Boxing Thread

[Ya Bezzer!]

21 hours ago, AUFC90 said:

Larry Holmes was done.

Larry Holmes was past his best but I don't think he was 'done'.

Holmes fought 24 times after the Tyson fight and no one else KOed him.  Not Holyfield, not McCall, not Mercer, not Nielsen. 

Overall Holmes had 75 professional fights and the Tyson fight was the only one he lost that wasn't a decision.

I happen to think Tyson is over rated as a fighter but the Holmes win shouldn't be dismissed.  It was Tyson's greatest achievement in the ring, he never fought and beat any else on the same level as Holmes, even if it wasn't prime Holmes.

[quickoverayard]

Considering I reckon Wilder would knock Joshua out I've no idea what you base that on.  Fury will simply beat Joshua up for as long as the fight lasts, similar to Saturday night.  He's just too good.

So now Fury beats people up... apart from Wilder and Chisora I can’t honestly think of anyone Fury has beat up. Fantastic win for Fury but I think the fight against AJ will be a lot lot harder.

His game plan was a thing of beauty and he executed it to perfection but I’m sorry he doesn’t bully AJ like that, he’s physically too strong to let fury ruff him up.

Everyone is looking at Fury as a messiah but until he beats AJ he can’t be considered the best of his era, if he beats him yes imo he’s the best out there but until he does he’s no better.

[Bairnardo]

So now Fury beats people up... apart from Wilder and Chisora I can’t honestly think of anyone Fury has beat up. Fantastic win for Fury but I think the fight against AJ will be a lot lot harder.

His game plan was a thing of beauty and he executed it to perfection but I’m sorry he doesn’t bully AJ like that, he’s physically too strong to let fury ruff him up.

Everyone is looking at Fury as a messiah but until he beats AJ he can’t be considered the best of his era, if he beats him yes imo he’s the best out there but until he does he’s no better.

Cant be considered the best of his era until he beats AJ? I'd contend that Furys win over Klit back then was far bigger and better than ANY win Fury can now acheive over AJ. If you add in the two performances against Wilder then you have a guy who has a far better shout than AJ to be best of the crop.

[diamond_for_life]

Ive noticed no one seems to want to give both Fury and AJ credit it’s like you have to be in the camp of one or the other. 
 

Fury has to be considered to the best heavyweight of his generation bar none. His win the other night was a great watch and he destroyed potentially the biggest threat to his crown he will ever face. 
 

As for AJ though fair fucks to him for the way he came back. People can make all the excuses they want for the shape of Ruiz in the rematch but AJ deserves respect for that. I don’t think he has “ducked” anyone as to be honest other  Fury and Wilder there’s no one else out there that wouldn’t have people saying is an easy option. 
 

If Fury and AJ fight it will be one of the biggest domestic heavyweight bouts the UK will ever see I just hope it isn’t somewhere like Saudi. I think Joshua is probably the second best heavyweight right now and a far far better boxer than Wilder. The issues for me are I don’t think he is as good a boxer as Fury and I also think his chin looks vulnerable and Fury will land on him. For me Fury wins it they fight but I still think both guys deserve credit for varying reasons. 

[quickoverayard]

Cant be considered the best of his era until he beats AJ? I'd contend that Furys win over Klit back then was far bigger and better than ANY win Fury can now acheive over AJ. If you add in the two performances against Wilder then you have a guy who has a far better shout than AJ to be best of the crop.

I understand where you’re coming from but ultimately until he is undisputed he can’t officially be number 1....number 1 will be the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and like I said until AJ or Fury are that then neither can lay claim. Yes AJ has been beat but so were all the greats and Ali is considered by many as the greatest of all time, he’s suffered loses but fought the best, so it’s inevitable that heavyweights will suffer a loss if you have competitive fights.

Going to throw Whyte into the mix as he’s WBC mandatory in 2021..... he won’t beat either but a possibility

[LargsTON]

55 minutes ago, quickoverayard said:

So now Fury beats people up... apart from Wilder and Chisora I can’t honestly think of anyone Fury has beat up. Fantastic win for Fury but I think the fight against AJ will be a lot lot harder.

His game plan was a thing of beauty and he executed it to perfection but I’m sorry he doesn’t bully AJ like that, he’s physically too strong to let fury ruff him up.
 

He's never been the type of fighter to chase the knockout as he's never really had to in the past.   Nobody can live with him in terms of his boxing brain or ring IQ so he's simply boxed his way to most victories.

I'm not convinced he can't ragdoll Joshua too.   If he applies pressure the way he did against Wilder I dont think the fight will even reach the halfway point.  

Usyk for me is the potential fly in the ointment but again he may just be a bit too small.

I just hope the fight can be made with AJ and ideally in the UK.  Vegas would be fine too, anywhere but Saudi really.

[Bairnardo]

5 minutes ago, quickoverayard said:

I understand where you’re coming from but ultimately until he is undisputed he can’t officially be number 1....number 1 will be the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and like I said until AJ or Fury are that then neither can lay claim. Yes AJ has been beat but so were all the greats and Ali is considered by many as the greatest of all time, he’s suffered loses but fought the best, so it’s inevitable that heavyweights will suffer a loss if you have competitive fights.

Going to throw Whyte into the mix as he’s WBC mandatory in 2021..... he won’t beat either but a possibility

Yeah. I suppose it depends on the stock you put in the varying terms like undisputed, lineal, best of the era etc etc. Ultimately, Fury does lack big wins in his career, but his biggest ones are better than AJ or Wilders. Fury has pretty much put Wilder out of the picture and it's now between him or AJ to finish top of the pile out of the three of them. I do think we need to see it though, and Fury after large chunks of mediocrity in his career has an opportunity to finish really strong and put his name in the history books. If he beats AJ, maybe a couple of times, he will probably be a first ballot hall of famer and retire as the king of the most exciting heavyweight spell in years. If AJ can topple Fury and Wilder gets some time to build back up then theres potentially even more excitement down the line. 

