Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[The Marly]

7 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

His record since January was 5 wins in 23 games (only 4 wins from 23 in 90 mins).

There was a fair bit of chat on our thread yesterday about Alexander over on our thread yesterday after a statement was released on his behalf by the LMA in England. The consensus is pretty much that he's salvaged a fair part of his reputation by leaving when he has.

Davidson's right in so much as the Sligo games cost Alexander his job but it was very much a "final straw" situation.

Burrows was keen to point out that while the board were planning to discuss the manager as a result of getting bodied out of Europe it was actually Alexander that came to the board last Friday AM and it was that conversation that expedited his leaving and it's definitely a mutual decision rather than a straight up sacking.

The word of the day last Friday was "toxicity" in so much as it was apparently the toxicity towards Alexander from the fans that prompted him to mutually consent. Which is fair enough, he'd clearly realised that he'd run out of road and it was pretty sensible reputation management on his part.

Tbh, I'm not sure that the Motherwell fans reaction was any more "toxic" after Sligo than the reaction from Saints fans after Kelty but it seems like Davidson's been more willing to dig in while Alexander's definitely seen the bigger picture and realised that he'd no room left to manoeuvre (possibly even with the board).

It's been interesting reading the parallels between Alexander with us since January and Davidson with you guys since...actually I've no idea how long it's been.

The one difference that probably makes Davidson more likely to dog in is that Saints are undoubtedly "his" club. Doubt if Alexander was a boyhood Motherwell fan.

[perthsaint1977]

I would take a 20 nil defeat tomorrow if it meant Davidson was punted. 

Genuinely think we lose our first 5 games this season with no goals scored. 

Utterly scunnered with CD and his negative tactics 

[Radford]

43 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Tbh, I'm not sure that the Motherwell fans reaction was any more "toxic" after Sligo than the reaction from Saints fans after Kelty but it seems like Davidson's been more willing to dig in while Alexander's definitely seen the bigger picture...

Davidson probably doesn't even realise what happened at Kelty, since he sprinted off to the dressing room and left his players to take the heat.

Tommy Wright and Manny Fowler would have been last up those steps.

As for when it started, that's a good question. I think folk were underwhelmed by the window last summer but obviously results would have dictated whether that actually became an issue.

We were alright up until the end of October, then even November, there was mitigation. The performance at Dundee, first game in December, probably set the ball rolling, as there was no reaction to it before the break.

Next few months (despite Kelty) just became about staying up, so it was put on back burner but, although I saw the case after Kelty, the 7-0 defeat at Celtic was probably when I knew I didn't want him as manager any longer.

Like many others though, I decided to give him a chance this summer but he fed us a load of flannel about all these changes, whilst arrogantly just ploughing on in the same furrow.

There is no way back now.

[mizfit]

17 minutes ago, Radford said:

Davidson probably doesn't even realise what happened at Kelty, since he sprinted off to the dressing room and left his players to take the heat.

Tommy Wright and Manny Fowler would have been last up those steps.

As for when it started, that's a good question. I think folk were underwhelmed by the window last summer but obviously results would have dictated whether that actually became an issue.

We were alright up until the end of October, then even November, there was mitigation. The performance at Dundee, first game in December, probably set the ball rolling, as there was no reaction to it before the break.

Next few months (despite Kelty) just became about staying up, so it was put on back burner but, although I saw the case after Kelty, the 7-0 defeat at Celtic was probably when I knew I didn't want him as manager any longer.

Like many others though, I decided to give him a chance this summer but he fed us a load of flannel about all these changes, whilst arrogantly just ploughing on in the same furrow.

There is no way back now.

For me, my arse collapsed watching St Mirren, Dundee and even Aberdeen & Hibs change manager and I felt we could’ve ended up in a worst position. For me, it was end of season and review. We stayed up and I felt like you, let’s see how it goes. He spent pre season saying the right things and making the right moves, before going back into his shell. 
 

There was signs for me that something could be salvaged in that Ayr first half but after that I’m not sure. I think he is stubborn to admit because he’s got such a big link to the club. Coming through the youth set up, retiring, assistant and now manager that he might not want to admit he’s not the man. 
 

His status as a legend is confirmed, but it’s going to be tainted heavily if we’ve another poor season. 

[SJFCtheTeamForMe]

Fair enough to take the positives but it does feel like it's reaching a bit to talk it up as a good performance. Yes the defense did alright defensively but there's a significant improvement required in possession and that includes those in the back 3. 

