Motherwell FC - A Thread For All Seasons

[Desp]

32 minutes ago, scmwell said:

I agree no chance of it. Lee Erwin would be a perfect replacement for Main.

Someone who runs about a lot and scores around five goals a season. 

A perfect replacement, indeed. 

[Mr. Brightside]

Lee Erwin can f**k off, shite when he first played for us. Shiter now.

[Casagolda]

I’m not so sure we’re actually on holiday mode btw, although there may have been an element of that in yesterday’s display.

See outside of an excellent first 45 mins against Accies and an excellent last 20 mins against St.Johnstone at Fir Park, yesterday’s level of performance has been pretty much the norm from what I’ve seen since our winning streak ended. 

We keep the ball on the deck a lot more which is great but at the moment, it’s a lot of neat passing without any real cutting edge. We only have two genuine goal threats- Turnbull and Hastie, which is basically now just one goal threat since Hastie decided to chuck it.

On Scott, he took a bit of a battering from Kilgallon but I’d wager he’s learned more from that 75 mins than he would 75 games of reserve football. I’d stick with him next week, see if he can get himself a goal and see where it takes him. 

On the other hand, I thought all of four of our wide men were pretty abysmal and would have a tough time picking which two of them to I’d like to see start next week or for the rest of the season. 

[well fan for life]

It entirely passed me by yesterday but that was Danny Johnson patched from the match day squad (again).
I know Robinson was public about wanting to get the #YoungMotherwell boys involved but it seems notable that Sammon (who's clearly on his way back to Hearts) got the spot on the bench.
Putting 2+2 together I think we can safely say that's Main definitely away as well.

I said it a while back but I assume Johnson’s tea is oot here. I don’t think Robinson’s happy with his all around play and we’ll attempt a Bowman to see if we can get £4.50 off a Vanarama team.

Sammon’s a strange one. I’m not particularly bothered about his signing. I was underwhelmed at the time, and even more so now. Reckon he’ll get slung right back out on loan to a championship team and good luck to him.

[capt_oats]

5 hours ago, well fan for life said:

I said it a while back but I assume Johnson’s tea is oot here. I don’t think Robinson’s happy with his all around play and we’ll attempt a Bowman to see if we can get £4.50 off a Vanarama team.

Sammon’s a strange one. I’m not particularly bothered about his signing. I was underwhelmed at the time, and even more so now. Reckon he’ll get slung right back out on loan to a championship team and good luck to him.

 

Aye, the way I'm reading it is that Robinson's written off Johnson if we're continuing to push the 433 and try to make that work. He'll hopefully stick with Scott for the remaining fixtures since as @Casagolda says even if we do end up loaning him out next season he's going to learn far more from these starts than he will getting 20 mins off the bench.

Fully see him away in the summer for an 'undisclosed' fee to some mid-table League 2 mob.

If Main's away (which looks almost certain) then Sammon's really the only other option in terms of physicality.

On Sammon, he's ended up exactly as most folk predicted but I think he seems to have carried himself well as far as his attitude goes.

All of that begs the question where we go with forwards for next season.

I totally get the scepticism re: Erwin given the lack of goals but if we're sticking with 433  then I wouldn't be surprised if we were looking at someone who had a the same qualities in terms of height/build etc. I doubt it'd be Erwin given he's locked in a dark room in Iran at the moment and signed a 4 year deal (that he's clearly trying to get out of) but Robinson signed him for Oldham and he did end up their top scorer that season (10 in 40).

Who that is I've no idea but it seems clear we could do with someone with height, is physical (without just jumping into opposition CBs for 90 mins) and able to hold the ball, bring others into play, run the channels and chip in with double figures in goals. Good luck with that Robbo.

Basically, we're if we're sticking with this shape/style we're looking for the new Chris Porter rather than the new Moult.

