Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[rowsdower]

Just watched the interview there. While we were in the game until the last minute, forced some good saves, and spurned some big chances, in no way, shape, or form were we excellent.

If the manager is just protecting the players, fine, but he's talking like we're a lower league minnow playing a big team in the cup. Giving players plaudits for trying hard is a bit much.

I'm not calling for his head at this point, but it surely must be on the minds of the board. I'm not sure who we could hire in his place at this point, but whoever manages us next season will have the same head of recruitment, so let's hope he's good.

[Phillips455]

Will there be any protests at the Hearts game? Since its aa Wednesday night I doubt it.

 

Next seasons League cup group stage games might be a bit ugly though..

[eliphas]

As I understand it there are opportunities to break the contract before the advertised end date and not pay 'full' compensation. The board therefore have options....but are related to pre and mid season goals and targets set. Which, for this season are more or less met and exceeded....

Edited April 30, 2022 by eliphas

[capt_oats]

34 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

Just watched the interview there. While we were in the game until the last minute, forced some good saves, and spurned some big chances, in no way, shape, or form were we excellent.

If the manager is just protecting the players, fine, but he's talking like we're a lower league minnow playing a big team in the cup. Giving players plaudits for trying hard is a bit much.

I'm not calling for his head at this point, but it surely must be on the minds of the board. I'm not sure who we could hire in his place at this point, but whoever manages us next season will have the same head of recruitment, so let's hope he's good.

I mean, I've not seen the interview but after a 1-0 loss where we had *chances* I'm not surprised he's talking things up.

In fairness I don't think there's been much issue with the recruitment. We've a pretty stable squad on longer term deals than usual, there's enough there for someone to work with if given a window themselves (IMO).

For all I (and others) have talked about Alexander hitting his KPIs (he has, unequivocally) there's surely a flip to that where even the manager would agree that 1 win in however many puts him in a difficult position. @eliphas' post above hints at what I suspected might be the case, it seems unlikely that we'd leave ourselves on the hook for that sort of commitment.

For all Neville walked back on his comments after he sacked Alexander there's a sound enough logic in their reasoning. A quick reminder this is what he said at the time:

Quote

“Graham had done a great job for the club over two seasons and the ambition of the club has been quite clear from day one: we want promotion every single season.

“The first manager that left the club was third in the league, the second who left the club had won promotion and Graham was in a really good position in the league, but we always change at a point where we’re doing quite well.

“It’s been our methodology for the last seven or eight years. Sometimes our own personal beliefs in how you approach management is different to the club’s in terms of what we have to do here.

“We’re intent on winning promotion and we won’t let anything compromise that.

“We just felt we wanted to change the way in which we approached it this season, the style of play.

“We were a little disappointed in last season’s performance but Graham getting one promotion, getting us to a cup final and being fifth in the league, it wasn’t a reflection on him as he’s a fantastic manager who did a good job for us.”

Link

I think there's probably a solid argument for him...."moving on" from our POV...and his tbf.

As folk have said, it's difficult to come back with any sort of credit from 1 win in 14 or whatever it is but @Kapowzer touched on it in a post earlier, the best hope for him and us is that some lower league jobber in England needs a new manager and with the lower leagues finishing up today I'd imagine there will be a few jobs opening up.

On top of his CV to date a Top 6 finish in his first full season is a sellable point and although this run is poor if you're choosing to spin it you can point to losing our top scorer in January and also highlight that we've not been losing games (today is only our 2nd b2b defeat since October) and the other thing is that we've not been taking pumpings. The "fine margins" crew are right.

We've generally tended to change manager when we've been in a relegation scrap however in this circumstance I wouldn't be surprised if an alternate looked at our squad and situation and felt there was plenty here that a fresh pair of eyes and some new ideas could work with.

Edited April 30, 2022 by capt_oats

['WellDel]

5 minutes ago, Kapowzer said:

As is the whole "get him to f**k" every week when they also know the situation.

 

 

 

Aye, we all know the situation in reality. He's going nowhere, but as you freely agree, the football is shite and the entertainment is zero.

Doesn't matter that the whole league has been brutal beyond belief, and it's true that, from a financial point of view, top 6 with the hilarious possibility that we could still sneak a European place is beyond his basic remit on paper. But on paper and on the park are two wholly different things.

The underlying fact of the matter is that the product is sub-standard, and his continuing presence and style is very really, and worryingly, affecting whether a fair number of our support will commit their financial backing to the club for next season. The year on year increase in season ticket holders that has been much lauded the past few seasons is about to come to an abrupt end, and slam firmly into reverse.

From my own point of view we, as a family of 4 season book holders for many years, have decided that next season we will go to p.a.t.g. and choose our games. There's simply no enjoyment in going to watch us just now.  Certainly not enough for us to fork out the thick end of a grand and a half between us for the dubious pleasure. Reading between the lines there are many more in the same boat.

I'm not one for unnecessary arguing and fully take your very valid points on board, but it's an entertainment business,  and success in my book needs to be measured by customer satisfaction as much as by any other financial or business metric. Clichéd as f**k, but the fans are the club, and there's a lot of them just now who are at a real crossroads with their commitment going forward.

[Desp]

The most unlikeable Motherwell team under the most unlikeable Motherwell manager* in my time watching the club**

Next season's Season Ticket sales will be a fucking shambles.

 

*I liked Mark McGhee

**since 1991

 

[rowsdower]

The most unlikeable team where the best players are total dicks (in a "good if they play for you" way) and a tory.

[Phillips455]

We now effectively need go beat County and Hearts to get Europe

 

I think we are about to go on a 5 game loss streak......

[Swello]

Going to away games is becoming a really expensive thing to do - it's getting hard to justify at the moment. Probably deserved a point but in terms of actual entertainment value, it was poor again (although I was surprised that the support largely stayed with the team, which was a big contrast from the last game at Tannadice where Alexander was taking pelters).

