Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[The Saintee]

38 minutes ago, mizfit said:

The clubs silence is rather damning.

He's not getting sacked. 

No way will Brown allow him to spend money. Significant money for us, on transfers and contracts just to sack him. 

He'd have to pay off Callum and then risk another manager not rating or wanting Crawford and MacPherson.

He'll give Callum next season to bring us back up.

[RossBFaeDundee]

[johnoswald2712]

Something that is pretty unanimous is our transfer business has been shambolic. However everyone seems to be blaming the manager or the chairman. If they are to blame why are we employing a head of recruitment???  From the day they arrived it’s been obvious that Crawford and McPherson are nowhere near good enough but someone saw fit to give one a two and a half year contract and the other has signed a PCA. What exactly have they been watching the last 5 months?

I never subscribe to sacking managers at the drop of a hat . Just look at Dundee and to a lesser extent Hibs and Hearts to see how that works out. However the club needs gutted from top to bottom and now would appear to be the perfect time to start. 

[Meeniedee]

8 minutes ago, The Saintee said:

You'll be fine. Every other side in the league would've beaten them today.

i wouldn't be so sure..dundee were fucking awful today 

[buddie06smfc]

2 minutes ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

Wonderful to see. 

[Zamora Fan]

I know people have differing views on who’s to blame for our mess in terms of chairman, players etc etc but out of interest, is there anyone on here who still doesn’t think the manager should be sacked tonight? Even anyone who thinks he deserves the Dundee game? Genuinely interested to hear opposing views.

I’ve been patient with this manager and this squad but that’s it for me, today was pathetic. The two things that made me think there’s no coming back was the way every single sub and change he made today (from Kane and Ciftci off for May and Middleton all the way thro to the nonsense with taking off O’Halloran for Craig so we had a back 4 with Cleary at right back??) made us even worse than we were before it. Kelty not as good as I expected but they grew into the game because we worsened with every sub or tactical tweak, winner not a massive surprise when it came. They should have scored at least 2 more.

The second thing was how much the players mostly seemed to just chuck it. They aren’t playing for him anymore. Might be a squad with lots of absolute chancers but I think a different system and manager could get more out of them and I think they clearly know that too.

[The Saintee]

St Johnstone manager Callum Davidson: "The first half was really disappointing. I asked them to do certain things and for the first 30 or 40 minutes, they wouldn't do any of it. "

WTF is that?

[RandomGuy.]

3 minutes ago, Zamora Fan said:

the nonsense with taking off O’Halloran for Craig so we had a back 4 with Cleary at right back?

The BBC reported at the time MOH was injured, but I've no idea how true that is.

I'm still convinced we were man down in extra time, genuinely felt like we'd forgotten to sub someone on after taking them off.

[Welly boy]

57 minutes ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

Walk of shame... Hopefully CD gets a hold of this and plays it to the players on a loop before the dundee game then they come out the tunnel like fkn gladiators ready to ram it right up those fans with a stunning 3 nil win..

Edited January 22, 2022 by Welly boy

[Widge]

4 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

The BBC reported at the time MOH was injured, but I've no idea how true that is.

I'm still convinced we were man down in extra time, genuinely felt like we'd forgotten to sub someone on after taking them off.

Aye O’Halloran went off injured, or at least the massive limp he had suggested so, maybe he just wanted off the pitch!

[Fife Saint]

At least Zander had a shred of dignity and barked back, good on him. 

[Theyellowbox]

3 minutes ago, Zamora Fan said:

I know people have differing views on who’s to blame for our mess in terms of chairman, players etc etc but out of interest, is there anyone on here who still doesn’t think the manager should be sacked tonight? Even anyone who thinks he deserves the Dundee game? Genuinely interested to hear opposing views.

I’ve been patient with this manager and this squad but that’s it for me, today was pathetic. The two things that made me think there’s no coming back was the way every single sub and change he made today (from Kane and Ciftci off for May and Middleton all the way thro to the nonsense with taking off O’Halloran for Craig so we had a back 4 with Cleary at right back??) made us even worse than we were before it. Kelty not as good as I expected but they grew into the game because we worsened with every sub or tactical tweak, winner not a massive surprise when it came. They should have scored at least 2 more.

The second thing was how much the players mostly seemed to just chuck it. They aren’t playing for him anymore. Might be a squad with lots of absolute chancers but I think a different system and manager could get more out of them and I think they clearly know that too.

While I think Davidson has run out of road, it's not entirely impossible that with a couple of bodies in before the Dundee game that we win that game, which would put us within a point of them and out of the 4 games that follow, only Aberdeen away looks like one that you would probably write off getting something from. Although that would be being wildly optimistic and counter to how we have been performing.

