Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Swello]

39 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

From our POV as @crazylegsjoe_mfc says, it's kind of hard to square Alexander identifying our goals against column as being a massive issue with going into next season with the same 4 CBs under contract and our defensive options.

I think there are probably two parts to it - we will hopefully not have injury problems in defence as bad as this season -it was genuinely unprecedented. Also - both Ojala and Sol will undoubtedly benefit from and need a close season break - although it remains to be seen if Ojala is a perma-crock which was looking to be the case sadly. 

Secondly - I would imagine that a fair proportion of the goals we conceded came from opposition players waltzing through our midfield or having *fucking acres* of space to put in crosses from wide during that "don't bother stopping crosses" phase that we seemingly went through - so it is probably too simplistic to blame our central defence alone for that horrendous goals against column. I think defensive mid and getting a tune out of our fullbacks is a bigger priority. 

[capt_oats]

10 minutes ago, Swello said:

I think there are probably two parts to it - we will hopefully not have injury problems in defence as bad as this season -it was genuinely unprecedented. Also - both Ojala and Sol will undoubtedly benefit from and need a close season break - although it remains to be seen if Ojala is a perma-crock which was looking to be the case sadly. 

Secondly - I would imagine that a fair proportion of the goals we conceded came from opposition players waltzing through our midfield or having *fucking acres* of space to put in crosses from wide during that "don't bother stopping crosses" phase that we seemingly went through - so it is probably too simplistic to blame our central defence alone for that horrendous goals against column. I think defensive mid and getting a tune out of our fullbacks is a bigger priority. 

Aye, it stood out that he specifically referenced the "structure" when he commented on the goals against.

Quote

"Our defensive record is not good enough,” he said. “Plain and simple.

"We have scored a lot of goals this season but we have to look at the structure, how we set up, a lot of things, but the goals against, if you look over the course of the season, have hurt us a little but so we have to look at that." 

Link

Finishing Top 6 in 21/22 vs Bottom 6 in 20/21 probably skews things a bit but here are the goals against averages since Alexander has been here:

20/21 - P 18 GA 23 (1.27 GAPG)
21/22 - P 38 GA 61 (1.60 GAPG) (Pre-break = P 20 GA 27 (1.35 GAPG) / Post-break = P 18 GA 34 (1.88 GAPG))

[Mr. Brightside]

"I'm pleased Lamie isn't signing for us" 

[Ludo*1]

33 minutes ago, Mr. Brightside said:

"I'm pleased Lamie isn't signing for us" 

Tbf a lot of us said it at the time the PCA was announced/speculated about as happening.

[Kapowzer]

Lamie is the best of a mediocre bunch. I still hope for a couple of singings of the Aldred/Cedric stature to inspire any hope of improvement and keeping my blood pressure manageable. There has to be a few switched on, pacy, big fellas out there.

However fingers crossed anyone still under contract may change perceptions in the coming season as much as he has. He has an adequate and demonstrable villain to hero narrative.

Sol for next years PPotY and celebratory nude calendar to raise funds for the community trust.

[welldaft]

Lamie is an interesting one for sure. He was widely seen as a liability in his 1st season. But last season he did show that he was a better than average option for us. I kinda like the guy tbh. 

Also reading he has scored 10 goals in 70 appearances. I mean 1 goal every 7 games is very decent for a defender. His goals have probably contributed an extra £500k+ to our coffers and possibly more if we get thru to QR2 in the Conference League. So despite Ludo protestations he made the difference for us and I am happy to see him sign on if the Record reports are true. 

I do get the feeling we will need to move on a couple of defenders to freshen things up. So I would not be surprised if we tried to encourage a couple to move despite being under contract. Does not mean that will happen as it would need to suit both parties. 

Edited May 24, 2022 by welldaft

[Doctor Manhattan]

3 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

For what? Even as a Motherwell fan who possibly thinks Lamie is an excellent CH, you can't suggest that Lamie would be a difference maker for any club?

That certainly wasn't my intended meaning. If I had a point, it would be that without a time machine it is impossible to say whether this is a good outcome for Dundee, or for Motherwell. My fingers are crossed for brilliant Lamie rather than bombscare Lamie next season, but more in hope than expectation.

[well fan for life]

I think Lamie is good to have if we play to his strengths. So basically let him win headers and he's not bad in distribution. If we do move to a back 3/5 however you want to put it I think he fits well. 

[capt_oats]

25 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

I think Lamie is good to have if we play to his strengths. So basically let him win headers and he's not bad in distribution. If we do move to a back 3/5 however you want to put it I think he fits well. 

I was just away to post that. If we pivot to the 3412 that appeared in the last few games it potentially opens up a space in the defensive area to bring someone in.

