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Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread


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4 hours ago, Mr Heliums said:

This is something that's clearly been coached into the team - play the safe ball, keep possession. It's totally stifled us as an attacking force. Suspect Vertainen's unwillingness to follow this instruction was the reason he was singled out for criticism and punted to Linfield. Really struggling to remember us playing through ball for someone to run on to.

The ironic thing is we hardly ever manage to keep the ball for long. We’re terrible at keeping possession and terrible at any meaningful attacking possession.
We’ll win it occasionally in midfield then pass it back to the centre half’s who pass it about a bit then it gets punted up the park to nobody in particular  

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Whilst we deserve to be in the position we are and it’s entirely our own doing, you can’t legislate for how unlucky we’ve been this season. I mean you’ve got 3 senior players who can all play right back/wing back and they’re all injured at the same time. On top of that, your emergency cover is a winger who’s also injured and not fully fit. It’s mad the injuries we’ve had this season compared to other years. It just feels like it’s fate we go down, literally nothing is going our way this season. 

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20 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

I think I've worded it poorly. Alston and Scougall weren't central midfielders as I see it, both were attacking ones. I'm on about Craig/Davidson replacements, ones who break play up as well as doing things on the ball/getting goals. I don't think either Alston or Scougall were ever seen as being that type. Those I've listed as signed were ones who, to me, the club signed to play that type of role in the side now or in the future.

I doubt we'll have anyone as good as McCann breaking through this decade. The club done, and continue, to do well developing youngsters, but they should be supplementing that with long term options too if they think the youngster is outstanding, otherwise the whole "plan" of developing and selling on the youngsters leads to situations like we're in. It was clear to everyone McCann wasn't going to be here long after he broke into the side, so presumably the club had that thought before then, but no succession plan was in place before we sold him. Ideally we'd have replaced Craig before last season, and had a plan in place for McCanns departure. We've still not replaced Craig to me, yet thats him now presumably finished.

They managed it in other positions, yet for some reason CM was neglected.

We struggled to adequately replace Millar as well upto the emergence of McCann.

Butterfield seems to be one taking a lot of flak, but I would have had him starting ahead of MacPherson at the weekend. He's better at keeping possession, which allows Crawford to get forward more, though I accept Butterfield has his limitations as well.

I am also surprised how far out the picture Liam Craig has fallen.  I struggle to accept that he could start in a winning league cup final, but a year later he's completely incapable of contributing at all?

Its been hard for all our new players though, coming into a struggling team that's low on confidence. Like everything, it comes back to our summer of inactivity.  If players had been introduced in a team with a winning culture and high standards then we might be seeing something completely different from a few of them right now.

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34 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

Butterfield seems to be one taking a lot of flak, but I would have had him starting ahead of MacPherson at the weekend. He's better at keeping possession, which allows Crawford to get forward more, though I accept Butterfield has his limitations as well.

I am also surprised how far out the picture Liam Craig has fallen.  I struggle to accept that he could start in a winning league cup final, but a year later he's completely incapable of contributing at all?

I don't think Butterfield fits in that deep role, really. Not the way we play anyway with the 2 CMs either side of him going wide to defend and leaving him alone, as hes not the legs or strength to defend 1v1 for me. You probably want to have him as one the more attacking CMs, but he's not got the legs for that in how we play either.

A decent player who you can tell was quality at one point, but just doesn't fit the shape anywhere, so what's the point? He's filed alongside James Brown and Ali Crawford for me, ones who are better than the criticism they receive and are made to look worse than they are by being wedged into a position that highlights all their flaws.

Liam Craig, I've no idea. By all accounts his "legs had gone" and he was done. Tbf his early appearances this season felt similar to Steven Andersons final appearances. The rustiness after every Summer for Craig seemed to be getting worse, even last season he took a while to get going. Maybe this season he just wasn't able to?

Edited by RandomGuy.
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35 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

I am also surprised how far out the picture Liam Craig has fallen.  I struggle to accept that he could start in a winning league cup final, but a year later he's completely incapable of contributing at all?

Lasted a bit longer than Craig Conway.

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We are where we are no point on dwelling on what could have been, we all know the summer was the window for at least getting a very decent striker in but it's in the distant past now. Until this current coaching regime either learn to play several ways or gtf the only way is down I'm afraid. 

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33 minutes ago, Sh*teAndMuck said:

https://www.thescottishsun.co.uk/sport/football/8535097/kilmarnock-sacking-tommy-wright-management/
 

Tommy speaking in the media about a return to management or some other type of role. Would we bring him back to help Callum?

Can't see anyone going for that one.

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17 hours ago, RandomGuy. said:

I don't think Butterfield fits in that deep role, really. Not the way we play anyway with the 2 CMs either side of him going wide to defend and leaving him alone, as hes not the legs or strength to defend 1v1 for me. You probably want to have him as one the more attacking CMs, but he's not got the legs for that in how we play either.

 

I think the deeper sitting midfielder is his better position funnily enough. Agree about the defending 1v1's, he's very slow so opponents can go past him a bit too easily.  Also very poor in the air.

Generally we've been better when we play 2 sitters and one (usually Crawford) off the front two, or one sitting with two pushing further forward.  Think we've been poor when playing the three across the midfield as it looked like at Easter road.

 Positionally he's reliable, tries to offer an option and keep possession with simple passes.  Again, I'm not saying he's flawless or a long term solution, just provides a better balance than Ali and Cammy alongside Hallberg.

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What is going on with St Johnstone journalists? It’s Sean Hamilton now, appearing on A View From the Terrace, placing all of the blame at the feet of the chairman. When Craig Fowler suggested that the manager has to take a proportion of the blame, Hamilton conceded that there are ‘some’ Saints fans ‘in the darkest corners of Twitter’ who are wanting the manager out.
 

What exactly is happening? Are they getting paid off?

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Sounds like Rooney, Booth, McCart, Sang and Bryson will all be available for the Motherwell game.

A proper selection crisis.
This could be an interesting line up on Saturday, however I’ve a wedding the night before so I’m probably going to be sitting shaking struggling to pay attention to the midfield.
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9 hours ago, The Real Saints said:

What is going on with St Johnstone journalists? It’s Sean Hamilton now, appearing on A View From the Terrace, placing all of the blame at the feet of the chairman. When Craig Fowler suggested that the manager has to take a proportion of the blame, Hamilton conceded that there are ‘some’ Saints fans ‘in the darkest corners of Twitter’ who are wanting the manager out.
 

What exactly is happening? Are they getting paid off?

The thing I have noticed, in real life not in the minds of these morons, it's actually the core support, the rational long time support and not the zoomers that are most damning about the management team. We all know the circumstances that have conspired around injuries, recruitment, plain bad luck etc and you can't discount this but the manager and his staff have many many faults and in my mind this kinda over rides all the other stuff. Boring turgid shite, crap game management and totally baffling decisions are the norm for a St Johnstone game nowadays. I still go and support the team but there are less and less fucks left to be given.

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9 hours ago, The Real Saints said:

What is going on with St Johnstone journalists? It’s Sean Hamilton now, appearing on A View From the Terrace, placing all of the blame at the feet of the chairman. When Craig Fowler suggested that the manager has to take a proportion of the blame, Hamilton conceded that there are ‘some’ Saints fans ‘in the darkest corners of Twitter’ who are wanting the manager out.
 

What exactly is happening? Are they getting paid off?

Maybe they actually know a lot more about the inner workings of the club…. It’s not a coincidence that the guys closest to the club all want to point the blame at 2 people (3 if you include our departed chief exec) and away from the manager - it’s almost like there is a theme.

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