General Politics Thread

[renton]

So, on balance of probabilities it was a state action, which in many ways makes me optimistic for the future. After all, these two geniuses are hardly Red Grant - took the most lethal nerve agent on the planet and managed not to kill the target....

[Granny Danger]

2 hours ago, Jdog said:

Never heard of anyone using Novichok at the gym.

That means your not gay... 

[Detournement]

3 hours ago, Jdog said:

Never heard of anyone using Novichok at the gym.

It was all over the guys hotel room so i'm guessing it's a bit like poppers.

[jagfox]

Innocent, imo...

[jagfox]

...maybe not?

[DeeTillEhDeh]

The translation of the interview sounded like someone reading the Wiki page on Salisbury.

 

But Zetterlund will still says it's two Russian civilians.

 

 

[Zetterlund]

4 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

The translation of the interview sounded like someone reading the Wiki page on Salisbury.

 

But Zetterlund will still says it's two Russian civilians.

No I wont, because I don't know and I don't make claims not backed up by evidence. UK intelligence says they're GRU and the Russians say they're not, both lie all the time, and due to the nature of the allegations we'll likely never find out.

There are still multiple possible scenarios. Maybe the dodgy duo are assassins from the GRU, or they're assassins sent by someone else, or they're not the assassins but connected to the people who are, or they had nothing to do with it. For one thing, the confirmed timeline of the events makes it almost impossible that they poisoned the door handle, but they may have poisoned the Skripals elsewhere.

[welshbairn]

Putin's trolling or the GRU are even more arrogant and/or incompetent than I thought. Why give them sequential passport numbers for a start? And reserve multiple flights home on different days in the same names? "Look boys, good job. Now, for Mother Russia, just one more thing, it will make the West crazy. Go on TV and hint that you're gay. Don't worry, Craig Murray will have your back. LOL!"

[Detournement]

https://www.heraldscotland.com/news/16735745.police-scotland-accused-of-trying-to-turn-young-football-fans-into-paid-informant/

Police Scotland need reigned in.

[Jambo: First Blood]

21 hours ago, Zetterlund said:

No I wont, because I don't know and I don't make claims not backed up by evidence. UK intelligence says they're GRU and the Russians say they're not, both lie all the time, and due to the nature of the allegations we'll likely never find out.

There are still multiple possible scenarios. Maybe the dodgy duo are assassins from the GRU, or they're assassins sent by someone else, or they're not the assassins but connected to the people who are, or they had nothing to do with it. For one thing, the confirmed timeline of the events makes it almost impossible that they poisoned the door handle, but they may have poisoned the Skripals elsewhere.

How much of the actual evidence on this have you looked at? 

This is obviously a Russian state hit. The RT interview all but confirms it in its brazenness.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2018/09/14/skripal-poisoning-suspects-passport-data-shows-link-security-services/

Edited September 16, 2018 by Jambo: First Blood

[Zetterlund]

6 hours ago, Jambo: First Blood said:

How much of the actual evidence on this have you looked at? 

This is obviously a Russian state hit. The RT interview all but confirms it in its brazenness.

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/uk-and-europe/2018/09/14/skripal-poisoning-suspects-passport-data-shows-link-security-services/

I'd be surprised If there was anything on this case I hadn't seen. It's not 'obviously' a Russian state hit, although it's possible, which is what I've said all along. I just think it's very unlikely, and the more evidence becomes public the more questions it raises.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

That Craig Murray guy is a fucking zoomer eh?

[Savage Henry]

I'd be surprised If there was anything on this case I hadn't seen. It's not 'obviously' a Russian state hit, although it's possible, which is what I've said all along. I just think it's very unlikely, and the more evidence becomes public the more questions it raises.

It is though. Consecutively numbered passports can only really come from one place.

[Jdog]

5 hours ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

That Craig Murray guy is a fucking zoomer eh?

Craig Murray in Russian means Zutterlund.

[sparky88]

On 13/09/2018 at 18:33, Highland Capital said:

With talk of the previous right wing SNP stance decades ago, I have wondered in the past if the Scottish independence debate loses something by not having a mainstream centre-right voice.  The independence movement at this time is the SNP who are by-and-large centrist and the Greens who are left wing, along with the likes of the SSP and Margo MacDonald being elected in the past.  The left to centre spectrum is pretty much covered, but who can persuade those on the centre-right?  If you look at other independence movements (such as Catalonia), their support comes from across the spectrum.  We don't seem to have that here and while such a party wouldn't be to my taste, I do wonder if the Yes movement as a whole is weakened by not having this voice.

The only ones filling this type of gap in the market are the pro-independence, pro-Brexit Scottish Libertarian Party but they are absolute lunatics.

Yes cant win unless they appeal to the centre right. Its why the economic argument for independence is so important. 

[git-intae-thum]

It would be a mistake for the SNP itself to move to the right.

Far better it maintains its left social democratic stance.

There does need to be greater input from the right with regards to the independence movement. I would not want a whole new party competing for the independnece vote, however groups like business for Scotland could presumably expand and be more vocal.

[k-ton]

1 hour ago, sparky88 said:

Yes cant win unless they appeal to the centre right. Its why the economic argument for independence is so important. 

I'd rather we dispensed with the idea that you have to be to the right of centre to have economic competence.  A coherent left of centre economic policy is perfectly possible without lurching to some kind of socialist paradise.

[NotThePars]

The last ten years should highlight that the centre-right don’t have any claim to economic competence.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

Craig Murray in Russian means Zutterlund.

Those guys are quite clearly Russian intelligence officers, nothing they’ve said makes sense, they were obviously on a recce the day before. Their story lacks any credibility, why if you’re on a holiday are you booking multiple return flights? Why in the tourist capital of the UK did they only visit one city on a weekend stay? Then there are the obvious mistakes and flaws in their reasons for returning to Salisbury the next day.
Consecutive passport numbers on their own arent too alarming but given the circumstances suggest something state led.
As for perfume bottles not being in luggage, I wouldnt expect that they brought the perfume in, simply put it in a diplomatic bag and bring it in via the embassy and do a hand off outside or leave it somewhere.
The fact images seem to be circulating of the men with Putin also rings alarms, I had no idea the most powerful man on earth would meet with guys who sell vitamins at a low level, think about how hard direct access to Putin must have been in the last ten years.
Nah the whole thing reeks of state action and anyone who doesnt see that needs to take the tin foil hat off.

[Fullerene]

IMO: This is similar to the Litvinenko murder.

The Russians carry out the attack in such a way to make it obvious to everyone except the apologists.

Then when everybody points the finger at them, they say "No.  A big boy did it and ran away".
This takes advantage of the fact that Putin is not that big.