Boxing Thread

[kiddy]

Wilder/Fury III highlights.

[Detournement]

11 hours ago, kiddy said:

Changed tactics,  They didn't even last into round two!

Aye it puts some context on the situation when the commentators are praising the ex champ in his 40th odd fight for using a jab. And the jab in question involves lunging forward. 

[sergie's no1 fan]

8 minutes ago, Detournement said:

Aye it puts some context on the situation when the commentators are praising the ex champ in his 40th odd fight for using a jab. And the jab in question involves lunging forward. 

Having wanted Fury to win I was a tad concerned nearing the end of the first round, I think Tysons shot on him right at the end of the first round changed the fight in his favour as Wilder lost the plot a bit and never used his jab again.

[Shandon Par]

That jab to the body and overhand to the right worked well for the 150 seconds or so he used it. Find it hard to be too harsh on Wilder. To make to the 11th round after the state of him early on was incredible. Fury is a better boxer and much bigger guy. He has Wilder’s number whether Wilder accepts it or not. If he doesn’t retire then Wilder vs any of the other top heavyweights still makes for an exciting clash. 
 

Really don’t see how Fury can fail be to regarded as an all-time great. The guy is a monster physically, appears to be immune to getting sparked and can box. Gives anyone from any era problems. 
 

 

[Bairnardo]

That jab to the body and overhand to the right worked well for the 150 seconds or so he used it. Find it hard to be too harsh on Wilder. To make to the 11th round after the state of him early on was incredible. Fury is a better boxer and much bigger guy. He has Wilder’s number whether Wilder accepts it or not. If he doesn’t retire then Wilder vs any of the other top heavyweights still makes for an exciting clash. 
 
Really don’t see how Fury can fail be to regarded as an all-time great. The guy is a monster physically, appears to be immune to getting sparked and can box. Gives anyone from any era problems. 
 
 

Wilder should be going all out for AJ. He sparks AJ early doors IMO.

As for Fury being ATG, I dont have a huge problem with the assertion that he gives anyone problems, but the weakness of the era, and of his CV makes it a real difficult argument to make IMO. All of these things are always highly subjective of course, but if you plonk Fury into the era of (as we already discussed so may aswell use it here) Lennox Lewis, then Fury probably has at least 3 or 4 losses on his record, perhaps more for me.

Put him him among the times of Wlads run post Brewster, and he certainly gets more of a chance to prove himself, but probably loses to either Klitschko during that time for me. At least once anyway.... Vitali was a fucking brute then

All IMO obviously

[J_Stewart]

20 hours ago, Bairnardo said:

Wilder should be going all out for AJ. He sparks AJ early doors IMO.

As for Fury being ATG, I dont have a huge problem with the assertion that he gives anyone problems, but the weakness of the era, and of his CV makes it a real difficult argument to make IMO. All of these things are always highly subjective of course, but if you plonk Fury into the era of (as we already discussed so may aswell use it here) Lennox Lewis, then Fury probably has at least 3 or 4 losses on his record, perhaps more for me.

Put him him among the times of Wlads run post Brewster, and he certainly gets more of a chance to prove himself, but probably loses to either Klitschko during that time for me. At least once anyway.... Vitali was a fucking brute then

All IMO obviously

Based on what exactly? What are the weaknesses you see in Fury's game that those fighters could exploit that no one has been able to so far?

I know nostalgia does funny things to the mind, but who exactly is beating him? Who of the 90s heavyweights was a bigger puncher than Wilder, who couldn't keep him down even after lading absolutely flush? Who had better footwork, jab, straight right and measure of distance than prime Wlad? Who had footwork good enough to get inside Fury's jab? Who, if they got inside, had the physical strength to push back the 6 foot 9, 270 pound man and bully him on the inside? Tyson? No. Foreman? No. Holyfield? No. The Dillian Whyte's / Joseph Parkers of the 90s you listed above (Grant, Tua, Morrison, Ruddock, Mercer, Tucker, Golota)? No. To be honest, I'd back Fury to beat Lewis 9 times out of 10.

Lewis was a fantastic boxer, but he was generally the bigger man in his era, and used his skill and size advantages to dominate. Being that he's four inches shorter than Fury, had a shorter reach, wasn't as quick on his feet, and had slower hand speed, I don't really see where the argument can possibly be made that Fury a) wouldn't have been favourite if the two ever fought, and b) wouldn't have dominated his (or any) era too.

Boxing is one of the very few sports where recency bias doesn't exist. Nostalgia and 'legend' always seem to take precedence. 

[Bairnardo]

1 minute ago, J_Stewart said:

Based on what exactly? What are the weaknesses you see in Fury's game that those fighters could exploit that no one has been able to so far?

I know nostalgia does funny things to the mind, but who exactly is beating him? Who of the 90s heavyweights was a bigger puncher than Wilder, who couldn't keep him down even after lading absolutely flush? Who had better footwork, jab, straight right and measure of distance than prime Wlad? Who had footwork good enough to get inside Fury's jab? Who, if they got inside, had the physical strength to push back the 6 foot 9, 270 pound man and bully him on the inside? Tyson? No. Foreman? No. Holyfield? No. The Dillian Whyte's / Joseph Parkers of the 90s you listed above (Grant, Tua, Morrison, Ruddock, Mercer, Tucker, Golota)? No. To be honest, I'd back Fury to beat Lewis 9 times out of 10.