My concern isn't for europe any more - I've seen a lot teams with shite form in the calendar year take it into the next season and that has to be a real possibility as we are too late to compensate for the abysmal run we're on and aren't going to end the season on a high.

They should have pressed send on the season ticket emails 2 minutes after the Bathgate Maldini equalised at Livi... 

[welldaft]

14 minutes ago, Phillips455 said:

We now effectively need go beat County and Hearts to get Europe

 

I think we are about to go on a 5 game loss streak......

I have my concerns about Alexander and his style of play / tactics. 

I was talking to a mate after the game and we both agreed (sadly) that losing Watt was the catalyst for this downturn. He is not the messiah, but he made us tick upfront and chipped in with important goals. I am quite sure that if he stayed as in another year on contract we would be comfortably 4th. Which is why I hope his next shit is a hedgehog. 

To the quote above and to quote Kevin Keegan. I would love absolutely love us to win the next two games. The impact on here would be very amusing. 

['WellDel]

38 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

The most unlikeable team where the best players are total dicks (in a "good if they play for you" way) and a tory.
 

Even in times like the Malpas season, there were folk like O'Donnell, McDonald, Craggs and big Jim Patterson in the squad. Players you loved, and the horrific season was as much down to piss poor management as bad players (although there was also, admittedly, Molloy and Keegan). 

In the play off season, we were poor but you had Skippy again, along with Marv and Lionel to name a few. Kipré and Moult a couple of more recent examples.

This current mob? Kelly is a good keeper, but a very strange laddie. Goss as bland as they come, and Van Veen one who flits between cult hero and annoying bawbag levels.

I am taking to wee Tierney, and Mugabi is a likeable big character, if heavy bombscare at times. Other than that it's the most bland/depressing/unlikeable squad I can remember. And they're pish at fitbaw. Literally no-one you'd lose sleep over losing.

['WellDel]

37 minutes ago, Phillips455 said:

We now effectively need go beat County and Hearts to get Europe

Aye, I widnae be wagering too much with Willie Hill's on that double coming up..

[rowsdower]

Facebook comments, steelmenonline, and pie and bovil starting to align, that's scary.

We are now only separated by quality food chat.

['WellDel]

4 minutes ago, rowsdower said:

Facebook comments, steelmenonline, and pie and bovil starting to align, that's scary.

We are now only separated by quality food chat.

First mention of paneer on SOL and we're fucked.

 

Edited April 30, 2022 by 'WellDel

[Kapowzer]

1 hour ago, Swello said:

They should have pressed send on the season ticket emails 2 minutes after the Bathgate Maldini equalised at Livi... 

If they were clever they should have also restricted the early bird offers for 5 days max.

[ZX1886]

My concern isn't for europe any more - I've seen a lot teams with shite form in the calendar year take it into the next season and that has to be a real possibility as we are too late to compensate for the abysmal run we're on and aren't going to end the season on a high.

The season we finished 3rd under Robinson springs to mind. Awful past January and carried into the new season leading to inevitable managerial change.

[Handsome_Devil]

Today needs some perspective. As part of the 14-game run it's a sackable offence, as a one-off it barely registers.

We should never have lost but the effort at 1-0 was hardly enough to merit sympathy.

Win next week and all is forgiven. Don't and we're counting down to September 1 when the gtf calls will be overwhelming.

[Busta Nut]

3 hours ago, ropy said:

Where there is hope will come despair.  I have a train ticket for next week.  I haven’t as yet purchased a ticket to the game.  A visit to the Wimpy and the Mallard then home?

I will decide at 1330 if I will buy a ticket

2 hours ago, Swello said:

Going to away games is becoming a really expensive thing to do - it's getting hard to justify at the moment.

This is another discussion but one that is needed.

[Neil86]

The examples folk use to point out players not liking the manager are very weird. Watt getting offered twice his wage and two bit players. Maybe the rumour is true, terrible examples though. 

[Kapowzer]

 

7 hours ago, Londonwell said:

Aye so you think it's a load of shite as well, fair enough.

Undoubtedly, I've got eyes and bar 6 games this season (Hibs opening day, Aberdeen home, Hearts home, St Johnstone home, Aberdeen Cup, St Mirren home) it's been chronic to watch. If you go into any of the other 8 teams threads outwith the top 3 you'll find the exact same criticisms, only difference is the named players and manager.

Where Grezza lost more of us was not opting for:

• Consistency - Granted it was sometimes determined by injuries which you can forgive, by fallouts and favourites, you can't.
• Selections - Fielding underperformers week after week even when it flew against wisdom or common sense. Donnelly & Efford stick out.
• Tactics - Not nice seeing your team concede 75% possession at home, but that all changed about 13 games in. Also sticking to 4-3-3 regardless of opposition or personnel available.
• The "ahh fcuk it" Factor - Mugabi up front, Ibrox being two prime examples (ironically they both got dividends) but few of us think it was any sort of masterstroke.
• Personnel - The McGinely extension being the prime criticism here. Nierrnold being the only defensive addition in the January window was criminal.

Flao extended him off the back of a stellar 12 months in charge (results & points), not on the fayre on offer. And if he is tapped this summer we'll get a bit more than if he didn't. Few would have imagined us struggling the way we have but likewise only Ross County put any meaningful string of results together so we limped over the line. What many fail to appreciate is before Xmas we vastly overperformed. I'm sure he also see value in his CV being padded with inheriting a club bottom in January 2021 to Euro qualification in 2022.

Also looking back in this very thread, it makes interesting reading about Alexanderball and posters opinions of it when we were winning.

Page 1482

Edited May 1, 2022 by Kapowzer