Ibrox Disaster 1971....Were you there?

[Lurkst]

2 hours ago, welshbairn said:

Aye, the BBC fairly soft soaped the contribution of Rangers' negligence and the reaction of the authorities.

On the other hand Rangers fans I know are unhappy that the BBC were putting the finger of blame on the club.

Obviously Rangers do have to take responsibility due to the fact it happened at their ground, but safety shortcomings at big stadia were widespread at the time and the club (Wille Waddell in particular) deserve credit for addressing the situation years before the Taylor Report. 

 

Edited December 29, 2020 by Lurkst

[Drew Brees]

10 minutes ago, Lurkst said:

On the other hand Rangers fans I know are unhappy that the BBC were putting the finger of blame on the club.

Obviously Rangers do have to take responsibility due to the fact it happened at their ground, but safety shortcomings at big stadia were widespread at the time and the club (Wille Waddell in particular) deserve credit for addressing the situation years before the Taylor Report. 

 

The official inquiry led by Sheriff Irvine Smith sat for 14 days and was severely critical of Rangers directors, whose evidence was confused, contradictory and increasingly unimpressive. There was the vaguest recollection of previous accidents and no-one, for example, could remember who accompanied Chief Superintendent Nicholson in inspecting the stairway months previously. Sheriff Smith concluded with a savage indictment :

The said accident was due to the fault and negligence of the defenders, Rangers Football Club. So far as the evidence is concerned, the Board never so much as considered that it ought to apply its mind to the question of safety on that particular stairway, and would appear – I put it no higher – to have proceeded on the view that if the problem was ignored long enough it would eventually go away. Indeed it goes further than this because certain of their actions can only be interpreted as a deliberate and apparently successful attempt to deceive others that they were doing something, when in fact they were doing nothing. Rarely can an organisation of the size and significance of Rangers Football Club have succeeded in conducting their business with records so sparse, so carelessly kept, so inaccurately written up and so indifferently stored. (Damages Statement, National Records of Scotland, Ref: SC36/1972/1/3) Sheriff J Irvine Smith 

Smith found Rangers FC guilty on four counts in the case of the death of Charles Dougan, a 31-year-old boilermaker from Clydebank who died, as did 56 others, from traumatic asphyxia. After hearing of a series of accidents on Stairway 13 including September 1961 when there were 70 people injured and 2 deaths, September 1967 when 11 people were taken to hospital, and January 1969 when 30 people were injured. No action was taken against the club or of any individual in the matter of this specific incident.

Indeed it goes further than this because certain of their actions can only be interpreted as a deliberate and apparently successful attempt to deceive others that they were doing something, when in fact they were doing nothing.

 

Edited December 29, 2020 by Drew Brees

[steelmen]

The bbc site has a long read about the 8 young boys from fife who went to the game and the 5 who were rangers fans never came home.

It’s hard to wrap your head around those times with no phones in houses never mind mobiles. You can only begin to think what the family’s were going through as family members came home late or not at all.

It’s easy to blame the fans or the club but by the sounds of all clubs were as bad in not looking after fans. What is amazing is it took until Hillsbourgh for something to be done properly about it

[HibsFan]

I think we can at once both blame the directors of Rangers for an obvious failing in addressing the concerns re Stairway 13, while also recognising that just about every club in Britain had the same lax attitude to supporter safety.

That’s not to say that those directors shouldn’t be recognised as accountable - it’s insulting the intelligence of the 66’s family and friends to simply shrug shoulders and say “just one of them” - but the stories my Grandad told me about going to Hibs in the late 40s/early 50s made it sound like a frightening experience. The 2nd Jan 1950 Edinburgh derby against Hearts (a record crowd of 65,000+) was delayed for a short while due to crushes, I’m sure? Can’t find any articles about it at the moment.

Anyway, it doesn’t sit right with me seeing the following two things. 1) a % of Rangers fans accusing the BBC of presenting facts (if anything watered down) that showed Rangers’ board were somewhat culpable for these deaths and indeed the deaths of 1961. 2) Celtic fans discussing it as if it’s just another chapter of the resolution 12 fiasco. People lost lives, and I think it deserves more gravitas than that.

Watched the documentary this morning and it’s a very difficult watch, especially the Markinch stuff. That feeling described of not seeing them come off the last train that night, powerful beyond belief.

RIP the 66, and I do hope that Rangers can remember their absence in a dignified manner, and as Kincardine says, maybe that needs to take the form of recognising the mistakes made by the Rangers board of the 60s.

[Jacksgranda]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/extra/B0cJMZS3B1/Fiveboys

Heartbreaking read.

[Dundee Hibernian]

Almost fifty years on, the foggy pictures on monochrome television that night from Ibrox still flit around my head, when the disaster is mentioned. Dundee United's derby match at Dens the same day had been postponed, the usual when there was no football was to watch the wrestling at four and results at five, with my grandpa. I became upset watching him, slowly realising the gravity of the situation.

