Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Swello]

1 hour ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

It's not really worked out for any player who left us this summer, has it? Given how bad we were at points last season, it's not that surprising, but I didn't expect our departing players to have such a minimal effect on their new teams.

Gallagher has been struggling for a place in the Aberdeen team, even with Considine out long term. Long has barely kicked a baw at Crewe, likewise with Cole at Barnsley. Campbell hasn't got back in the Luton team after recovering from his injury. Unused sub seems to be Polworth's regular gig at Killie now. It seems like Dunne is spending a lot of time on the treatment table as usual and Hastie only got on for Partick on Friday to give the guy who scored a hat-trick a standing ovation.

I don't really do the schadenfreude thing as a rule - I only reserve that for folk that think Motherwell is beneath them and act like a dick (Hi Deccy, hiya pal) - but it must be weird for actually good players who make moves to a higher level and encounter the football equivalent of the Peter Principle where they rise to a level where they are no longer good enough to do what they are there to do (ie - play fitba every Saturday). 

Cedric, Cole, Gillespie, Campbell, etc will all be getting paid a ton more to be at a higher level club/league but don't actually do anything other than train during the week or a few minutes on the park here and there. I know the standard viewpoint is "it's a nice problem to have", "football's a short career", etc - but it still must be a bit shite for them.

[well fan for life]

Been out of the loop but can anyone clarify what part of Ayrshire Mrs Polworth has declared a shitehole?

[welldaft]

1 hour ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

It's not really worked out for any player who left us this summer, has it? Given how bad we were at points last season, it's not that surprising, but I didn't expect our departing players to have such a minimal effect on their new teams.

Gallagher has been struggling for a place in the Aberdeen team, even with Considine out long term. Long has barely kicked a baw at Crewe, likewise with Cole at Barnsley. Campbell hasn't got back in the Luton team after recovering from his injury. Unused sub seems to be Polworth's regular gig at Killie now. It seems like Dunne is spending a lot of time on the treatment table as usual and Hastie only got on for Partick on Friday to give the guy who scored a hat-trick a standing ovation.

Probably the only one that surprises me is Gallacher. Thought both he and Aberdeen would have a decent season. May still happen but only if and when they bin Glass. 

Cannot blame Cole for choosing the Championship and no doubt the money also played a part. As with Big Cedric it is not great not to be playing, but the healthy bank balance no doubt acts as a decent consolation. I have said before that Cole plays well for us, then heads south and does not have the same or any impact. One wonders what would have happened if he chose to stay and actually kicked on with Motherwell. 

As for Polworth. Wonder if his missus has been tweeting her displeasure at him not starting . Not getting a game in a Killie team that have started to stutter a little.  Not what she had in mind……or Polworth for that matter. 

[Swello]

2 minutes ago, welldaft said:

Probably the only one that surprises me is Gallacher.

Quite a few of us told Dons supporters that they weren't getting the version of Big Dec that got him his call up and our POTY/Captaincy and that's proven to be right - I'm honestly surprised Aberdeen signed him given the abysmal season he'd had (and that's why I'm always sceptical when folk say that its "all about the data these days"). 

It must be quite a come down from striding about Fir Park like he's the big man to warming the bench for an Aberdeen team that can't keep a clean sheet to save themselves.

[YassinMoutaouakil]

19 minutes ago, Swello said:

I don't really do the schadenfreude thing as a rule - I only reserve that for folk that think Motherwell is beneath them and act like a dick (Hi Deccy, hiya pal) - but it must be weird for actually good players who make moves to a higher level and encounter the football equivalent of the Peter Principle where they rise to a level where they are no longer good enough to do what they are there to do (ie - play fitba every Saturday). 

Cedric, Cole, Gillespie, Campbell, etc will all be getting paid a ton more to be at a higher level club/league but don't actually do anything other than train during the week or a few minutes on the park here and there. I know the standard viewpoint is "it's a nice problem to have", "football's a short career", etc - but it still must be a bit shite for them.

Football must be an incredibly demoralising career about half the time. It's easy for me to say with zero footballing ability but I've always thought I'd probably rather earn slightly less money but be a big fish in a small pond than end up as a squad player in a level I'm out of my depth in. 

I'm pretty sure my mental health would take a kicking if I was training five days a week and spending my Saturdays travelling across the country knowing I wasn't going to be getting a game.

[capt_oats]

49 minutes ago, Swello said:

Cedric, Cole, Gillespie, Campbell, etc will all be getting paid a ton more to be at a higher level club/league but don't actually do anything other than train during the week or a few minutes on the park here and there. I know the standard viewpoint is "it's a nice problem to have", "football's a short career", etc - but it still must be a bit shite for them.

In fairness to those 4 specifically there's an element of circumstances outwith their control (less so Gillespie I guess as not playing was precisely the gig he signed up for).

Kipré ended up at WBA on account of Wigan's admin firesale. The story seems to have been that Bilic didn't necessarily want to sign him, rather it was their DoF (hence him being bumped out on loan last season). The new manager at least seems open to playing him like.

