Election Night

[Antlion]

I gave up believing these "people would support independence IF" polls when the Tories won the UK GE. Remember all those referendum polls that showed independence support would rise to c60% if the Tories were to get a future majority? To counter them, Miliband tried to argue that Labour winning was inevitable and even Ruthie claimed it was unlikely the Tories would win in 2015. Well, the Tories *did* win, the rUK *did* impose a majority Tory government on us (and look like doing so for a long time), and yet this massive Indy surge hasn't automatically appeared.

Scottish respondents to polls that ask if they'd support independence under certain future circumstances are bullshitters. When those circumstances eventuate, they shit themselves and the braggartliness crumbles at the prospect of actually doing something other than being the UK's bitch.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

 

Its a fact, that's what polls show. The electorate wants a referendum, so we should have another one asap.

Rofl

[DeeTillEhDeh]

In PR elections it's harder to rack up a lot of seats.

He was talking about constituency seats elected by FPTP - the same as UK elections.

[pandarilla]

 

I think its naive as f**k tbh to think independence is inevitable, the Tories are asset stripping Scotland as we speak, we will be on our knees financially by the time they're done and independence will seem ludicrous to soft no's.

All the while the unionist press will be creating the anti-independence narrative and snp bad.

Polls show in the event of Brexit independence gets the support of around 60% of people, no poll in any circumstance ever has come remotely close to that, with Brexit we win by a mile, without it its anybody's guess.

And demographics don't mean much in ten years with the unionist government and media spending the next ten years undermining the cause.

Where is this polling information? Wishful thinking imo. Why do you think Nicola has been so tepid when forced on the issue? She knows it's far too soon.

The press are dying. Newspapers are fucked, especially the likes of the daily record. Social media eats that up in ten years.

The yes campaign needs to build a stronger economic case (for the soft no's). Personally, I think they need bolder policies.

[forever_blue]

^ my team sevco 5088

Most west end student snp voters

"Dad I hate the Tories "

" right son , I will pick you up in the new Mercedes this weekend , your mother has cous cous to go with the dinner on Friday night, I hope you haven't gone to overboard on your allowance , "

[forever_blue]

Most Glaswegian snp supporters

"So what appeals to you dad about the snp's manifesto"

"Chunky ar la , albu gu brah , freedom . wee man "

[Southside Hibee]

Most Glaswegian snp supporters

"So what appeals to you dad about the snp's manifesto"

"Chunky ar la , albu gu brah , freedom . wee man "

 

Sadly that is what Scottish politics amounts to now - the constitution takes precendent importance over substance, sadly.

[mjw]

Is the bralt locked again?

[Glen Sannox]

He really does have some temper. Holds him back in life I reckon because he is a good writer with a very sharp mind.

You see the SNP taking on lesser people as advisors and whatnot but Stuart can hardly be surprised given his temperament.

His temper comes from the fact that he is an ugly, gaming geek who has little or no chance of ever getting his end away. That, and being an SNP dick.

[Antlion]

Sadly that is what Scottish politics amounts to now - the constitution takes precendent importance over substance, sadly.

Could it not just possibly be that the constitutional position of a country dictates a lot of national policy, given the way the UK operates as a unitary state with partial devolution of some important things, some unimportant things, whilst retaining some important things, some unimportant things?

Most countries don't have this question hanging over them because they're not just devolved regions of larger countries. It is the elephant in the room, and Scotland can hardly ignore it and get on with being a devolved bit of North Britain as long as it identifies itself as a nation whose sovereign parliaments are provided by a larger neighbouring nation, with whom it is in a three-hundred-year-old political union. The *only* alternatives are a proper constitutional reworking (e.g. federalism or Devo Max), independence, the abolition of Holyrood and complete absorption into a country of Great Britain or (unlikely) mass amnesia and people forgetting that Scotland's nationhood has ever been debated.

[Mr Rational]

Interesting take on Ash Denham's campaign...

I was at one of the Edinburgh Eastern hustings & I wasn't impressed whatsoever with Ash, she was the weakest link of the constituency candidates. However, I did vote for Ash yesterday, I must say that I didn't vote for her because I was impressed by the calibre of her abilities, she only received my vote to stop Kezia Dugdale from winning the constituency.

She was bested by everybody including Kez at the hustings. No doubt she would point to the poll and go 'see, I romped home', but the local campaign was one of the worst I have ever witnessed, and I saw Neil Hay's last year round - she got in on the rosette rather than her own actions.

I held my nose and voted for her for the exact same reasons, saying that, Kez winning would have given the branch the kick up the arse it so badly needs - I actually know branch members of long standing that voted labour specifically for that reason. These are people I have known and campaigned with for years, they are not newcomers or people who change allegiances lightly so it shows how bad it was.

