Double Winning St Johnstone FC Thread

[Valentino Bolognese]

3 minutes ago, Mr Heliums said:

How is he reneging, unless you're suggesting we never bid six-figure sums for two Championship players, or repeatedly bid for Forrest? As Random says, we've also wasted a lengthy contract on Crawford, and Cleary and Gallagher didn't come cheap. What other clubs in relegation trouble are trying to spend like we are? It's ludicrous to talk about reneging, but as usual the chairman is a target that's easy to aim at, when that's all you see.

Other clubs know we're desperate, which is why we keep getting knocked back. And I suspect players are hesitant too. There is the question of value, which I think is the point Davidson is making.

The point he can't make is that having seen the quality available and the price being asked for it, we're reaching the stage where it might be best to keep some money back in case we need it for a promotion bid.

I'd think that in terms relative to other clubs in this division, Cleary and Gallacher probably are relatively cheap. 

I don't think he's renaged, just think it's media management. They may have eventually realised that shouting from the back pages that we've got piles of cash that we're willing to spend and we're desperate for players in a relegation fight might be a pretty silly idea. Suspect Callum might have been briefed to try to do some belated damage limitation. 

[Dick Van Dyke]

We’re keen Callum Hendry isnt cup tied ahead of a possible January recall, which is daft considering he doesn’t fit into cautious cals ‘system’ and we’ll be out of the cup on Saturday anyway 

[Mr Heliums]

6 minutes ago, Valentino Bolognese said:

I don't think he's renaged, just think it's media management. They may have eventually realised that shouting from the back pages that we've got piles of cash that we're willing to spend and we're desperate for players in a relegation fight might be a pretty silly idea. 

Maybe. But if it was shouted from the back pages it was to calm those fans complaining that the board hadn't already spent the money we received in the last day of the August transfer window. 

[Valentino Bolognese]

1 minute ago, Mr Heliums said:

Maybe. But if it was shouted from the back pages it was to calm those fans complaining that the board hadn't already spent the money we received in the last day of the August transfer window. 

Oh I agree and it made sense at the time, but we probably didn't expect to be in this position back then. 

[Radford]

"It's about bringing in somebody to be better and to make a difference. There's no point just bringing in a squad player."

He's made this point several times, which is fine, but it's going to be VERY interesting if we get a week down the line and are still short, with options dried up. 

That's the twilight zone that Tommy Wright used to end up in when all you have left is the list of young English loans offered to everyone in the last days of the window. 

May as well just be patient now and judge the outcome on 31 January but you'd be a brave person to predict it's going to be a massive success. 

[mizfit]

"It's about bringing in somebody to be better and to make a difference. There's no point just bringing in a squad player."
He's made this point several times, which is fine, but it's going to be VERY interesting if we get a week down the line and are still short, with options dried up. 
That's the twilight zone that Tommy Wright used to end up in when all you have left is the list of young English loans offered to everyone in the last days of the window. 
May as well just be patient now and judge the outcome on 31 January but you'd be a brave person to predict it's going to be a massive success. 

Aye, this is where my thought is. We’re dangerously close to panic buying territory and need to avoid that if possible.

I now however look forward to 4 loan signings from Millwall, Celtic and Newcastle United.

[PauloPerth]

46 minutes ago, Valentino Bolognese said:

 

I don't think he's renaged, just think it's media management. They may have eventually realised that shouting from the back pages that we've got piles of cash that we're willing to spend and we're desperate for players in a relegation fight might be a pretty silly idea. Suspect Callum might have been briefed to try to do some belated damage limitation. 

This is exactly what it is. Should generally.  not take what a manager says in the media too literally.

We’re in this situation no club ever wants to be in.  Desperate for players at a critical time, with agents and selling clubs fully aware. The later into January and the more players we miss out on, the more that intensifies. 

We go 15-20 years or whatever not paying a fee for a player yet bring in some great players, now all of a sudden we’re offering close to six figure sums for jobbers with 5 months left on their contract.

Fully understand it, and glad we’re trying to do something. The worst case scenario is that we spend loads of money and squander the fees we brought in yet still get relegated.

 

[tree house tam]

We need quality players in and we need them in now, its desperation caused by short sightedness in the summer. Double winners with European football to play was exactly the time to get players in, a quality CM and Striker would've been chomping at the bit to get in. 6M euros later and we're laughing. 

Instead we had caution, then stupidity and are now looking down the barrel of relegation and the loss of millions. THAT'S ON YOU Stevie Broon, THAT'S ON YOU.

[akuram]

We need quality players in and we need them in now, its desperation caused by short sightedness in the summer. Double winners with European football to play was exactly the time to get players in, a quality CM and Striker would've been chomping at the bit to get in. 6M euros later and we're laughing. 
Instead we had caution, then stupidity and are now looking down the barrel of relegation and the loss of millions. THAT'S ON YOU Stevie Broon, THAT'S ON YOU.