Cole signed for Barnsley then a couple of weeks later Ismaël left for West Brom. They're another lot who seem very data-driven in their recruitment.

Gillespie, it is what it is he signed for Newcastle as a 3rd/4th choice back-up. That role in itself is pretty weird.

Campbell was starting regularly for Luton. Going by their season wiki he started 5 of their opening 6 until he was on the receiving end of a shocker of a tackle against Blackburn. Since then Luton have been in decent form (only lost 1 of their last 6) and he's not been able to get back in the side.

 

Edited October 19, 2021 by capt_oats

[well fan for life]

2 minutes ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Football must be an incredibly demoralising career about half the time. It's easy for me to say with zero footballing ability but I've always thought I'd probably rather earn slightly less money but be a big fish in a small pond than end up as a squad player in a level I'm out of my depth in. 

I'm pretty sure my mental health would take a kicking if I was training five days a week and spending my Saturdays travelling across the country knowing I wasn't going to be getting a game.

If I was a completely average Scottish football player I would 100% be tasking my agent to punt me about round as many overseas leagues as possible. While it wouldn't be financially lucrative it would definitely be a carry on getting a tour round various exotic seaside leagues. 

[Ron Aldo]

Football must be an incredibly demoralising career about half the time. It's easy for me to say with zero footballing ability but I've always thought I'd probably rather earn slightly less money but be a big fish in a small pond than end up as a squad player in a level I'm out of my depth in. 
I'm pretty sure my mental health would take a kicking if I was training five days a week and spending my Saturdays travelling across the country knowing I wasn't going to be getting a game.

I'd agree to an extent but your example is probably more suited to players at the very top rather than our level.

Using Gallagher as an example, he probably feels a bit shite at not playing but the £5k (just a guess) a week at Aberdeen probably softens the blow given he was probably on less than half of that with us.

Guys at our level won't be retiring at 35 to then spend the rest of their days on the beach or the golf course. That's why I don't really blame them going for more money, though it is a bit funny when they have a shite time of it from a football perspective.

[Mr. Brightside]

32 minutes ago, well fan for life said:

Been out of the loop but can anyone clarify what part of Ayrshire Mrs Polworth has declared a shitehole?

All of it?

[Mr. Brightside]

9 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

In fairness to those 4 specifically there's an element of circumstances outwith their control (less so Gillespie I guess as not playing was precisely the gig he signed up for).

Kipré ended up at WBA on account of Wigan's admin firesale. The story seems to have been that Bilic necessarily want to sign him, rather it was their DoF (hence him being bumped out on loan last season). The new manager at least seems open to playing him like.

Cole signed for Barnsley then a couple of weeks later Ismaël left for West Brom. They're another lot who seem very data-driven in their recruitment.

Gillespie, it is what it is he signed for Newcastle as a 3rd/4th choice back-up. That role in itself is pretty weird.

Campbell was starting regularly for Luton. Going by their season wiki he started 5 of their opening 6 until he was on the receiving end of a shocker of a tackle against Blackburn. Since then Luton have been in decent form (only lost 1 of their last 6) and he's not been able to get back in the side.

 

The guy didn't get sent off for that challenge, ref could get a job up here.

[Swello]

9 minutes ago, capt_oats said:

In fairness to those 4 specifically there's an element of circumstances outwith their control (less so Gillespie I guess as not playing was precisely the gig he signed up for).

Kipré ended up at WBA on account of Wigan's admin firesale. The story seems to have been that Bilic necessarily want to sign him, rather it was their DoF (hence him being bumped out on loan last season). The new manager at least seems open to playing him like.

Cole signed for Barnsley then a couple of weeks later Ismaël left for West Brom. They're another lot who seem very data-driven in their recruitment.

Gillespie, it is what it is he signed for Newcastle as a 3rd/4th choice back-up. That role in itself is pretty weird.

Campbell was starting regularly for Luton. Going by their season wiki he started 5 of their opening 6 until he was on the receiving end of a shocker of a tackle against Blackburn. Since then Luton have been in decent form (only lost 1 of their last 6) and he's not been able to get back in the side.

 

Yep - agree with all of the above - I'm just using them as examples of players that were really good/first name on the teamsheet types for us going on to be substitutes/squad meat in other leagues - it must just be well paid boredom and as @YassinMoutaouakil says, must be mentally quite hard.

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

I guess it depends just how money oriented the player in question is.

I can understand the Gillespie one particularly, a combination of the wages he will be on at Newcastle, coupled with them being his boyhood club would be a no brainier. I'd imagine knowing what he signed up for, he'll not be bothered. 

Gallagher on the other hand, was probably quite a "safe" move. Being a Scotland international and having already played in the top flight here for three teams, he probably thought he was making a move where he could earn more dosh without moving too far out of his comfort zone, so for him to be warming Aberdeen's bench, that's probably not good for his ego or mental wellbeing. Motherwell to Newcastle is a far bigger jump than Motherwell to Aberdeen.

