patriot1 Posted January 23, 2016 Share Posted January 23, 2016 Sean Murdoch was the centre half. I believe Dobie was suspended after being sent off against Kelty. He'll be back next week if we have a game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blairhsmith Posted January 23, 2016 Share Posted January 23, 2016 Hot off the press. We have another home game next week. Superleague fixture against Penicuik. (Rearranged as previous East of Scotland Cup fixture against Linlithgow is postponed). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayser Posted January 23, 2016 Share Posted January 23, 2016 Excellent news Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigP Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Sean Murdoch was the centre half. I believe Dobie was suspended after being sent off against Kelty. He'll be back next week if we have a game.still got another game out I'm afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagtag Posted January 24, 2016 Share Posted January 24, 2016 Great result/performance from the saints yesterday. Also fantastic to see Robbie Holden scoring for jeanfield Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayser Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 Anyone here if Maguires playing for Fife Thistle then St Andrews ammies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sookit Posted January 26, 2016 Share Posted January 26, 2016 Seen he was playing with fife thistle the other week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PortWine Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Whole committee should have resigned. Then they might be a decent club NOT A CLUE as far as football is concerned! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Mantis Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 How's the weather looking up there for the Cuikie game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Ex Secretary Mark Johnson's article which is featured on the juniors.info website Sure neither party will mind it being copied on here. The lowland League plan may certainly interest some. Anyone who sits down with former Aberdeen, Inverness and Dunfermline defender Phil McGuire realises very quickly that he is a scholar of the beautiful game. He studies everything about the game and is knowledgeable on every aspect, whether it is on or off field matters. He has been tipped by many as a potential top level manager, however, six weeks ago his journey to the top hit a kink in the road as he was unceremoniously sacked by East Region Junior Super League side St Andrews United. So far McGuire has kept his own council on his dismissal but he is now ready to talk and we sat down during the week for a chat. Phil, it has been just over a month since St Andrews United sacked you, what reasons were you given for your dismissal? “I believe there is a bit of confusion, to the extent that when I actually met with the club, I was forced to read in in the local press on the same day that the sacking was due to the lack of young players coming through the system. Well I can safely say that there is no youth system at St Andrews, there was no system prior to when I took over or when I left. I was actively involved with other affiliates within the community club and wider areas and looked to change that situation. In the 16 months of being involved we ran several open training sessions for coaches and players, formed links with St Monans Spurs, because a lot of their players knew that their club was going to fold and we managed to get some in to train with us and gave them some guidance. We had 3 or 4 that actually made debuts for United in pre-season games at the start of this season. We also had two or three on delayed contracts with a view to working with them during the second half of this season to enable them to hit the ground running prior to pre-season for season 2016/17. We also managed to have meetings with St Andrews Colts where there under 16’s were moving up to under 17’s, obviously in the first year mistakes would be made but these could be corrected and passed down the line to the younger age groups coming through. Therefore, I do not agree with that we were making progress with the youth players and beginning to bring them through. ” Were there any other reasons you were given? “I understand that it was considered that I had brought the club in to disrepute after I was reported by the referee in my last game against Broxburn and I shouted at the referee and assistants too much. Well the East Region at a hearing cleared me of any offence and I am sorry but when was the last time you did not see a manager having a go at the officials. That would be very poor and to be officially told that the club had not progressed under my management I find disrespectful not to me as I can handle that but to the Players and the back room team of Stevie, Daryn, Andy. There was clear progression as they were relegated into the Premier and were struggling to find any players to fulfil fixtures when we took over. Those players achieved every short term target, and we were well on course of longer term both on and off the park. Nothing was a surprise to me or the squad on where we were currently.” Do you think the club were asking too much for youth or amateur players to be able to come straight in to a Super League side? There is no direct structure for youths and amateurs to progress unless you are aligned with a community club of some sort and that’s what I was trying to do at St Andrews. Its not necessary to run within a Community Club, you could have the Community Clubs all trying to get the same outcome but working in there own direction. If you can get one or two youngsters coming through that system especially at the 17’s or 19’s level then that’s great, it represents a structure that is working. Parents and players are seeing that they are getting a chance at Junior level, being looked after etc. and that is the main aim.” “It would be great to be able to field a team of lads 17’s and 19’s who are fearless but what you get is that they have not developed yet, not understood the game and not had the games at that level, so you need to blood those young players steadily and carefully, with a blend of experienced players.” “We had young players as well, Darren Clarkson, we took him from Dundee United. Now that probably sends out the clearest signal of the progressions. I sat down with his Mum and Dad and explained they progression and how it would work, finishing up in 3 years with Darren looking to go back senior. You also have young Keiran Sturrock, who had almost fell out with football, fed up with training. On his day Kieran could be playing at the highest level but he needed to like playing again and we gave him that. Along with the key contacts at senior level and the youthful players we had within the squad from these senior clubs” There was obviously a bigger picture that some people could not see but what was the ultimate goal and do you think that the club progressed towards it? “The ultimate goal as far as I was