We just gift possession away. 

I do of course hope it's turned round but for me it would need to be an almost immediate turn around but I think he needs a miracle for that to happen. 

(Questioning my sanity for going tomorrow)

Edited August 5, 2022 by SJFCtheTeamForMe

[Valentino Bolognese]

I'm not going tomorrow and honestly I feel a bit guilty about it,  like not turning up to support the players is letting them down when for the most part I don't think any of this is their 'fault'. 

Particularly the new faces, who can't  be held accountable for the last year. In general I think that effort and commitment from the players hasn't been a major issue. If anything they'll be as frustrated as fan if they are being coached into playing shapes, roles and tactics they're not happy with. 

[double deluxe]

47 minutes ago, SJFCtheTeamForMe said:

Fair enough to take the positives but it does feel like it's reaching a bit to talk it up as a good performance. Yes the defense did alright defensively but there's a significant improvement required in possession and that includes those in the back 3. 

We just gift possession away. 

I do of course hope it's turned round but for me it would need to be an almost immediate turn around but I think he needs a miracle for that to happen. 

(Questioning my sanity for going tomorrow)

A midfield without Murray Davidson tomorrow certainly helps this.

[Kyle]

It’s a matter of when now, and it should’ve happened months ago. He spent last summer signing players short term to keep things ticking with a view to getting a move elsewhere IMO, but that didn’t materialise and won’t now given how poor the results and performances have been for a year. 
 

I sometimes wonder if he’s stubborn or if he just doesn’t know how to fix it. None of his cb options have particularly good distribution for example, but rather than changing the shape so we don’t need to rely on one of them moving into midfield when we possession, he plugs on with a shape that doesn’t suit the players. He signed 3 wingers in the summer, played one at wing back, one in central midfield and one up front last Saturday. 
 

The squad is a complete mess as well, we’ve been ‘1 or 2’ signings away from having a completed squad 6 signings ago. 

[PauloPerth]

I can’t remember the last time I considered not going to our first away match of a season. Nothing to do with chances of winning, just the manner we approach games.

I know id likely be coming home annoyed at the waste of time and wondering what the point was.

I like Davidson, a great player and legend. I was disappointed last summer we didn’t give ourselves more of a chance to kick on and even progress in Europe. We only needed a couple of quality attacking players. Surely we would have been more of a draw for Levitt for example with European football than Utd… imagine a midfield of McCann and Levitt.

But we survived, and ultimately I felt last season would be a massive learning curve, we’d re-evaluate and make the necessary changes and adapt. But, as mentioned by others, it’s the same shite. Negative tactics, no method or intent to attack, and consistently uninspiring signings.  There’s absolutely nothing about watching us that excites.

In the blink of an eye it looks like we’ve gone from one of the best provincial clubs in the country to the likes of Hamilton or Dundee where you kick around the bottom of the league for a few years until inevitably you eventually go down the plug hole.  Because I can’t see any other future  for us over the next couple of years.

The problem is, as long as we stay up, Davidson won’t be removed. The costs will be too prohibitive for the board. So we are stuck with this situation all of this season and next. 

The only way it could change would be if we lose all our opening matches and are adrift at the bottom.  
 

So here we are, second week of the season and it almost feels as though our best hope of having something to look forward to is wanting our team to lose.  What a shite position to have put ourselves in.

[Valentino Bolognese]

4 minutes ago, Kyle said:

The squad is a complete mess as well, we’ve been ‘1 or 2’ signings away from having a completed squad 6 signings ago. 

That's because we needed a keeper, defensive mid and at least one striker. We eventually got one of them. 

We're been '1 or 2' signings short for months because it's the same positions we're not signing. 

[jamamafegan]

My general feeling as we went into the second leg of the PO final was that if we won we’d have another season of utter shite to look forward to. However, the way we beat Inverness with such ease that night - it was emphatic and probably our best performance of the entire season. At that point there was a glimmer of hope that actually we maybe could put that season behind us and get back to competing in the top flight. Perhaps things wouldn’t be so bad. However the consequent signings and dreadful performances in the league cup confirmed that CD 100% needs to go. It was crucial that he got the new season off to a good start, the best way of doing that would have been to progress with relative ease from that group. The happy clappers amongst the Saints support are absolutely deluded for thinking that CD should be judged on the first few league results of the season, I’m not sure what they think that would achieve other than probably setting us back further. Do they think he will have found the magic formula to turn our form around or something? Maybe I’m being optimistic here but I think a defeat to Motherwell tomorrow could be the defining moment for the management regime. Our next games after that are Rangers (A), Aberdeen (H) and Hearts (A). As things stand I don’t see us taking anything from those games, if anything we could be in for a total shoeing.

