Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[DylanMFC]

14 minutes ago, Kapowzer said:

Just out of interest, who do you reckon is 7th?

OF, Dons, Edinburgh x2, Arabs ...... then?

 

14 minutes ago, Kapowzer said:

Just out of interest, who do you reckon is 7th?

OF, Dons, Edinburgh x2, Arabs ...... then?

Dundee at their absolute peak probably get more gates than us. They just don’t seem to be at that peak very often.

[Kapowzer]

52 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Saturday saw Alexander reach an almost twenty year record in the period of time that a single Motherwell manager has gone without a league win. The last time we went this long without one was between September and December 2002. At that point, given we were deep into administration and Butcher was forced to play youth players and the likes of Daniel Sengewald. Granted, Grezza's winless spell has had five draws to Butcher's one, but I can't see us ending our winless spell like with a 6-1 win like we did back then. The next record in his sights is Alex McLeish's 15 games from 1995/96.

Personally, I think Grezza has dug himself a hole that he didn't need to dig that's made his position pretty untenable. Before the break, we just about had a formula that was working. The defence was changing more than we'd like, but in midfield there was that run of six games where the midfield was the same and even after that, the midfield was consistently made up of Slattery, Goss and one other, with the front three set in stone. Why did he feel the need to rip all of this up, when we were 4th in the table? Why not give Roberts a run of six games in Watt's place and let him bed in? 

Before the break, if any members of our starting eleven weren't the standard of footballer we'd like them to be, at least they were focused, match-fit, well drilled and used to playing with each other. 

We're now in a catch twenty-two situation. The more the team gets changed, the more it needs to get changed.

With the talk about winning ugly and losing ugly, what I would say is that whilst losing ugly is never nice, you can be consoled a lot better when you know your team are capable of producing better, but when winning ugly is as good as it gets, it will lead to easier disgruntlement. I watch Motherwell games to see us win, but if I had to ask myself which games this season I've genuinely been entertained by our style of play, other than the 2-0 win over Hearts in November, I would struggle to pick one. 

The digging himself a hole thing rings true.

He's has access to more funds than any other manager other than John Spencer/Andy Goram years of heady ITV Digital and Setana promised monies.

We're not going to see any form of enjoyable football when you have someone who is to his very core is all about damage limitation than infliction.

He's stubborn and holds grudges, getting carded for arguing over shy's and alike, passion is good but have it directed and productive rather than petulant.

To spell out the last few months, 1-1 with Ross County and 11 v 10 to let them score twice, scraped by in ET against a team at the foot of the Championship, last minute equaliser against St. Mirren, held by Dundee team decimated by Covid, 1-0 up to 2-1 loss on Saturday.

Forget going on about our run of fixtures running up to the split as being easier, anyone who see us coming up is rubbing their hands with glee.

What we need to appreciate is the past few months would be the entire story of 2021-22 season if Tony went in the summer.

[ZX1886]

As for the "biggest club" chat, I don't really care.  If you were to look at it from afar, are we any bigger than the likes of Kilmarnock, Dundee, Falkirk, Dunfermline, Partick Thistle etc?  Arguably not.  What does a "bigger club" even mean, anyway?  What can't be disputed, however, is we're undoubtedly a better club than those mentioned.  Slightly harsh on Killie, as along with us, they were the standard for the provincial clubs over the last 30 years, but last year's relegation done them. 

In Scottish football it counts for nothing below the OF really. It’s mostly do to with expectations but again, outside the OF, we all pretty much expect / want the same. Perform well in the league and have a decent attempt at winning the cups. Of course clubs like Aberdeen / Hearts expect to be 3rd in the league, 4th is a failure for them and a success for us. Similarly 10th is a failure to us and would’ve been a success to Accies last season or Dundee this season.I guess all this means is that the bigger you are outside the OF, the more miserable you are due to not really being better than those around you.

[capt_oats]

4 hours ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Personally, I think Grezza has dug himself a hole that he didn't need to dig that's made his position pretty untenable. Before the break, we just about had a formula that was working. The defence was changing more than we'd like, but in midfield there was that run of six games where the midfield was the same and even after that, the midfield was consistently made up of Slattery, Goss and one other, with the front three set in stone. Why did he feel the need to rip all of this up, when we were 4th in the table? Why not give Roberts a run of six games in Watt's place and let him bed in? 

Before the break, if any members of our starting eleven weren't the standard of footballer we'd like them to be, at least they were focused, match-fit, well drilled and used to playing with each other. 

We're now in a catch twenty-two situation. The more the team gets changed, the more it needs to get changed.

This is pretty much where I am as well, although I disagree that his position is untenable purely on the basis that we can still make the top 6 (remarkably we were 4th at one point on Saturday) and he's had results that have been positive enough eg: Aberdeen in the cup and as much of a hail mary as it was coming back from 2-0 down at Ibrox is in his credit (despite him not having been in the dugout for it).

He is however, IMO, in the position where questions absolutely need to be getting asked of him by the board and how his galaxy brain has dug him into this hole.

Roberts started against County (scored what was actually a cracking goal despite the result), started against Hibs, the Morton cup tie and was benched for the next 3 games after starting in the Hearts loss. Got 63 minutes against United then benched for both Aberdeen games and started on the bench against Rangers.