Edited April 21, 2019 by capt_oats

[YassinMoutaouakil]

#AnnounceMurphy

[Desp]

3 hours ago, YassinMoutaouakil said:

#AnnounceMurphy

 

[Ron Aldo]

STV saying that Hastie will sign for Rangers this week.

Ah well. f**k him.

[Casagolda]

Not surprising, sadly it’s looked from the outside like his head got turned and disappeared up his own arse some time ago. 

I might be wrong, however does anyone else get the distinct impression the club aren’t all that fussed? By all accounts it sounds like they thought he had still had a fair bit to go when he came back from Alloa and his impact took most people at the club by surprise.

I mean 400k for somebody that’s had what, a half dozen or so good games for Motherwell? It’s not bad really. It’s roughly about what we got for Moult, three times what we got for Murphy and those two had about 100 goals between them for Motherwell.

I get that folk think if we had him tied down we could have made more money in the long term but it doesn’t always work that way unfortunately. Ideally I’d have liked to see him stay and develop but based on his performances for the last two months, I’ll happily take the money and at least put the whole tedious affair to bed finally.

If Cadden does join him and McKinstry departing this summer, we surely wouldn’t be far off netting a million quid for the three of them would we? 

Edited April 21, 2019 by Casagolda

[Gianfranco]

Hopefully the team that’s won f**k all can afford the 400k. Keep him on the bench for the remaining 4 games.

[RandomGuy.]

Getting £400k for a young lad who seemed to struggle like f**k for Airdrie, on the back of some newspaper hype, is great business.

Only loser here is Rangers who have spanked a decent amount of money on someone who wont make it, as Hastie will probably be making a fortune to sit in the stand.

[capt_oats]

It's kind of difficult to talk about Hastie and not sound like sour grapes given where he's ending up but it really is a massive shrug here.

As @Casagolda says it feels like the club aren't really that bothered. Yes they'd have liked him to stay and develop but I get the impression that they thought the amount they'd be due in compensation would be enough to put off other teams from shelling out for him. Which tells you a lot in itself. 

They seem genuinely surprised that someone is willing to pay £400k (if that's what it is) for him.

IIRC the nature of the development compensation means that the fee needs to be paid in full so if that's us getting a lump sum landing in the bank then...lovely. If we're able to bring in another £1m in player trading via the sales of Hastie, Cadden and McKinstry then that's the model working.

You'd think it'd also mean that we're able to retain Campbell and Div Turnbull and cash in on them next summer.

Ultimately we're getting more for Hastie than Dundee got for Kamara and Killie got for Jones. Which is a nice bit of perspective.

Our business model means we're aiming to sell on one or two assets each year so £400k for a boy who's played a handful of good games before reverting to a more natural level seems fine considering we got £500k for Moult, £300k for Henneghan, £450k-ish for Johnson (before the sell on) and c.£1m for Kipré (who had something like 2 years left on his deal).

Add to that the fact that we've struggled to find a buyer for Cadden even when he had hype (I think we kb'd £450k or something from Oxford) and you can legitimately ask how much more we'd have been likely to get for Hastie since his development could go either way.

Ultimately it's shite he's going to them but then again chucking the guts of £400k at a player who's played half a dozen good games is the most Sevco move going.

Edited April 21, 2019 by capt_oats

[Swello]

I actually think Hastie has the potential to be a cracking player - but there is no doubt that Rangers (assuming the press chat which was premature last time is actually right this time) are taking all the risk here. There have been lots of players that look like they have all the potential in the world and whoever signs him is basically doing so on the strength of good performances in a handful of  league games where he was unknown and no-one was setting up to nullify him.

I'm happy that we cash out to the tune of 400k.  

[well fan for life]

I'm not chipping in on Hastie because it's all been said. 

But @capt_oats reminding me we got £300k for Heneghan got an actual lol out of me. 

[welldaft]

I don’t blame Hastie for making this move at all. 

I wish it was not to Sevco, but they are prepared to offer him wages of a multiple of 6/7/8 times what he is on with us. 