Lewis was a fantastic boxer, but he was generally the bigger man in his era, and used his skill and size advantages to dominate. Being that he's four inches shorter than Fury, had a shorter reach, wasn't as quick on his feet, and had slower hand speed, I don't really see where the argument can possibly be made that Fury a) wouldn't have been favourite if the two ever fought, and b) wouldn't have dominated his (or any) era too.

Boxing is one of the very few sports where recency bias doesn't exist. Nostalgia and 'legend' always seem to take precedence. 

Its definitely true that nostalgia usually takes precedence in boxing. But it tends to kick in pretty quick, like immediately post retirement. Certainly in the case of Lennox he never really got his props till he was gone. You even see it with Floyd tbh. 

But these guys you mentioned as being the Whytes/Parkers of the era, surely you arent telling me you believe that Dillian Whyte or Joe Parker is better than Tommy Morrison or Razor Ruddock?? 

 

Iv seen enough utterly shite performances from Tyson Fury over the years to arrive at the conclusion that he loses fights in an era of better fighters than he has lived in. He has been consistent in outboxing Wilder 3 times for 2 KO wins and a bit of a nonsense draw, however Wilder is, in boxing terms, extremely limited. We all know that. The guy cant box. Killers like him dont often get to the top of the game on that alone otherwise more folk would be talking about Earnie Shavers or Julian Jackson. 

At the end of the day, Fury has done great to cement himself at the top of the pile and I think (and hope) he bodies AJ too. He is the best of this era except for Usyk who is very likely too small to even have a chance. 

But we will have to agree to disagree on the LL stuff because I think Furys ledger is way, way too weak to be mentioned in the same breath and that just leaves the eye test/whether you think he troubles the heavies of the 80s and 90s. And on some nights of course he does, but for me you cant outbox Deontay Wilder then assume you can not only hang with but dominate a stronger era and an ATG in Lewis

[Shandon Par]

I think we also need to put in context that Usyk is bigger than a prime George Foreman. Wilder has dumped Fury on his arse a number of times despite folk slating his ability all the time. This crop at the top just now is a seriously dangerous bunch. Tony Bellew was calling out Wilder then when he actually met him called his manager to say “you can fookin fight him if you want”. Wilder has the losses now but he has also dropped every single person he has faced. 
 

Fury was probably only fit enough to do what was needed against Wilder. Scary to think he has a few extra gears. 
 

[Shandon Par]

7 minutes ago, Bairnardo said:

seen enough utterly shite performances from Tyson Fury over the years to arrive at the conclusion that he loses fights in an era of better fighters than he has lived in.

Pretty sure he rises/sinks to the level of opponent. The Tom Schwartz fight is the only recent one I can think of where he has gone in to smash someone to bits who is was below his level. That one seems to get overlooked when folk were so surprised about the Wilder 2 performance.

[Fuctifano]

 

Benny Lynch vs Peter Kane at Shawfield from 84 years ago today for World flyweight title . Fair to say refereeing was different back then. 

[kiddy]

Wilder hit with a six month medical suspension. Not very handy at his age.

[Ludo*1]

No idea how they worked it out, but the commentators for the fight said that statistically, Wilder has a harder punch than pretty much anyone and it was based on force rather than something skewed like KO %.

Maybe just fluff for the fight but an interesting comment when talk about this era compared to the past.

[GiGi]

10 hours ago, kiddy said:

Wilder hit with a six month medical suspension. Not very handy at his age.

Makes no difference really, be lucky if you get the top heavyweights fighting more than once a year anyway.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

 

[Shandon Par]

Malik Scott seems like a very decent lad and has clearly put Wilder straight and told him to congratulate Fury after snubbing him in the ring.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

I think we also need to put in context that Usyk is bigger than a prime George Foreman. Wilder has dumped Fury on his arse a number of times despite folk slating his ability all the time. This crop at the top just now is a seriously dangerous bunch. Tony Bellew was calling out Wilder then when he actually met him called his manager to say “you can fookin fight him if you want”. Wilder has the losses now but he has also dropped every single person he has faced. 
 
Fury was probably only fit enough to do what was needed against Wilder. Scary to think he has a few extra gears. 
 

I think this is what people miss - Fury was in no way as fit as he should be but still won that fairly easily. He's a 6ft 9inch monster who fights with the speed of someone 9 inches shorter - add on that he can take a punch - and by god Wilder has had him down 3 times now - it's a scary thought what he could do if fully fit.

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

3 hours ago, Peter Grant said:

Malik Scott seems like a very decent lad and has clearly put Wilder straight and told him to congratulate Fury after snubbing him in the ring.

About time.

[Bairnardo]

Hammer trying to drag this into the rough stuff. If Hughie had an uppercut, I think wed see him have joy with it here

[Bairnardo]

Right on cue here come the uppercuts now

[John Lambies Doos]

Dreadful fight.
Fury 6ft 6 my arse[emoji1787][emoji1787][emoji1787]