Meanwhile Liam Donnelly (who I actually like as a player to have around the squad) has started the last 15 of 16 games (the game he missed he was suspended) and played the full 90 (and 120) in 13 of those.

Like I say, that's not a kick at Donnelly. I'm pleased he's back in the international conversation and good luck to him after his wildly shite time with injuries it's just a really weird vibe given the extent to which the team has been rotated in the past few months.

Edited March 21, 2022 by capt_oats

[thisGRAEME]

4 hours ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Saturday saw Alexander reach an almost twenty year record in the period of time that a single Motherwell manager has gone without a league win. The last time we went this long without one was between September and December 2002. At that point, we were deep into administration and Butcher was forced to play youth players and the likes of Daniel Sengewald. Granted, Grezza's winless spell has had five draws to Butcher's one, but I can't see us ending our winless spell like with a 6-1 win like we did back then. The next record in his sights is Alex McLeish's 15 games from 1995/96.

Personally, I think Grezza has dug himself a hole that he didn't need to dig that's made his position pretty untenable. Before the break, we just about had a formula that was working. The defence was changing more than we'd like, but in midfield there was that run of six games where the midfield was the same and even after that, the midfield was consistently made up of Slattery, Goss and one other, with the front three set in stone. Why did he feel the need to rip all of this up, when we were 4th in the table? Why not give Roberts a run of six games in Watt's place and let him bed in? 

Before the break, if any members of our starting eleven weren't the standard of footballer we'd like them to be, at least they were focused, match-fit, well drilled and used to playing with each other. 

We're now in a catch twenty-two situation. The more the team gets changed, the more it needs to get changed.

With the talk about winning ugly and losing ugly, what I would say is that whilst losing ugly is never nice, you can be consoled a lot better when you know your team are capable of producing better, but when winning ugly is as good as it gets, it will lead to easier disgruntlement. I watch Motherwell games to see us win, but if I had to ask myself which games this season I've genuinely been entertained by our style of play, other than the 2-0 win over Hearts in November, I would struggle to pick one. 

This is spot on, for me.

[Desp]

Mark O'Hara the latest to jump ship.  Reported to have signed for St. Mirren.

He's not the last looking to head for the exit door.  Many others wanting away from the manager.

[ropy]

Alexander’s selection policy proves that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

[rowsdower]

He's been good in spells for us, but not to fussed with him keeping someone else's physio busy.

I can't think of anyone else who's contract is coming up that I'd want to keep, so whether they were leaving anyway (likely) or because of GA (maybe) it works for me.

[rowsdower]

The last time we went this long without one was between September and December 2002. At that point, we were deep into administration and Butcher was forced to play youth players and the likes of Daniel Sengewald. Granted, Grezza's winless spell has had five draws to Butcher's one, but I can't see us ending our winless spell like with a 6-1 win like we did back then. The next record in his sights is Alex McLeish's 15 games from 1995/96.

I'm pretty sure I went to every game in both of those runs. The McLeish one was the worst.

[Handsome_Devil]

Not overly bothered - brilliant once every eight games, usually no better than average.

We obviously agree given we reached mid-March without offering him a deal.

Not a surprise Robinson went back for him either really.

 

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Buzzing to see how Alexander falls out with Kelly before the end of the season 

[Lex]

18 minutes ago, Desp said:

Mark O'Hara the latest to jump ship.  Reported to have signed for St. Mirren.

He's not the last looking to head for the exit door.  Many others wanting away from the manager.

Yep we've signed him up on a two year deal. 

Any good? Looked like one of your better players this season. 

[capt_oats]

Stephen Robinson chucking money at Mark O'Hara to sign is it?

I for one am shocked.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Going by Charles Dunne's Instagram he's up Tinto with Jake Carroll so fully expecting that PCA to be announced promptly. 

[capt_oats]

Just now, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Going by Charles Dunne's Instagram he's up Tinto with Jake Carroll so fully expecting that PCA to be announced promptly. 

Carroll's got a year to go on his contract.

[Doctor Manhattan]

5 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Stephen Robinson chucking money at Mark O'Hara to sign is it?

I for one am shocked.

If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you always got. Hopefully...

[rowsdower]

Yep we've signed him up on a two year deal. 
Any good? Looked like one of your better players this season. 

Does a lot of running, pops up with some goals, but has been out injured a lot with a range of different things, including some concussions. Seems a decent guy.

[Doctor Manhattan]

20 minutes ago, Lex said:

Yep we've signed him up on a two year deal. 

Any good? Looked like one of your better players this season. 

Mark O'Hara is like a stream of bat's piss. Which is my way of saying, everything's relative.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

3 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

Carroll's got a year to go on his contract.

 Aye I'm not actually reading anything into it, they're obviously still good pals which makes sense. I did just laugh at hearing the O'Hara news then about 20 minutes later seeing Carroll mountaineering with another St Mirren player.

[Casagolda]

I’ve never been his biggest fan. 

Has good physical attributes certainly- good engine, strong, decent in the air etc. The fact he runs about a lot seems to win a lot of plaudits among certain sections of our support.

However he’s a fairly limited footballer, doesn’t see anything that isn’t 5 yards in front of him and lacks any sort of positional discipline. He’ll have the odd good game and pop up with a goal every so often but overall he’s a fairly beige mid-table jobber. 

Supposedly one of our top earners as well and I don’t think he’s ever come remotely close to justifying that.