A fortnight later United were at Ibrox for the first match Rangers had played since the tragedy, the atmosphere being quite muted, this reflected in the poignant programme produced for the game. Handed out at the turnstiles, it was a single folded sheet, printed in black ink on white, rather like an order of service which mourners are offered at a funeral.

It listed the names of the 66 victims.

[Tutankhamen]

20 minutes ago, Dundee Hibernian said:

Almost fifty years on, the foggy pictures on monochrome television that night from Ibrox still flit around my head, when the disaster is mentioned. Dundee United's derby match at Dens the same day had been postponed, the usual when there was no football was to watch the wrestling at four and results at five, with my grandpa. I became upset watching him, slowly realising the gravity of the situation.

A fortnight later United were at Ibrox for the first match Rangers had played since the tragedy, the atmosphere being quite muted, this reflected in the poignant programme produced for the game. Handed out at the turnstiles, it was a single folded sheet, printed in black ink on white, rather like an order of service which mourners are offered at a funeral.

It listed the names of the 66 victims.

A certain young player on the Dundee Utd books was at the game and stood in the vicinity of the Stairway 13 exit. His name, Walter Smith.

[Tutankhamen]

On 5 December 2020 at 22:13, BillyAnchor said:

https://www.theguardian.com/news/2020/dec/03/rangers-football-forgotten-tragedy-ibrox-stadium-disaster-glasgow?CMP=fb_gu&utm_medium=Social&utm_source=Facebook&fbclid=IwAR3Z3BQSe_8Q1noHa11Vr9FHbQntTdLoEnIfiMWX7Es6_G0MVCV58sVPTfU#Echobox=1607003053 

One or two myths in that article. You didn't need a union pass to go from one end of the terracing to the other back in those days.

[The Mantis]

8 hours ago, Tutankhamen said:

One or two myths in that article. You didn't need a union pass to go from one end of the terracing to the other back in those days.

St Andrew's ambualncemen in Scotland, not St John's.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

On 03/01/2020 at 21:44, NUMBER 7 said:

As a 10 year old at the time, I can clearly remember the day this tragic event happened. The previous day January 1st Falkirk had beaten Rangers 3-1 at Brockville. The next day my father, myself, and his two mates headed off in the car to see Falkirk play Airdrie at Broomfield. There had been a hard frost overnight and about 1.00 pm the game at Airdrie was postponed. That Saturday afternoon plans then changed to my father and his two mates and I then taking in the East Stirlingshire v Patrick Thistle match at Firs Park which Thistle won 2-0. 

On returning home around 6.00 pm The grainy black and white pictures on the Scottish News were being broadcast, the images were poor quality but the magnitude of what had happened was becoming clear, the house had a silence that had totally replaced the happiness of New Year and having beaten Rangers the day before. 

A truly tragic day in Scottish Football. 

I was 11 years old and from memory Clyde either did not have a game or were away as I did not go to Shawfield. Instead we were at my grandmother's house on the Gallowgate with my parents and young sister. My mum's brother was at the game with his pals near that stairwell (probably because Clyde were not playing). When the news came through it was quite upsetting for all and 50 years on I can remember the family mood that evening. 

I watched the programme earlier this week with my wife and daughter who know nothing of football or this disaster and I could see the TV programme was affecting them as they watched. 

I won't forget it. I remember being at Hampden with 134,000, and the W. Germany game in 1969 in particular, and being a bit panicky leaving Hampden that night (as a 9 year old) as we tried to get out of Mount Florida and the crowds all trying to move in different directions. 

There but for the grace of god.....

 

[The Mantis]

1 hour ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

I was 11 years old and from memory Clyde either did not have a game or were away as I did not go to Shawfield. Instead we were at my grandmother's house on the Gallowgate with my parents and young sister. My mum's brother was at the game with his pals near that stairwell (probably because Clyde were not playing). When the news came through it was quite upsetting for all and 50 years on I can remember the family mood that evening. 

I watched the programme earlier this week with my wife and daughter who know nothing of football or this disaster and I could see the TV programme was affecting them as they watched. 

I won't forget it. I remember being at Hampden with 134,000, and the W. Germany game in 1969 in particular, and being a bit panicky leaving Hampden that night (as a 9 year old) as we tried to get out of Mount Florida and the crowds all trying to move in different directions. 

There but for the grace of god.....