[Stellaboz]

Forgive me for the blatant plug, but I've released the first episode of my podcast- East End Tales. 

Although it's obviously Dunfermline-heavy, our first episode is focused on our Scottish Cup 3rd round replay against St Johnstone back in 2001. Former Pars captain Scott Thomson comes on to talk about the game and the St Johnstone team at the time. 

Although it was a bad night for you, if you want to give a listen you can find it below, or on Spotify, Deezer etc: 

https://eastendtales.buzzsprout.com/

 

There's been a whole bunch of forgetful affairs between our two clubs, but we might come back to visit another game against St Johnstone in the future. 

Cheers and good luck for the season!

[Reignman]

47 minutes ago, Stellaboz said:

Forgive me for the blatant plug, but I've released the first episode of my podcast- East End Tales. 

Although it's obviously Dunfermline-heavy, our first episode is focused on our Scottish Cup 3rd round replay against St Johnstone back in 2001. Former Pars captain Scott Thomson comes on to talk about the game and the St Johnstone team at the time. 

Although it was a bad night for you, if you want to give a listen you can find it below, or on Spotify, Deezer etc: 

https://eastendtales.buzzsprout.com/

 

There's been a whole bunch of forgetful affairs between our two clubs, but we might come back to visit another game against St Johnstone in the future. 

Cheers and good luck for the season!

A memorable game for me as the game which taught me NEVER to gloat about a result before the final whistle goes.

I deservedly got it tight from my Pars supporting mates after a barrage of texts from me to them at half time. A harsh but valuable lesson.

[SJFCtheTeamForMe]

 

Someone's started a Twitter for him

 

[mizfit]

That fucking spelling is doing my tits in.

[PSJ.84]

2 minutes ago, mizfit said:

That fucking spelling is doing my tits in.

Thanks for pointing that out hadn’t actually noticed it. I was too busy being pedantic and getting wound up by him saying he’s the longest serving manager in the SPFL - which of course he is not. Of course I know the person means top in the flight, but I’m that guy…

[Dick Van Dyke]

First away game of the season! 

[SJFCtheTeamForMe]

27 minutes ago, Dick Van Dyke said:

First away game of the season! 

Wasn't even half full. 

Not sold many at all. Front few rows were closed.

[Theyellowbox]

Dunno why, but ive a feeling we are going to win tomorrow. Possibly being deluded, but there is a part of me that holds the view that maybe the experience we have brought in will allow the players to keep a level head and block out the doom and gloom around the place. A more distanced from the club and dare I say competent manager and coaching staff, would use the siege mentality meathod, but thats not really open to CD, but I do think he and the players will be more than aware of the fans position.

I think the club missed a trick by not mixing up the coaching staff if not the manager in the summer. It feels like if we were going to keep CD, we needed some freshness around him giving him alternatives.

While the signings have been pretty uninspiring and the performances and effort way off what is needed, I do agree to an extent with CD, that we are only a few players off a solution. Problem is that solution would require sizable funds spent on a proven striker and creative player(s) behind him. We cannot be signing any more 'project' 18-20 year olds or any 30+ players, we need peak of their game, proven performers and that costs.

The real tell of whether the club will give Davidson more time is whether they sanction these signings or whether he is restricted to players at either end of their careers.

[Kyle]

I don’t think the club have reduced Davidson to signing older and project players, seems like a conscious choice. Hes also spread the budget to 10 (I think when you include Sandford and Dailly) when he’s said he was after 5 or 6. 
 

He was incredibly well backed in January and will have been again IMO. I can’t see Considine and Wright being on less than Rooney and McCart for example.

Being honest I think we’re more than a couple away from being a decent side. We have a huge squad but there’s little quality, just plenty of numbers in most positions. The 5 main ones who left have all been replaced by downgrades (in terms of ability, IMO, if not cost) so think we realistically still have a lot of heavy lifting to do with the squad.

We could probably do with getting the dead wood out of the squad too. Pretty clear MOH isn’t going to feature much and that Gilmour is well below the standard required.