Pretty much spot on.

[The Marly]

10 hours ago, mizfit said:

From the same article -

“In terms of transfers, Davidson confirmed the club are still trying to get some deals over the line.

He added: “People know we’ve got funds to spend but it’s difficult because it’s about getting the right balance between what the signings are worth and what you think they’ll bring to the team.

“Agents can give you players who aren’t quite up to speed or available when you think they are.

“We’re not really a club that are flushed with cash either but it’s not just me, there are other clubs and managers going through the same thing.””

Sorry, but the chairman’s been talking about the money in the bank, and the income from the summer sales. Either the chairman’s reneged on the significant funds, or he never planned to give us them.

Sorry,  how does "people know we have funds to spend " translate into "the chairman's reneged on the significant funds" ?

[double deluxe]

1 hour ago, mizfit said:

Aye, this is where my thought is. We’re dangerously close to panic buying territory and need to avoid that if possible.

I now however look forward to 4 loan signings from Millwall, Celtic and Newcastle United.

Another Mehdi Abeid would be very welcomed.

[RandomGuy.]

1 minute ago, double deluxe said:

Another Mehdi Abeid would be very welcomed.

[Mr Heliums]

1 hour ago, tree house tam said:

 its desperation caused by short sightedness in the summer. Double winners with European football to play was exactly the time to get players in, a quality CM and Striker would've been chomping at the bit to get in. 6M euros later and we're laughing. 

Instead we had caution, then stupidity and are now looking down the barrel of relegation and the loss of millions. THAT'S ON YOU Stevie Broon, THAT'S ON YOU.

You're ignoring two things:

1. the context of last season and last summer: no immediate prospect of the return of fans, our biggest reported loss for years (and yet through the pandemic our board hadn't panicked like some - eg no 50% wage cuts). I couldn't blame the board if they were being cautious.
2. you don't provide evidence that the board actually limited signings. Instead it's assumed in great big capital letters. We've literally had fans on here today claiming that Steve Brown isn't providing funds, despite incontrovertible evidence otherwise. It seems that some will find any reason to point the finger at our chairman.

Looking back, it's easy to say we should have developed the squad last summer. We can all see that. But we benefit from both hindsight and the fantasy that Davidson would have spent the funds wisely. 

Edited January 21, 2022 by Mr Heliums

[Kyle]

 

 

[RandomGuy.]

Just now, Kyle said:

 

 

That's not Mehdi.

[Valentino Bolognese]

11 minutes ago, Mr Heliums said:

You're ignoring two things:

1. the context of last season and last summer: no immediate prospect of the return of fans, our biggest reported loss for years (and yet through the pandemic our board hadn't panicked like some - eg no 50% wage cuts). I couldn't blame the board if they were being cautious.
2. you don't provide evidence that the board actually limited signings. Instead it's assumed in great big capital letters. We've literally had fans on here today claiming that Steve Brown isn't providing funds, despite incontrovertible evidence otherwise. It seems that some will find any reason to point the finger at our chairman.

Looking back, it's easy to say we should have developed the squad last summer. We can all see that. But we benefit from both hindsight and the fantasy that Davidson would have spent the funds wisely. 

1. The point is that we had a huge relative commercial advantage as literally every single football team in Europe except the mega-funded operators had the same set of issues. It was exactly the time to use that advantage. Be greedy when others are fearful. Out chairman is used to operating in very risk-averse way, which 90% of the time is exactly correct as football does seem to punish the reckless. However when the circumstances change you have to change strategy. 

2. Every fan that I know of was saying this back in the summer. This is not 20/20 hindsight. 

I have no idea if the club are holding back funds or not, but to be clear this is not something that's come out of nowhere. 

Your point about whether Davidson could have been trusted with funds is a very good one, but again that's the risk aversion coming through. A highly experienced guy who had just won the cup double should have been given the benefit of the doubt IMO. Would probably have gone pear-shaped and we'd have a team of Ali Crawfords on 4 year contracts but still, at least we'd have given it a go.

[tree house tam]

19 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

That's not Mehdi.

Bit if you squint your eyes it's a  cross between david Turnbull and Giovanni van Bronkhorst.

[RandomGuy.]

Just now, tree house tam said:

Bit if you squint your eyes it's a  cross between david Turnbull and Giovanni van Bronkhorst.

Rather have Mehdi tbh.

[tree house tam]

8 minutes ago, RandomGuy. said:

Rather have Mehdi tbh.

Wouldn't we all but he's playing against camel herders for millions.

[steviemay17]

Interesting with the Mahon signing as he appears to be a right footed CB. Surely this means McCart is off now if we're paying over 100k for a player who might not be a starter if McCart-Gordon- Cleary are all fit, so it makes no sense otherwise