Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Casagolda]

47 minutes ago, Gianfranco said:

I remember some of the football under Robinson being dreadful. I wouldn’t have complained if we binned him in the December before we got Gboly/Turnbull/Hastie better football.

I think he arguably played both the best and worst football we’ve seen since McCall. 

The initial thunderdome era was great but between Moult’s last game in December 2017 and the change of style in January 2019, we played some of the worst football I’ve seen at Fir Park. 

For my money, worse than anything we’ve seen from Alexander this season. The Ross County cup exit was the absolute nadir, an utter shambles of a performance and he looked on the verge of the sack that day. 

However, the Turnbull inspired 5 months that followed was probably the most enjoyable football we’ve played at Fir Park since McCall’s 12-13 side . We were still a pretty decent watch the following season as well till the wheels came off in January when we lost Cole and Scott. 

Not really followed his time at Morecambe but it’ll be interesting to see which style turns up in Paisley. 

Edited February 22, 2022 by Casagolda

[well fan for life]

2 hours ago, Desp said:

I love Fir Park, but I'd rather we built the new one sooner rather than later.  As long as Alan Burrows is still in charge, I'm certain we won't have a soulless lego stadium like St. Mirren.

This is very much it. First of all Ravenscraig is a bit out the way and there's hee haw nearby, secondly I really do not want to move to something along those lines. No offence to the St Mirren fans sticking there head in here for a look today but the new stadium is dugmeat. Old Love Street was an absolutely class stadium to visit. 

Edited February 22, 2022 by well fan for life

[YassinMoutaouakil]

KVV is going soft

https://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/local-sport/motherwell-striker-reveals-aberdeen-truce-26282209.amp

[rowsdower]

We will get something that we can afford to build, is maintainable, and can be used by the community in some capacity. I'm confident the seats will be C&A. We get 4k people through the gates, and a state of the art beautiful stadium isn't going to bump that significantly.

It will be a sad day when we leave Fir Park, but we can't keep hemorrhaging money to keep it up to scratch, or in the case of the main stand, safe. If there was an option to flatten the main stand and put something more fit for purpose in it's place, I'd be happy with that, but my guess is that would be kind of dear and may hit some planning permission snags.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

I think the thing I'll miss most is the daft quirks. I can't think of stadium anywhere else where the four stands look less similar to each other.

[Mr. Brightside]

[Kapowzer]

I'll elaborate on some of the points made about the AGM made on FPC and by Swello/Pettigrew.

McMahon outlined the broad figures and invited questions on the accounts, he was asked a few questions on specifics and seemed to doff the cap to Flao with respect to the business interruption insurance (I think we were one of 4 SPFL clubs with it in place). When you consider the last time football was interrupted in any meaningful way it was 1939 and Hitler was being a bit of a dick. If it was something in place before Jan 2020 .... wow! If we took out the policy between Jan 2020 and the league suspending then it was sound foresight and astute. All of our expenses were covered by the policy. The Scottish government loan of £3m repaid over 20 years with no interest was discussed and it was outlined that it was too good a deal to turn down, it was calculated it would cost £1.5m to service the loan over that time using current interest rates. There was a wee bit of detail about how it was put through the books for accounting purposes.

Our default, assume finishing 10th, no player sales and no cup runs. The board are investigating three strategic focus points for the club going forward centered round new revenue streams and reducing our current costs to make us more efficient. It was definitely a spend big now save in the long term strategy:

1./ Infrastructure

(A) While we think the pitch being ripped up every year is a wholesale fix it was described as a "patchwork" solution. The issue outlined was we're missing out on pre-season friendlies, chances to host Scotland U21, U19, women's games (which we've had in the past) and if the pitch was more robust we could host more of our own various squads games at FP. The pitch always battles with poor percolation of surface water due to the makeup of the soil so this summer they plan on going down deep and spending a very large amount in the hope it leads to increased opportunities for revenues and less costs in future pre-seasons. Flao mentioned the weave pitch which I think is what a lot of EPL teams have. He has stated in the past he is against anything synthetic.

(B) A move to Ravenscraig is being investigated, costed and viability assessed, seems to be led by Dickie due to his background.

(C) They hope to sign something in the next two weeks with the Dalziel Memorial Trust with respect to Dalziel Park where we would have more of a say in the use and maintenance of the site rather than just tennants (possibly a dedicated building and players reporting there rather than FP first and being bussed - imagine Murray Park or Lennoxtown without the bigotry and arseholes).

2./ McMahon outlined plans to reevaluate our youth setup and academy. Muted an idea where investors can contribute and if the player flourishes and subsequently earns a move, a cut is earned. Flao outlined due to Brexit and players from 27 countries no longer having right to live and work in the UK, all the EFL teams have shifted the focus of their scouting. In Scotland which was already tough for us competing against the OF, is now much much tougher. Mentions of Chelsea having upwards of 60 players on loan cited and how the authorities are trying to combat this.