concerned was moving the club towards the prospect of the Lowland League and which division we were in to do that was irrelevant but that’s where we were looking for the 2017/18 season. That was the ambition, it may not have happened, we may have found another way of progressing the club but that was the target. “ “Do I think I progressed the club? yes I do” “When I took over the club we had two or three league games and a cup game to play, we had Tayport to play twice, in the league and cup and Camelon away. I remember the cup game, we came in at half time 2-0 down and I told the players without them causing us a problem we had gifted them two goals. We pulled a goal back in the second half, had a goal disallowed for offside which was dodgy at least but we pummelled them. I knew then that the squad lacked that bit of belief. We went on to win two league games against Tayport and Camelon at home and then drew down at Camelon. I knew that there would be boys leaving due to various factors but I knew that the squad wasn’t good enough, so it would be a rebuilding process, I didn’t envisage it being quite such a rebuilding process. I think we had 4 signed, I convinced two more to stay on, so when you have a month to go and only six players what is a serious ambition for that club ? To be brutally honest at that stage it was probably just getting a team on the park! Then looking to stay in the league, promotion or challenging was miles away.” So by being promoted in your first full season was an overachievement? “Oh yes, I use the word overachieve loosely because we set out to believe, just believe we could win football games, where that belief takes you isn’t discovered until the end of the season. Bar the last six games when we were very inconsistent, we were very consistent, we continued to win games so maybe looking at it that way we overachieved but in others no because we trained well, prepared well and managed the squad well but the club was progressing not just on the park but off the park as well.” “However as early as the day after we won promotion on an emotional day at Bathgate, I knew that team would probably not be good enough for the Super League so what did we need to change? We weren’t good enough to win the league but we would be within a group of 10 clubs all fighting to stay in the league.” If you overachieved on the field was the club ready for the Super League off the field? “I think the way we were going , the work that we were doing pushing things would have benefitted the club both long term and immediately, new sponsors etc., yes they had the same sponsors but we were selling a brand as such and coming with that was an increase in revenue. There was more being done for these sponsors and advertisers, More appearances by the players and staff. So for me yes I think we were going in the right direction definitely so the Super League is completely different because the margins are a lot finer.” “Both the players and the club knew that this season was going to be a different sort of challenge and if we were to come down then we couldn’t see it as a set back as we were so far ahead of schedule. We would know the eight or nine players that could play at that level, we would be starting with a squad that I could trust to play at that level instead of 4 or 5 players, So with the club selling me the idea of progression on and off the park when I took over. The Community Club stuff which I used my own free time to do, the club had ambitions too I think they had provisionally looked at selling land, as well as a 3G pitch and developing the site. This was on top of speaking to the SFA about the Lowland League so the club answered my question of what were the clubs ambitions. That’s why I turned down Senior clubs because the club were worried about the progression if I had left. Now I bought in to all that, that’s why I signed an extended contract and we had a 5 year plan and by about year four then we would be in the Lowland League and I could then hand on to someone preferably from within the club that we had brought through. Now that move to the Lowland League was irrelevant of which division we were in because it was all about club progression and structure however, it would make it easier if we were still in the Super League. I was building a squad for the Lowland League and that’s what the long term goal was. To get to that you will have ups and downs but the club would be structured and would have a clear identity within the community and on the park” You are obviously an ambitious person, was that ambition too much for St Andrews United? “Erm No I don’t think so, because with ambition there are limits as to what individuals can do and what a club can do. If we had said at July 2014 this is where you will be December 2015, most people would have said you are off your head, looking at what we had, you would have said aye right we are not going to do that! You need an element of ambition because if you don’t have ambition then you don’t have targets and then moving targets. What is the point in being there? Are you just going to be happy with being in the Premier League or thereabouts, never really going to get promoted, playing loads of local games so there is not a lot of travelling so less money paid out for travelling, maybe a half decent cup run every now and then, fighting every year to attract players, fighting to supply wages and maintain the infrastructure, there is no ambition in that. What I did have through my experience, was a lot of senior game knowledge, not just with managers and their training methods but also what I liked and didn’t like. I enhanced a lot of that experience and took a lot of that in to treat the players the way I liked to be treated. I also took a lot of time looking at youth structures, what works, what doesn’t work to progress players keep them motivated,. I also spent a lot of time on the business side over a number of years, I work day to day with large companies. Businesses and infrastructures and I was marrying the two and for me I would always look and see what was possible because without ideas, it never gets discussed but if you discuss it, can it be done, what are the pros and cons then you will come to a true answer. In the early part, the way St Andrews United wanted to go fitted in to my criteria for marrying the two together. Certainly, the potential sale of land, installing a gym, which you could get direct revenue from, a physio department, 3G pitches, and all these things, had to be explored. That is why I took a lot of time looking at other junior clubs, why they were successful, the likes of Benburb and Pollok. What I do know from speaking to them is that they all made mistakes, so I was in a fortunate position to hear what they should have done and to try and put the correct things in place at St Andrews. That’s what St Andrews United could have potentially moved on to and created a genuine Sports Hub that would have been self sufficient with its own revenues coming in, more players using the facility, the community clubs teams, extra training