For all that the scenes at the end look pretty ugly, you could argue that it could be used as a bit of a tool to unite the players. Obviously you don't want the players to have a siege mentality vs the clubs own fans, but if CD was clever, he would use it. Either the siege mentality approach or as a rocket up the players.

However, having said all of that, I hold out zero hope that CD will do the right things. 

[big al]

No surprise in this result. St J are a busted flush, just like Accies last season. 
Luck with signings can only last so long. Such a small home support means eventually tough times will come. And let’s be honest any team who gambles with stevie May up front is going to falter soon enough, an absolute charlatan. 
 

[Fife Saint]

It's abundantly clear the players aren't buying in to CD at all now. Hard to blame them.

[saint pogo]

2 hours ago, billyg said:

Story down here is that you have signed McPherson on a PCA  but St Mirren are looking for money if he joins up this window , so we've recalled him , strange situation !

Unless he was getting recalled anyway due to the relegation battle that’s pretty shitey by Goodwin. 
Pure comedy handling by St. Johnstone though

[tree house tam]

I've now seen three different videos of the scenes at the end, from all angles. I don't think it does any good tbh and this is from someone who has done worse to luggy at Stenhousemuir. 

As for sacking Callum, aye I'd do it but he probably does deserve till at least after the window. He now has the defenders signed he wants, let's see if he changes from the system that the current players can only play.

[McG]

54 minutes ago, RossBFaeDundee said:

Tragic.

 

[RandomGuy.]

20 minutes ago, tree house tam said:

He now has the defenders signed he wants, let's see if he changes from the system that the current players can only play.

You're surely not claiming we're only playing a back 3 because thats the only shape the CBs can play?

McCart made his name at ICT in a back four and regularly played well there under TW. Gordon has played well in a back four too.

If they're now unable to play a back four then its become the manager has drilled them completely into the back three shape. Its not realistic for us to have to sign a whole new backline every time he wants to change our shape.

Edited January 22, 2022 by RandomGuy.

[mizfit]

[Jamie_B]

The players should never have been put in the position of having to walk through the fans at full time. I found it quite uncomfortable to be part of and I've no doubt some people went over the score - but I think people have a right to be angry at this stage.

We should have won in 90 minutes today. Kelty offered very little going forward and as the Premiership team we should have taken advantage of that. The big issue, however, is that we are so, so lacking going forward that we never took advantage and for huge, huge spells, didn't look like doing so. Against a League Two side. Inevitably, we made an error and were punished.

The biggest concern was the absolute lack of a reaction to conceding. Only right at the very death did we force a chance, which, to be fair, we should have taken. We didn't, which pretty much sums it up for us just now.

Today was entirely on the manager. This morning we read about not being wed to the system and playing the way that suits the players. Then we play the same shape again. There is a giant vortex in the centre of the park where we are so lightweight it is unreal - lacking in ability and fight. Our system relies on the wing backs having someone inside them to play with - be it a centre back coming forward or a central midfielder providing an option. Neither of those exist just now. But still we persist. The team selection is baffling. Midweek we played MOH at RWB - an attacking player at wing back against one of the better teams in the Premiership. Today we played James Brown - a player of very limited attacking quality - against a team that blew a two goal lead against Edinburgh City last week. It was apparent very, very early on that down the right was where we were going to get most of the space and time - but we persisted with Brown right to the end of the 90. We persisted in playing to him as if he was Shaun Rooney - a player with the physical attributes and attacking ability/intent to take the kind of balls that were fired at Brown today. When he did get the ball under control there was nobody ahead of him, nobody making a run, nobody offering a pass inside. It was tragic.

Coming back to the middle of midfield - Davidson has signed three central midfielders. Crawford, Macpherson on a PCA and Butterfield. None of the three are good enough and it is so, so worrying, that Davidson appears to believe these players are the answer. I dread to think what the question is. We were obviously hampered at the end with MOH going off injured but sticking Cleary out wide was ridiculous. We'd have been better served putting Middleton out there and Craig on the left.

The substitutions are just as bad - Ciftci off when we need a goal. Really? The only player with a spark that can make things happen by himself. Then once we removed him and Kane that's the point we start trying to put crosses into the box.

I've held off and held off, but I think Davidson has to step aside at this point. I don't want him signing any more players and I don't want him picking the team against Dundee midweek. There is no hint at all that he's learned from the repeated defeats caused by the obvious issues and deficiencies in our team just now. Even more worrying, there's been a gaping hole in the middle of the park since August that has been staring us in the face. We should have had players identified to come in on January 1. They haven't materialised - unless Davidson thinks MacPherson and Crawford are those players, in which place God help us. The other signings are the right kind of profile - young, a bit of talent, something to prove. Will they improve us enough to get over the line this season? Time will tell but the signs right now aren't promising.

Dundee on Wednesday is the biggest match of this season by a mile. We can't afford to lose it. Another defeat will surely end it for Davidson but is it a week too far already?