BTW, Kenny is currently on his holidays, I was speaking to his missus last night, he's certainly not missing the fiasco back home and I don't blame him.

[Southside Hibee]

She was bested by everybody including Kez at the hustings. No doubt she would point to the poll and go 'see, I romped home', but the local campaign was one of the worst I have ever witnessed, and I saw Neil Hay's last year round - she got in on the rosette rather than her own actions.

I held my nose and voted for her for the exact same reasons, saying that, Kez winning would have given the branch the kick up the arse it so badly needs - I actually know branch members of long standing that voted labour specifically for that reason. These are people I have known and campaigned with for years, they are not newcomers or people who change allegiances lightly so it shows how bad it was.

BTW, Kenny is currently on his holidays, I was speaking to his missus last night, he's certainly not missing the fiasco back home and I don't blame him.

 

The whole sending her children to private school fiasco, was very awkward to watch at the hustings.

 

Also, a young child asked Ash for an apology over something that was said about the named persons scheme - apparently Lloyd Quinan represented Ash at a hustings that she couldn't attend, when he was asked about the named persons scheme, he supposedly said that it wasn't 'mandatory'. Ash didn't exactly handle the situation gracefully to say the least.

 

Kenny MacAskill will be sorely missed, I know that he is divivise character because of the whole centralised police Scotland debacle, but he was a great public servant to our constituency.

 

I am a member of the Eastern branch myself also, I have been put of form going to branch meetings because of some of the posturing of activists in my local area.

[Mr Rational]

That would be Lloyd then?

[orlandoblue]

Why aren't the Tories concerned that the UK is a one party state given the state of the opposition? They seemed to think Labour being so shite in Scotland made it a one party pretendy state, and that this was bad for democracy.

Because like almost all politicians / parties they can be hypocritical when ever it suits them

[Mr Rational]

Oh yeah, join Leith or Leith walk would be my advice at the moment.

[Southside Hibee]

Could it not just possibly be that the constitutional position of a country dictates a lot of national policy, given the way the UK operates as a unitary state with partial devolution of some important things, some unimportant things, whilst retaining some important things, some unimportant things?

Most countries don't have this question hanging over them because they're not just devolved regions of larger countries. It is the elephant in the room, and Scotland can hardly ignore it and get on with being a devolved bit of North Britain as long as it identifies itself as a nation whose sovereign parliaments are provided by a larger neighbouring nation, with whom it is in a three-hundred-year-old political union. The *only* alternatives are a proper constitutional reworking (e.g. federalism or Devo Max), independence, the abolition of Holyrood and complete absorption into a country of Great Britain or (unlikely) mass amnesia and people forgetting that Scotland's nationhood has ever been debated.

 

I think that people are so entrenched in their views on the constitution, that anytime it is brought up, it leads to a heated and very tiring debate on the matter.

 

I used my regional vote for the Scottish Liberal Democrats, the reason being that they ran a substantive campaign and had an authentic policy on the issue of more attention and investment needing to be shown to mental health. The other major party leaders all seemed to get drawn into a mud slinging match over a future referendum, whilst Willie Rennie kept to policy.

[Antlion]

I think that people are so entrenched in their views on the constitution, that anytime it is brought up, it leads to a heated and very tiring debate on the matter.

I used my regional vote for the Scottish Liberal Democrats, the reason being that they ran a substantive campaign and had an authentic policy on the issue of more attention and investment needing to be shown to mental health. The other major party leaders all seemed to get drawn into a mud slinging match over a future referendum, whilst Willie Rennie kept to policy.

He was like a demented circus monkey on the subject in the last debate.

[AUFC90]

I think that people are so entrenched in their views on the constitution, that anytime it is brought up, it leads to a heated and very tiring debate on the matter.

I used my regional vote for the Scottish Liberal Democrats, the reason being that they ran a substantive campaign and had an authentic policy on the issue of more attention and investment needing to be shown to mental health. The other major party leaders all seemed to get drawn into a mud slinging match over a future referendum, whilst Willie Rennie kept to policy.

Aye right enough, he only mentioned indy ref 2 about 15,000 times over the past couple of months.

[Southside Hibee]

That would be Lloyd then?

 

I can only go by ancedotal information, but yes, apparently Lloyd Quinan represented Ash at the said hustings were an inaccurate statement was made on logistics of named persons scheme Ash was asked at a later debate to disavow & apologise for distorted statement.

[Southside Hibee]

He was like a demented circus monkey on the subject in the last debate.

 

He had a brief outburst on the constiutution in that debate, a very impassioned one to say the least. However over the course of campaigning, he kept to substance.