while the majority of goals have been conceded down the left side.

Kind of shows exactly what we know.  Tanser is the major weak link in our defence.

 

Whilst nobody would say Foster is the best defender in the league - he is at least competent, so teams will attack Tanser knowing he is awful defensively   

[Widge]

Tansers not awful defensively though. Yes the goals are coming down that side, but more from the fact he’s getting no protection. Now given it’s been Kennedy most of the season, it’s no real surprise. Wright on the other side puts a power of work in, he’s excellent defensively and has a brain too.

[NYD1997]

21 minutes ago, Widge said:

Tansers not awful defensively though. Yes the goals are coming down that side, but more from the fact he’s getting no protection. Now given it’s been Kennedy most of the season, it’s no real surprise. Wright on the other side puts a power of work in, he’s excellent defensively and has a brain too.

HE is though. Positionally he is all over the place.  He lacks the heart to burst back in, and doesn't hit tackles that make up for the positional sense. Don't get me wrong, cracking crosser, but he is a wing -back - i.e. ok going forward but not good enough to be a winger, and poor defensively so needs the cover 

[Nelly78]

I don't think Tanser's that bad defensively. Not brilliant, but definitely not shite. Kennedy has given him no help at all and having Joe playing at left centre back is not much help either just now. No surprise that we concede a lot of goals/chances from that side, compared to the right, where Drey works far harder defensively than Kennedy, and Foster and Kerr are stronger than Tanser and Joe. 

I'd be happier with Liam Gordon (or Ando) replacing Joe, but that won't happen. We lack an organiser in the defence and, despite his age and lack of experience, Gordon seems to be that. 

[tree house tam]

3 hours ago, NYD1997 said:

so teams will attack Tanser knowing he is awful defensively   

This was probably best shown when Aberdeen subbed on Cosgrove and he was immediately played on Tanser, to some success I may add.

[Radford]

Tanser rarely lets a man past him but last week made me think about him; should he have been in a position to try and stop Callumn Morrison getting the ball in so much space. The lack of support from Kennedy probably made me give him the benefit of the doubt.

Off such a small sample, where the goals are scored doesn't concern me much at this stage but, related to Tanser, interesting the number of chances given up at the back post on his side compared to Foster. Posts above maybe address why.

Opposition managing to hit the target from outside the box far more than Saints are too.