sessions , having our own training base. The club would be rejuvenated from a youth perspective, more sponsorship, a facility like that with a high throughput of users is a sponsors dream. Maybe 5 or 6 clubs, schools using it on a regular basis with maybe 350 people + going through their every week as a minimum. That was what we were working towards with certain individuals within the club and those out-with the club and it was a realistic opportunity that’s for sure.” There have been rumours that the playing staff were fully behind you when you were dismissed, you can’t fail to be heartened by the response Yes of course, I think when that happens it sends a strong signal that it was a shock and things were going well. As much the performances were there, we weren’t getting results, the players never panicked, they didn’t care what was said outside that dressing room because they knew they weren’t a million miles away and working on it. We were in a position but it wasn’t a crisis, ten games to go and you are ten points adrift, that’s a crisis. We had 17 games to go and 2 points move you up the table while 6 points separated 9 teams. With 17 games to go then that’s 51 points that is what made it a bit of a shock and you do take heart from the player’s reaction. Every one of the players was in touch at one time or another because they were upset, annoyed, they believed in what we were doing but now for me I am no longer Phil McGuire their manager. I now have my professional hat on, if they ask for advice then I would say look it is a new manager, keep your head down, work away that is it. When players feel hard done by and the new managers come in, he has got to try and nail down his ideas and beliefs then it is difficult, I am not going to sit here and say its an easy transition because its not, I have been there. At the end of the day players will always get the manager the sack because it’s a performance based business but when you have trust in the players and they believe in what’s happening then its different. That’s just the nature of the beast. I couldn’t have asked for a better bunch of players so you take a lot of heart and consolation from their reaction.” Finally, what is next for Phil McGuire? “I have taken the last month to chill out, I have had offers from Amateur, Junior and Senior clubs but it’s not been right for me. I am very much active in helping clubs, I have had managers on asking for advice with training and as long as I have time then I am happy to do that. I am still active in St Andrews, not the football club but the community, I have been asked to remain within the Community Club which is something for me that speaks volumes. There are a lot of good people looking to push it forward like Stuart Milne, Director of Football at St Andrews University, Greig Dochard and Willie Donaldson from St Andrews Colts, St Monans Spurs, although they have now folded. Whether or not St Andrews United remain part of that I don’t know but for me its just to create a structure so that every player finds their own levels. I always said I wouldn’t go to another Junior Club purely on the beliefs that St Andrews United sold me and where I felt I could take St Andrews United, short and long term, so I feel I have unfinished business and I would like to maybe spend another couple of years in the Juniors. I have a path marked out for myself and I feel I have more to learn about my own style I enjoy educating the players and providing the best I can in terms of training, preparation, and man management. If the right club comes along then who knows.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fife Journeyman Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 For a bit i thought i was reading about Guardiola and Barcelona. Nothing wrong with a bit ambition but its a mid level Junior club . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grayser Posted January 29, 2016 Share Posted January 29, 2016 Read War and Peace quicker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macky1903 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 i wouldn't believe a word that came out of either of these 2 . he was sacked get over it St. Andrews have moved on !! He missed the bit out on the interview where he has been phoning certain players telling them not to turn up for training and games !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foofoo45 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 And that he cancelled training venues and is still telling signing targets not to go near the club. No dignity whatsoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 These new usernames do seem to be popping up a lot these days. Grayser, foofoo45, Macky1903 etc all appearing out of the blue. With such scathing comments perhaps they (or he if 1 persona) should "out" themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shagtag Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Big accusations being made against phill. Would be interesting to see the proof /source to justify these comments. Seems like sour grapes. As previously mentioned the club has moved on so has the players maybe time to give it a swerve now and concentrate in supporting the team towards super league survival rather than continuing the circus that surrounds the club at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 It's a football forum bigal everyone entitled to their opinion. Always two sides to every story. Absolutely but pie and bovril appears to have just given birth to you as well. Who were you yesterday ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superbigal Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Absolutely but pie and bovril appears to have just given birth to you as well. Who were you yesterday ? Also if you read my posts they are all opinion and not heresay. For instance I don't agree with certain players actions etc I don't allege a told b who maybe phoned c Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macky1903 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 Superbigal it's a forum so there's going to be new members all the time and why should I out myself . It was one of the players dads that had said at the football last weekend not to me personally though . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foofoo45 Posted January 30, 2016 Share Posted January 30, 2016 These new usernames do seem to be popping up a lot these days. Grayser, foofoo45, Macky1903 etc all appearing out of the blue. With such scathing comments perhaps they (or he if 1 persona) should "out" themselves. Hey Sookyphilspal or whatever your pretend name is...the whole point of the forum is to allow expression of opinion without vilification from people who think only their opinion matters. Im a Saints fan who wants the best for the club on and off the park. Therefore I will defend the reputation of St Andrews United when I feel a one sided tale is being told. Blinkers off..mind open..neck in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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