The point being that if we are querying whether he will make a significant impact on the game then you cannot blame the lad taking the money on offer and a 3 year deal. 

He could stay with us, not kick on and never get the opportunity to earn that kind of money again. 

Good luck to him but I would have him on the bench at best over remaining games. 

 

[capt_oats]

55 minutes ago, Swello said:

I actually think Hastie has the potential to be a cracking player - but there is no doubt that Rangers (assuming the press chat which was premature last time is actually right this time) are taking all the risk here. There have been lots of players that look like they have all the potential in the world and whoever signs him is basically doing so on the strength of good performances in a handful of  league games where he was unknown and no-one was setting up to nullify him.

I'm happy that we cash out to the tune of 400k.  

100% and that will be true until the debt to Boyle and Hutchison is clear. 

The annoyance here is obviously that it's taken out our hands by the fact he's out of contract.

Even then, we get some sort of say in terms of reaching a compensation agreement so I don't really blame the club for being quite relaxed about the whole thing.

From Hastie's point of view? When he came back to the club in January he though he was seeing out the rest of the season on the bench getting 20 mins here or there behind Elliot Frear. I don't think even he saw a move like this actually materialising (and he seems a confident boy).

Realistically, if we play hypotheticals what would his Motherwell career have looked like had he signed an extension? He'd have signed, played another season and we'd probably have tried to cash in over the term of that deal. It's really a question of how much more we'd have been likely to get for him which is where the recent fees for the likes of Moult, Heneghan, Johnson and Kipré come in.

Yes, it's out our hands but I don't think we're actually that much down on the sort of fee we'd have been (hypothetically) expecting.

Ultimately though be best (and most sensible) way to frame this is against the likes of McCormack, Murphy, Reynolds and Hutchinson and the fact that we received less for them combined than we're quoting in compensation for Hastie.

As @well fan for life says though the topic has been well covered.  Absolutely buzzing for sections of Motherwell Twitter getting massively sanctimonious about the move though.

Edited April 21, 2019 by capt_oats

[Busta Nut]

Jake Hastie, meh!

[YassinMoutaouakil]

Tbh, people on here are about a thousand times more reasonable than Motherwell fans in general, but I think there's still some sour grapes leading to a lot of revisionism around Hastie. 

In the last four months , he's scored as many league goals as Chris Cadden managed in 111 games, Marvin Johnson in 50 odd, and as many as Lionel scored in all but one of his seasons. 

I've pretty much made my peace with him leaving and this isn't meant to have a dig at the club for losing him- that's been done to the death already- but folk acting like Hastie hasn't been the second or third most important part in our recent revival is bizarre to me.

[Silvio]

I think it's good business for Motherwell - albeit it seems the decision was made for them.

There is always a temptation to hold off for a big transfer fee but it really doesn't happen that often. 

Over the last 5 years we have lost Kenny McLean, John McGinn, Stephen Mallan, Lewis Morgan and Kyle McAllister. 

For the last 3 we got about £1m total. For McLean we let him go for £100k plus sell on, for McGinn it was a nominal PCA fee with Hibs but a 33% sell on.

So in total about £2m, after Villa bought McGinn.

McLean and McGinn could both be playing EPL football next year, but Mallan didn't do well at Barnsley, McAllister is back at us on loan from Derby and Morgan has been loaned out by Celtic already.

The disappointing thing for me is you don't have a sell on fee. Other than that its not bad business. 

There is solidarity fee of course if Rangers get big money and sell him on. Even now if Villa sell McGinn we get 3.5% of the fee regardless of any further payout from Hibs. 

[MJC]

 I think there's shades of Paul Slane a decade ago about Hastie here. He bursts into the first team, does well, shows alot of potential but interest from elsewhere has turned his head very quickly. 

Only time will tell if this is a good move for the player but that's not our concern anymore.

Personally though, I wish him luck and am glad it's Rangers and not Celtic that he (looks like) joining.