 

FWIW I dont subscribe to a loss in boxing finishing you or devaluing your career. Unfortunately, fighters promoters and fans do seem to. And the manner of a loss can increase a fighter fragility disproportionately. Both Wilders and AJs losses have that look about them even though avenged in AJs case. I'd still expect opponents of each to get after them more than previously thanks to the efforts of Ruiz and Fury

[AUFC90]

I understand where you’re coming from but ultimately until he is undisputed he can’t officially be number 1....number 1 will be the undisputed heavyweight champion of the world and like I said until AJ or Fury are that then neither can lay claim. Yes AJ has been beat but so were all the greats and Ali is considered by many as the greatest of all time, he’s suffered loses but fought the best, so it’s inevitable that heavyweights will suffer a loss if you have competitive fights.

 

Going to throw Whyte into the mix as he’s WBC mandatory in 2021..... he won’t beat either but a possibility

Fury has already had all the belts. AJ never will.

 

[quickoverayard]

Yeah. I suppose it depends on the stock you put in the varying terms like undisputed, lineal, best of the era etc etc. Ultimately, Fury does lack big wins in his career, but his biggest ones are better than AJ or Wilders. Fury has pretty much put Wilder out of the picture and it's now between him or AJ to finish top of the pile out of the three of them. I do think we need to see it though, and Fury after large chunks of mediocrity in his career has an opportunity to finish really strong and put his name in the history books. If he beats AJ, maybe a couple of times, he will probably be a first ballot hall of famer and retire as the king of the most exciting heavyweight spell in years. If AJ can topple Fury and Wilder gets some time to build back up then theres potentially even more excitement down the line. 
 
FWIW I dont subscribe to a loss in boxing finishing you or devaluing your career. Unfortunately, fighters promoters and fans do seem to. And the manner of a loss can increase a fighter fragility disproportionately. Both Wilders and AJs losses have that look about them even though avenged in AJs case. I'd still expect opponents of each to get after them more than previously thanks to the efforts of Ruiz and Fury

If fury beats AJ then I will agree he is the best of his era and arguably Britain’s best ever fighter, I like many people just hope we see it.

I just don’t get how people can totally discard AJ as inferior, he’ll put a better showing up than wilder, his faults were amplified 10 fold in the last fight. I just think that if fury approaches the fight like Saturday against AJ he’s in for a long night as AJ is far more athletic and physically stronger.

[dundeefc1783]

If fury beats AJ then I will agree he is the best of his era and arguably Britain’s best ever fighter, I like many people just hope we see it.

I just don’t get how people can totally discard AJ as inferior, he’ll put a better showing up than wilder, his faults were amplified 10 fold in the last fight. I just think that if fury approaches the fight like Saturday against AJ he’s in for a long night as AJ is far more athletic and physically stronger.

Could AJ cope with that level of intensity for 7/8 rounds though. He has previously has issues with stamina

[AUFC90]

If fury beats AJ then I will agree he is the best of his era and arguably Britain’s best ever fighter, I like many people just hope we see it.

I just don’t get how people can totally discard AJ as inferior, he’ll put a better showing up than wilder, his faults were amplified 10 fold in the last fight. I just think that if fury approaches the fight like Saturday against AJ he’s in for a long night as AJ is far more athletic and physically stronger.

In what way is he more athletic and physically stronger ? Fury is totally at home going twelve rounds all the time, Joshua barely makes 6 without gassing and that's without punching air constantly which he'll have to get used to fighting Fury.

[Detournement]

If you have the attitude that we don't need to see AJ Vs Fury because one fighter definitely wins rather than we HAVE to see them fight then you're a fanboy rather than a boxing fan. 

[LargsTON]

John Fury stating today that he wants Tyson to retire now.   That'd be a crying shame.  

[JamieStevenson]

This is all fantasy anyway. Wilder and Fury will rematch. AJ will fight Pulev, then Whyte.

[LargsTON]

That's the rematch clause being activated.  Wilder has sacked his corner man that threw the towel and is blaming his outfit for weakening his legs.  Jesus wept.  It was being battered from pillar to post and leaned on by a 19 stone giant that did that, D.

[Merkie84]

He is blaming the loss on his costume being too heavy

For someone who said “ no excuses”, how many excuses is that now for the loss?

[ayrmad]

1 hour ago, LargsTON said:

That's the rematch clause being activated.  Wilder has sacked his corner man that threw the towel and is blaming his outfit for weakening his legs.  Jesus wept.  It was being battered from pillar to post and leaned on by a 19 stone giant that did that, D.

Wasn't a bad boxer in his day. 

[Shandon Par]

9 hours ago, LargsTON said:

That's the rematch clause being activated.  Wilder has sacked his corner man that threw the towel and is blaming his outfit for weakening his legs.  Jesus wept.  It was being battered from pillar to post and leaned on by a 19 stone giant that did that, D.

With all the Kronk chat about Fury's new trainer it was never really mentioned that Wilder had Brealand, a Kronk world champion, on his team for years. Brealand always moaned that Wilder never listened to him though and refused to do basic stuff to try and make his life easier and maybe win a few rounds. 

[gkneil]

Wilder with a tremendous hold my beer for David Haye and his wee toe to slink away

[Michael W]

Great variation on the Man Utd grey kit excuse.