3./ We have a very good story that many wealthy individuals or companies may like to align with. Supporter owned, community engagement, suicide prevention, etc. all noble and  may encourage commercial interests and individuals at home and abroad to get involved. Like the academy investment, how or what it will look like, the threshold to entry, reward, etc. things are at a very early stage so no numbers or ideas how it will be fleshed out

When asked Douglas Dickie advised the Well Society’s has not been asked for funds for 2 years from the club. When you consider the past two years have been the ultimate "rainy day" and those funds haven't once been tapped, you can infer what you like about those running the club.

Graham Alexander then started the juicy bit. He said it was nice to have everyone pulling in the same direction and welcomed the universal support he had in implementing his ideas.

He was quizzed about Dean Cornelius and cited Barry McGuire as someone he's asked Dean to try and mimic and emulate. Ross Tierney was mentioned at the very end where Grezza conveyed he's gone from two evening training sessions a week and a game to 5. There's a gradual buildup of stamina required and robustness to compete in a major step up for him.

There's genuine affection for Bevis (pronounced Beh-vis), Grezza said he was unsure which position he will develop into (RB/CH) but he has all the tools and he's a lovely guy and responds well to coaching. He also cited our stats with Bevis playing RB.

I won't repeat what @Swello said about Watt and Lamie, it's pretty much on the button. It was added that the reason Lamie didn't go before the window closed was "we didn't need another bag of balls". Flao added we're working with Hearts on a SFA/SPFL? panel to limit PCA's and bring them into alignment with England. PCA's are limited to teams in the same league to one month before the end of the contract (outwith the same league it stays at 6 months). This is to avoid conflicts of interest and split loyalties. All makes perfect sense.

He was also asked about Tony's comment regarding training being 10x better at United. He seemed genuinely surprised which tells me he doesn't concern himself with the redtops. Flao rolled his eyes and smiled which seems a continuation of his obvious frustration of how things transpired and his touchline confrontation.

Callum Slattery's fringe involvement since Xmas was discussed, Alexander conveyed while coming from the EPL youth setup, he was used to U23 games and bitty loans here and there. He essentially conveyed he was happy with his forward play in supporting the attack but his defensive contribution needed work. Therefore he was being managed to build his stamina.

Both Flao and McMahon conveyed that we should be happy where we are and the direction we are going. Many other teams in this league are not acting as prudently or responsibly and while not said, reading between the lines, it will come back to bite a number of them in the future.

All stuff that gets folk up worked up on here is quickly subdued with rational answers from those behind the scenes.

Edited February 22, 2022 by Kapowzer

[NorthBank]

This is very much it. First of all Ravenscraig is a bit out the way and there's hee haw nearby, secondly I really do not want to move to something along those lines. No offence to the St Mirren fans sticking there head in here for a look today but the new stadium is dugmeat. Old Love Street was an absolutely class stadium to visit. 

Don't think you'll find many Buddies disagreeing about prefering the old stadium. Even the name was iconic. However Tesco saved us from extinction and we had little say in the new stadium. Allegedly we hope to fill in the corners which should improve it.

[Well Well]

3 hours ago, welldaft said:

This is pretty much it for me. We have been left bewildered by the team selection on many occasions this season. He is the Manager and knows how they train and their attitude between games.

But almost to a man / woman the fans have been asking how McGinley never got dropped despite some below par performances. The same goes for Donnelly and Goss. Neither have great games yet Slattery sits on the bench week after week. It simply does not add up. 

Is this a case of a player being better the more he does not play. Not to me. His performances early in the season were more than decent. A battling midfielder that can play and score goals. For me it had to be OHara, Slattery and 1 other. 

The reality is the next two months will shape his future. Most sensible fans acknowledge that losing to Hearts, Rangers, Celtic and even DDee Utd is hardly surprising. But if we fail to pick up 7-10 points from the last 5 pre split games and finish bottom 6 with a downward spiral then the hostility will get louder and louder. 

I am still a fan of GA and he has shown before that for every bad run we go on a decent run. Hoping for more of the same after this weekend. 

I heard he had a right go at GA regarding tactics and was benched and is out of favour. Despite arguably being one of our best midfielder's then if true the manager is making sure there is no dissent from the ranks regarding his style of play. I also heard the Van Veen has also been unhappy since joining but not elaborated on what it is. This is all pure speculation and comes third hand so please take with a huge pinch of salt.

Edited February 22, 2022 by Well Well

[capt_oats]

31 minutes ago, Kapowzer said:

I'll elaborate on some of the points made about the AGM made on FPC and by Swello/Pettigrew.