If we wanted to look at an alternate LWB then there's an argument that McGinley could be a back-up to Lamie on the left side of the 3 I guess.

Oh...I just clocked this at the end of Scott Burns' piece re: Lamie in the Express...

Edited May 24, 2022 by capt_oats

[Handsome_Devil]

I have a very rough theory that in Scotland you'll succeed if you basically keep 3-4 good players fit and fill the rest of the team with average jobbers, who suddenly look better than they are in a winning team.

The same applies to failure, your 7-8 average guys will look worse than they are if trying to carry a few utter shiters.

The Jesus Christ Lamie phase came because we initially used him at left back in a side trying to play football (badly) which emphasised his weaknesses and minimised his strengths.

He improved because we played him the middle in a team which ditched the Barcelona pish as the saying at Fir Park goes which covered his weaknesses and showed off his strengths. Yes he had his Beckenbauer moment v County but by and large he just keeps it solid, wins his headers and makes his blocks.

If we play Lamie as one of the more limited players in our team next year because we make some good signings, he'll be fine.

If we baws the recruitment and he's suddenly one of our main performers we're in bother.

Whether it's the right decision to keep him or not time will tell but you need to trust the club at this point as we don't have the info on alternatives, budgets, possibly moving people under contract, plans for the formation etc.

Personally I'm ok he's staying...not thrilled nor raging.

 

[CoF]

Happy with that. Thought Lamie was excellent last year. Given he (apparently) signed the PCA because he wanted more game time I can only assume that's something Alexander has more or less guaranteed him. 

[Ron Aldo]

I can see why Dundee fans aren't bothered about not signing Lamie. Equally, as a Motherwell fan I'm quite happy we're keeping him (words I never thought I'd say a couple of years ago).

I think last season demonstrated that he's a more than decent defender at this level if played on the right system. I'd be hoping we don't build our defence around him but I'd be happy enough with Lamie being in there.

The main issue now with the defence is whether we stick/twist with Ojala. With our defensive record last season we really don't need someone who's only ever half fit at best and (I'd guess) is probably one of our higher earners.

[capt_oats]

There he is...

[Handsome_Devil]

7 minutes ago, Ron Aldo said:

The main issue now with the defence is whether we stick/twist with Ojala. With our defensive record last season we really don't need someone who's only ever half fit at best and (I'd guess) is probably one of our higher earners.

Ojala was a gamble and when fit in autumn you could see the merits of it.

But given his injury history and latest issues in the last months, doubling down now by not going for a first pick CB seems a huge risk.

Fit for Ojala basically means we'll get 25-30 games, all competitions, out of him and even that seems on the hopeful side.

Unless we're incredibly confident we can fix him (in a way his previous clubs apparently couldn't), we should be looking to cut a deal and move him on.

['WellDel]

 

10 minutes ago, Ron Aldo said:

The main issue now with the defence is whether we stick/twist with Ojala. With our defensive record last season we really don't need someone who's only ever half fit at best and (I'd guess) is probably one of our higher earners.

Said the other day that I wasn't fussed either way on Lamie staying, so long as if he did, then we would look to move one of the other centre half's on in favour of recruiting a stronger, leader type that we don't currently have.

Ojala is the obvious candidate to try and shift. He's had injury issues at previous clubs and we've took a punt, but he's obviously and unfortunately made of papier mâché, and with an having international pedigree of sorts I'd assume he's on a decent wage that you'd be hoping for a far better return from.

[capt_oats]

Genuinely not sure how much of this is ghost written but the language here is interesting:

Quote

“We were in discussions with his representative for some time, but those were paused when another club made him what was an extremely attractive offer that he had no option but to accept. We understood and respected that, but had no concerns around his professionalism and in actual fact he was amongst our most important players in the second half of the campaign.

“When circumstances changed, it presented an opportunity for us and we’re so pleased to not only keep someone who is a big player on the pitch, but an important character off it too.”

Link

It's well known that Dundee chucked money at him, which is fine, there would need to be an incentive given we were 4th at the time and they were 11th.

Having said that it doesn't necessarily sound as if we've tried to match it or anything.

[Kapowzer]

14 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Genuinely not sure how much of this is ghost written but the language here is interesting:

Subtext ..... Tony Watt would have been a wean

[rowsdower]

Good that we got this tied up early. Wonder if the reply guys are still raging about Alexander tearing the club down.

As others have said, I still think we need to strengthen in that area, especially if we're going to continue with the back 3.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Goss has been robbed, IMO.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/61202539

[Kapowzer]

24 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Goss has been robbed, IMO.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/61202539

Just copied that myself to see you posted it. Seems the peculiarity extends to however researched wrote that piece of crazy talk fake news.