[capt_oats]

1 hour ago, Swello said:

Yep - agree with all of the above - I'm just using them as examples of players that were really good/first name on the teamsheet types for us going on to be substitutes/squad meat in other leagues - it must just be well paid boredom and as @YassinMoutaouakil says, must be mentally quite hard.

Aye, I was just nit picking in so much as I'm not sure in the case of someone like Campbell (for example) his not being in the first team is necessarily down to relative ability. Although I agree that it's absolutely a result of his ability relative to the rest of his teammates compared to his competition at Fir Park (which I'd guess was your actual point).

Either way, I'd imagine it doesn't make it any less of a culture shock though.

To speak to @crazylegsjoe_mfc's point above someone like Gallagher is an interesting one in so much as he was clearly poor for us last season but still walked into the side...until Alexander pitched up and had no issue playing the bold Tyler ahead of him.

From that point his decline has been on two levels. He's gone from Motherwell captain/POTY/first name on the teamsheet and starting Scotland international to Aberdeen sub and bounced to the bench then straight out the squad with Scotland.

Edited October 19, 2021 by capt_oats

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

Apart from playing terribly, getting needlessly sent off in Israel, claiming he had a gun to his head with the contract extension and arguing with Motherwell fans from his own personal Facebook account, Gallagher was a great Motherwell captain.

[ropy]

41 minutes ago, crazylegsjoe_mfc said:

Apart from playing terribly, getting needlessly sent off in Israel, claiming he had a gun to his head with the contract extension and arguing with Motherwell fans from his own personal Facebook account, Gallagher was a great Motherwell captain.

Can’t remember, did his wife have any opinions?

[YassinMoutaouakil]

4 hours ago, Ron Aldo said:

I'd agree to an extent but your example is probably more suited to players at the very top rather than our level.

Using Gallagher as an example, he probably feels a bit shite at not playing but the £5k (just a guess) a week at Aberdeen probably softens the blow given he was probably on less than half of that with us.

Guys at our level won't be retiring at 35 to then spend the rest of their days on the beach or the golf course. That's why I don't really blame them going for more money, though it is a bit funny when they have a shite time of it from a football perspective.

Oh aye I wasn't meaning to knock anyone's motivations, I just think it must be a bit of a head f**k to be someone like Devante and scoring for (relative) fun in one league then go to another and struggle to get a look in. Even closer to home, I can't really imagine it's particularly nice being Connor Shields right now.

Edited October 19, 2021 by YassinMoutaouakil

[well fan for life]

1 minute ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

Oh aye I wasn't meaning to knock anyone's motivations, I just think it must be a bit of a head f**k to be someone like Devante and scoring for (relative) fun in one league then go to another and struggle to get a look in. Even closer to home, I can't really imagine it's particularly nice being Connor Shields right now.

Bet you feel real sorry for Lawleff. 

[stu92]

4 hours ago, welldaft said:

As for Polworth. Wonder if his missus has been tweeting her displeasure at him not starting . Not getting a game in a Killie team that have started to stutter a little.  Not what she had in mind……or Polworth for that matter. 

I know the general backstory but never saw the tweets or what the content of them was. Any kind individuals here able to enlighten?

[crazylegsjoe_mfc]

7 minutes ago, stu92 said:

I know the general backstory but never saw the tweets or what the content of them was. Any kind individuals here able to enlighten?

There was a tweet which said "Counting down the weeks until we can get out of this shithole and get home" or words to that effect. Then one saying "There are people in the world I hate and Graham Alexander is one of them". Again, can't remember the exact wording but it was along those lines.

[capt_oats]

1 hour ago, stu92 said:

I know the general backstory but never saw the tweets or what the content of them was. Any kind individuals here able to enlighten?

The amusing part of it is that she was firing these tweets off 10 minutes after the final whistle of games we won.

Polworth "opened up" about his time under Alexander and basically it turns out he ended up being told to f**k off and go and train with the weans. There's not a lot of self awareness in his wee chat with the P&J.

Quote

“I was offered a new contract just before January and I turned that down," Polworth told the Press and Journal.

"A few other things happened after that and things didn’t work out for multiple reasons, which is the best way for me to put it.

“So, once I had turned down the contract there, it then became a long and frustrating six months.”

“I played the first few games under the new manager and got sent off at Aberdeen and, after that, things didn’t go to plan.

“It has been an eye-opening six months. I have got to see the other side of football.

“At the age of 26, you are sent away to train with kids of 14 or 15. I am just glad it’s over and I can move on.”

Link

This was after he had turned down a new contract, was part of an XI that was literally bottom of the league, had a shitfit and got himself sent off against Aberdeen then phoned in one of the most abject performances you've seen against St Johnstone...

"a few other things happened"...no fucking shit Liam.

After the Aberdeen game we played 17 games without him in the team and only lost 4.

Edited October 19, 2021 by capt_oats