McMahon outlined the broad figures and invited questions on the accounts, he was asked a few questions on specifics and seemed to doff the cap to Flao with respect to the business interruption insurance (I think we were one of 4 SPFL clubs with it in place). When you consider the last time football was interrupted in any meaningful way it was 1939 and Hitler was being a bit of a dick. If it was something in place before Jan 2020 .... wow! If we took out the policy between Jan 2020 and the league suspending then it was sound foresight and astute. All of our expenses were covered by the policy. The Scottish government loan of £3m repaid over 20 years with no interest was discussed and it was outlined that it was too good a deal to turn down, it was calculated it would cost £1.5m to service the loan over that time using current interest rates. There was a wee bit of detail about how it was put through the books for accounting purposes.

Our default, assume finishing 10th, no player sales and no cup runs. The board are investigating three strategic focus points for the club going forward centered round new revenue streams and reducing our current costs to make us more efficient. It was definitely a spend big now save in the long term strategy:

1./ Physical Infrastructure

(A) While we think the pitch being ripped up every year is a wholesale fix it was described as a "patchwork" solution. The issue outlined was we're missing out on pre-season friendlies, chances to host Scotland U21, U19, women's games (which we've had in the past) and if the pitch was more robust we could host more of our own various squads games at FP. The pitch always battles with poor percolation of surface water due to the makeup of the soil so this summer they plan on going down deep and spending a very large amount in the hope it leads to increased opportunities for revenues and less costs in future pre-seasons. Flao mentioned the weave pitch which I think is what a lot of EPL teams have. He has stated in the past he is against anything synthetic.

(B) A move to the Ravenscraig is being investigated, costed and viability assessed, seems to be led by Dickie due to his background. They hope to sign something in the next two weeks with the Dalziel Memorial Trust with respect to Dalziel Park where we would have more of a say in the use and maintenance of the site rather than just tennants (possibly a dedicated building and players reporting there rather than FP first and being bussed - imagine Murray Park or Lennoxtown without the bigotry and arseholes).

2./ McMahon outlined plans to reevaluate our youth setup and academy. Muted an idea where investors can contribute and if the player flourishes and subsequently earns a move, a cut is earned. Flao outlined due to Brexit and players from 27 countries no longer having right to live and work in the UK, all the EFL teams have shifted the focus of their scouting. In Scotland which was already tough for us competing against the OF, is now much much tougher. Mentions of Chelsea having upwards of 60 players on loan cited and how the authorities are trying to combat this.

3./ We have a very good story that many wealthy individuals or companies may like to align with. Supporter owned, community engagement, suicide prevention, etc. all noble and  may encourage commercial interests and individuals at home and abroad to get involved. Like the academy investment, how or what it will look like, the threshold to entry, reward, etc. things are at a very early stage so no numbers or ideas how it will be fleshed out

When asked Douglas Dickie advised the Well Society’s has not been asked for funds for 2 years from the club.

Graham Alexander then started the juicy bit. He said it was nice to have everyone pulling in the same direction and welcomed the universal support he had in implementing his ideas.

He was quizzed about Dean Cornelius and cited Barry McGuire as someone he's asked Dean to try and mimic and emulate. Ross Tierney was mentioned at the very end where Grezza conveyed he's gone from two evening training sessions a week and a game to 5. There's a gradual buildup of stamina required and robustness to compete in a major step up for him.

There's genuine affection for Bevis (pronounced Beh-vis), Grezza said he was unsure which position he will develop into (RB/CH) but he has all the tools and he's a lovely guy and responds well to coaching. He also cited our stats with Bevis playing RB.

I won't repeat what @Swello said about Watt and Lamie, it's pretty much on the button. It was added that the reason Lamie didn't go before the window closed was "we didn't need another bag of balls". Flao added we're working with Hearts on a SFA/SPFL? panel to limit PCA's and bring them into alignment with England. PCA's are limited to teams in the same league to one month before the end of the contract (outwith the same league it stays at 6 months). This is to avoid conflicts of interest and split loyalties. All makes perfect sense.

He was also asked about Tony's comment regarding training being 10x better at United. He seemed genuinely surprised which tells me he doesn't concern himself with the redtops. Flao rolled his eyes and smiled which seems a continuation of his obvious frustration of how things transpired and his touchline confrontation.

Callum Slattery's fringe involvement since Xmas was discussed, Alexander conveyed while coming from the EPL youth setup, he was used to U23 games and bitty loans here and there. He essentially conveyed he was happy with his forward play in supporting the attack but his defensive contribution needed work. Therefore he was being managed to build his stamina.

Both Flao and McMahon conveyed that we should be happy where we are and the direction we are going. Many other teams in this league are not acting as prudently or responsibly and while not said, reading between the lines is it will come back to bite a number of them in the future.