I was in many crushes at Ibrox and Hampden around that time. Usually at Ibrox it was getting out of the ground, it was usually fine on the terracing during the game, but at Hampden more often I was shiteing it during the game if I couldn't get in front of a barrier, as there were these huge surges, and you could end up about 20 steps down if there was a goal or even a near miss. Plus the uneven steps with the railway sleepers. Hampden had exits all round so you could escape onto the grass on the way out.  I think at Parkhead it was different as you came off the terracing at street level.
But strangely the scariest time was a Dumbarton v Rangers game at Boghead, just approaching the turnstiles to get in. The whole street was full of people,  and as you got nearer it got worse. The Dumbarton fans will remember the street better than me, think it was a dead end. Coming out of Tynecastle could be a bit tight, and then there was the bridge at Easter Road 

[O'Kelly Isley III]

I was in many crushes at Ibrox and Hampden around that time. Usually at Ibrox it was getting out of the ground, it was usually fine on the terracing during the game, but at Hampden more often I was shiteing it during the game if I couldn't get in front of a barrier, as there were these huge surges, and you could end up about 20 steps down if there was a goal or even a near miss. Plus the uneven steps with the railway sleepers. Hampden had exits all round so you could escape onto the grass on the way out.  I think at Parkhead it was different as you came off the terracing at street level.
But strangely the scariest time was a Dumbarton v Rangers game at Boghead, just approaching the turnstiles to get in. The whole street was full of people,  and as you got nearer it got worse. The Dumbarton fans will remember the street better than me, think it was a dead end. Coming out of Tynecastle could be a bit tight, and then there was the bridge at Easter Road [emoji23]

There were two turnstile entrances to Boghead, Miller Street and Boghead Avenue, and both were seriously ill-equipped to deal with big attendances. Miller Street was the main entrance just off the A82 and had vehicle access and was generally better policed. Boghead Avenue was/is in a housing scheme and was the entrance fans alighting at Dumbarton East station would use. Invariably a turnstile or two would be kaput and the result was a free for all, and a nightmare for the folk who lived there. I'd suggest this was where you arrived at, and I'm not surprised you have a grim memory of it.

[Tutankhamen]

4 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

There were two turnstile entrances to Boghead, Miller Street and Boghead Avenue, and both were seriously ill-equipped to deal with big attendances. Miller Street was the main entrance just off the A82 and had vehicle access and was generally better policed. Boghead Avenue was/is in a housing scheme and was the entrance fans alighting at Dumbarton East station would use. Invariably a turnstile or two would be kaput and the result was a free for all, and a nightmare for the folk who lived there. I'd suggest this was where you arrived at, and I'm not surprised you have a grim memory of it.

Tbf Boghead was a glorified Junior ground.

[Arch Stanton]

This was Rangers response to the 71 disaster. They replaced the side fences with rails and put a big sign at the top reminding fans to be careful.

[O'Kelly Isley III]

Tbf Boghead was a glorified Junior ground.

TBF that's an observation that could be made of a number of lower division grounds, some of which are still with us - Cliftonhill, Recreation Park, Firs Park, Glebe Park, Central Park for example.
FWIW, the worst experience I ever had was before and during the Wales v Scotland game at Anfield in 1977, that was a very sobering experience.

[Lurkst]

3 hours ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

FWIW, the worst experience I ever had was before and during the Wales v Scotland game at Anfield in 1977, that was a very sobering experience.

Yeah I've heard a few stories about that night. The Tartan Army certainly enjoyed a rumble back then.

 

[Drew Brees]

10 hours ago, Arch Stanton said:

This was Rangers response to the 71 disaster. They replaced the side fences with rails and put a big sign at the top reminding fans to be careful.

Shame they didn’t respond to previous incidents in that area, many lives might’ve been saved. 

[AJF]

I always like to take a walk round to the memorial ahead of the match closest to the anniversary. It’s always quiet as everyone takes a moment to pay their respects and I get a little bit of comfort seeing the tributes, messages and flowers.

It’s overwhelming to imagine being caught up in a tragic accident like that. I think the closest experience I could relate to it was being at the fan zone in Manchester for the UEFA cup final. My dad and I spent only 15 minutes there before we decided to leave and find a pub as it was chaos.

That was obviously nothing compared to the Ibrox disaster but the short time there has helped me appreciate a little more how terrifying and tragic the disaster was.

[Flybhoy]

First ever Celtic game I attended was the 1985 Scottish Cup final against Dundee United, back then the turnstiles behind the goal at the Celtic end of Hampden were at the top of the stairs, on a stairway very similar to the one at Ibrox. 

It was advertised in that mornings papers you could pay at the gate behind the goal so my dad decided to take me and my older brother, I was 8, he was 17. Obviously thousands had the same last minute decision to go to the match and I remember how rammed the stairway leading up to those turnstiles were, a slip or fall that could have caused a similar tragedy, the terracing behind the goal was also dangerously overcrowded and I saw very little of the game being so small, having only been to a couple of Stirling Albion matches up till then I was totally perplexed and frankly, scared by the dangerous overcrowding and general unsafe terracing and stairways.

That Ibrox was the only major stadium disaster we had in Scotland is really quite staggering when you think back to the conditions of stadiums and approaches to them in that era, Celtic fans  were also in a nearly disastrous crush in a UEFA Cup tie at Nottingham Forest around then, sadly it took more deaths at Bradford and Hillsborough for crowd safety to be properly addressed eventually. 

[Howlin' Wilf]

16 hours ago, Arch Stanton said:

This was Rangers response to the 71 disaster. They replaced the side fences with rails and put a big sign at the top reminding fans to be careful.

.....as a precursor to demolishing three quarters of the stadium and rebuilding it as a seated arena to be fair.