All stuff that gets folk up worked up on here is quickly subdued with rational answers from those behind the scenes.

Cheers. That's a cracking write-up.

[Kapowzer]

12 minutes ago, Well Well said:

I heard he had a right go at GA regarding tactics and was benched and is out of favour. Despite arguably being one of our best midfielder's then if true the manager is making sure there is no dissent from the ranks regarding his style of play. I also heard the Van Veen has also been unhappy since joining but not elaborated on what it is. This is all pure speculation and comes third hand so please take with a huge pinch of salt.

I'd agree with this as what's really happened, Slattery is probably gobby and Grezza doesn't take any shit.

[capt_oats]

19 minutes ago, Well Well said:

I heard he had a right go at GA regarding tactics and was benched and is out of favour. Despite arguably being one of our best midfielder's then if true the manager is making sure there is no dissent from the ranks regarding his style of play. I also heard the Van Veen has also been unhappy since joining but not elaborated on what it is. This is all pure speculation and comes third hand so please take with a huge pinch of salt.

I mean, it's possible but it's kind of undermined by the fact that he's started 4 of our last 7 in the league since the break.

It's not like he's been Polworth or Lawleff'd.

[Kapowzer]

3 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

I mean, it's possible but it's kind of undermined by the fact that he's started 4 of our last 7 in the league since the break.

It's not like he's been Polworth or Lawleff'd.

No but he has significantly less game time than Goss which is a travesty in itself.

[beesher]

This may be a bit melodramatic but think I would consider calling it quits if we moved away from Fir Park.

I don't see how we would be able to afford anything other than a lego dump, and that just has 0 appeal to me at all. The history and character of Fir Park is irreplaceable and I would hate to see us move. 

[Allroy for Prez]

14 minutes ago, beesher said:

This may be a bit melodramatic but think I would consider calling it quits if we moved away from Fir Park.

I don't see how we would be able to afford anything other than a lego dump, and that just has 0 appeal to me at all. The history and character of Fir Park is irreplaceable and I would hate to see us move. 

Same. 

[Swello]

49 minutes ago, Well Well said:

I heard he had a right go at GA regarding tactics and was benched and is out of favour. Despite arguably being one of our best midfielder's then if true the manager is making sure there is no dissent from the ranks regarding his style of play. I also heard the Van Veen has also been unhappy since joining but not elaborated on what it is. This is all pure speculation and comes third hand so please take with a huge pinch of salt.

We don't know what really goes on behind the scenes as even when the manager and board are being fairly open in the context of an AGM, they aren't going to wash any dirty laundry when it could bite them later.

With that said - GA's explanation about Slattery last night when he was asked directly passes the occam's razor test for me.

[Archie McSquackle]

I am dreading the day we move to the Ravenscraig. It's a soul-less shitehole.
There is more about the parts that nature has taken over than there is about parts with the homes etc built on them. It's windy and if/when a lego Stadium is thrown up there will be nothing round about it.

So, I take it you're not swayed by a drive-through Greggs or whatever the latest plans involve?

[JamesP_81]

I'm torn on the idea of a move away from FP. Of course in an ideal world we would stay exactly where we are forever but as was mentioned before the longer we go on the more of a money pit it becomes and the more other teams will gain an advantage financially.  On a plus point I would say the setup at the club we have now makes me more confident that we would do it the right way for everyone as opposed to say if Boyle was still in charge and would be happy to throw up any old crap in any old place as long as it could be done for x-1 of the £x amount of money we could sell FP for.  

Does anyone itk know if someone already has a site at ravenscraig 'bagsied' for any future developments? If not it may be worth biting the bullet and moving earlier while it's still a blank canvas and just putting up with the couple of decades of waiting for all the infrastructure to build up around about.i know there's plans in place for a massive rail freight hub and talk of development of a 'Motherwell North' station from that . There can't be too many clubs that have such a vast unbuilt on area to consider. 

Bare minimum requirements tho :-

must have grass that actually grows.

must have 4 stands.

must be right on top of the pitch to create the same kind of atmosphere.

must have at least a little bit of design flair to separate it from the generic Lego builds. 

 

[capt_oats]

2 hours ago, Gianfranco said:

I remember some of the football under Robinson being dreadful. I wouldn’t have complained if we binned him in the December before we got Gboly/Turnbull/Hastie better football. The highs were tremendous under Robinson so I’m going to lookout for the highlights of that Aberdeen game mentioned further up the thread.

I don’t know much about hybrid pitches but I can tell you Murrayfield and Parkhead both currently have hybrid pitches.

It really is worth revisiting.

[Rod]

1 hour ago, Kapowzer said:

All stuff that gets folk up worked up on here is quickly subdued with rational answers from those behind the scenes.

Yet there was nothing on half time Pakora?

#SackTheBoard