Loondave1 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Dear christ. How many times do you have to be told that NHS Scotland is the UK's best performing NHS? And specifically what is concerning you about Police Scotland? Your answer smacks of a BetterTogether brochure. Are you absolutely certain that Scotland is better off tied to a Tory led Westminster who have permanent austerity in mind? If you don't think there is a problem with Police Scotland I suggest you take the tinfoil hat off. Their inability to find the body of a dead tourist found in the end by a search organised by a friend coming over to find her themselves reeks of more incompetence. Tip of the berg mate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Our share of national debt is a fair concern and the SNPs position on currency and the EU appeared to be back of an envelope stuff.The fib about having been assured of EU membership. I don't really buy the idea Scotland is bankrolling the UK.Also concerned the SNP are promising a lot but delivering little and I know its tiresome but Health and Police are causes for concern. Oil has always been the reason for Scotland to be rich in SNP mantra but confronted with a ludicrously high value estimate it became just a bit part of that wealth.I still have concerns about why the likes of Souter find a left wing independent Scotland so attractive.Also on a lesser note Trumps Balmedie golf course where Wee Eck sooked up to Donald and Grampians finest allowed and even assisted in the bullying of locals about their property and right to say no.Of course the Donald has now fell out with Eck but it wasn't his most glorious hour and the "wee" people received zilch support from a Scottish Govt smelling Donalds money.Socialism it wasn't. We would have got in the EU and would have used the pound until such time as we didn't need to. I take it you're one of these types that needs categorical answers to questions that can't be answered instead of sitting back and looking at things logically ? Big business would have been chapping on the Downing St door the day after demanding a currency solution. Scotland is roughly the same as England without oil so don't know where you're getting this from. Again... I have to say, your reasons sound like they're straight from Alistair Darling himself. My my, the easily led are well, easily led I suppoose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 If you don't think there is a problem with Police Scotland I suggest you take the tinfoil hat off. Their inability to find the body of a dead tourist found in the end by a search organised by a friend coming over to find her themselves reeks of more incompetence. Tip of the berg mate. Where did I say they were perfect? I asked you, specifically, without using Scottish Labour-esque soundbites what YOU think is specifically wrong with Police Scotland? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 The police force has performed better than it did under Labour with added austerity on top. The biggest problem with the NHS and Police Scotland is austerity. Who's to blame for that ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 The police force has performed better than it did under Labour with added austerity on top. The biggest problem with the NHS and Police Scotland is austerity. Who's to blame for that ? It really is most amusing watching the neo liberal fanboys bleat Scottish Labour soundbites, then run away when they're asked to provide specific examples. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Our share of national debt is a fair concern and the SNPs position on currency and the EU appeared to be back of an envelope stuff.The fib about having been assured of EU membership. I don't really buy the idea Scotland is bankrolling the UK.Also concerned the SNP are promising a lot but delivering little and I know its tiresome but Health and Police are causes for concern. Oil has always been the reason for Scotland to be rich in SNP mantra but confronted with a ludicrously high value estimate it became just a bit part of that wealth.I still have concerns about why the likes of Souter find a left wing independent Scotland so attractive.Also on a lesser note Trumps Balmedie golf course where Wee Eck sooked up to Donald and Grampians finest allowed and even assisted in the bullying of locals about their property and right to say no.Of course the Donald has now fell out with Eck but it wasn't his most glorious hour and the "wee" people received zilch support from a Scottish Govt smelling Donalds money.Socialism it wasn't. Our share of the national debt is our share of the national debt, we are currently servicing that regardless of constitutional position. The SNP position on the currency was relatively weak in so far as a currency union was an adequate short term solution that would inevitably end up with us having our own currency down the line. Problem being that securing a currency union in the short term means promising it for the long term when inevitably it cannot be. I don't buy the idea that rUK subsidises Scotland, in effect it's an irrelevancy - dependent on what measure you use to make your argument. The real point is whether you believe a Scottish government will have more flexibility, more focus and more imagination in instituting measures to grow the Scottish economy in the future than a disinterested UK state. As to the SNP promises and records on health, crime etc - again, irrelevant - independence is about systems, not incumbents. SNP short comings are not Scotland's shortcomings. An independent Scotland, 50 years from now will not spare one f**k for the political machinations of the devolved Scottish parliament of 2015. Quite frankly, post independence, the SNP will inevitably fracture. Oil is not the reason Scotland is 'rich', Scotland has a decent, diversified economy and in fact we are responsible for many of the UK's leading exports. We have an educated work force, top class universities, decent transport links - all these things give us an advantage that we can properly drive home when Scotland is given the fiscal and social levers to maximise our potential. Oil volatility, by the way, is nothing in comparison to the volatility of the banking sector, our exposure to which is maximised by our political union with London, not shielded, not sunk without. The EU situation was always a case of political will trumping any legal precedent, a deal could and would've been done. How you lessen the uncertainty of that prior to a second referendum I'm not sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Our share of the national debt is our share of the national debt, we are currently servicing that regardless of constitutional position. The SNP position on the currency was relatively weak in so far as a currency union was an adequate short term solution that would inevitably end up with us having our own currency down the line. Problem being that securing a currency union in the short term means promising it for the long term when inevitably it cannot be. I don't buy the idea that rUK subsidises Scotland, in effect it's an irrelevancy - dependent on what measure you use to make your argument. The real point is whether you believe a Scottish government will have more flexibility, more focus and more imagination in instituting measures to grow the Scottish economy in the future than a disinterested UK state. As to the SNP promises and records on health, crime etc - again, irrelevant - independence is about systems, not incumbents. SNP short comings are not Scotland's shortcomings. An independent Scotland, 50 years from now will not spare one f**k for the political machinations of the devolved Scottish parliament of 2015. Quite frankly, post independence, the SNP will inevitably fracture. Oil is not the reason Scotland is 'rich', Scotland has a decent, diversified economy and in fact we are responsible for many of the UK's leading exports. We have an educated work force, top class universities, decent transport links - all these things give us an advantage that we can properly drive home when Scotland is given the fiscal and social levers to maximise our potential. Oil volatility, by the way, is nothing in comparison to the volatility of the banking sector, our exposure to which is maximised by our political union with London, not shielded, not sunk without. The EU situation was always a case of political will trumping any legal precedent, a deal could and would've been done. How you lessen the uncertainty of that prior to a second referendum I'm not sure. Literally cannot wait to see KevtheDee's response to the above. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevthedee Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 It really is most amusing watching the neo liberal fanboys bleat Scottish Labour soundbites, then run away when they're asked to provide specific examples. http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/police-scotland-criticise-snp-named-person-plans-1-3818002 http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/snp-tried-to-suppress-report-on-police-scotland-1-3408872 http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/aug/05/nicola-sturgeon-snp-police-scotland-spying-claims These any good ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevthedee Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Literally cannot wait to see KevtheDee's response to the above. I would have said the same word for word lol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/police-scotland-criticise-snp-named-person-plans-1-3818002 http://m.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/snp-tried-to-suppress-report-on-police-scotland-1-3408872 http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2015/aug/05/nicola-sturgeon-snp-police-scotland-spying-claims These any good ?? No, no they're not. HTH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Scotland is equated to being SNP when the end result is good for labour. Scotland is NOT THE FUCKING SNP YOU CYBERNAT ARSE HOLES when it is bad for labour. Labour drones, eh? And renton - you really need to get yourself out and about during the next referendum. You articulate things in a way that even Kev the fucking dee can understand. Absolutely sensational post. Again. No voters that can't see the wood for the trees are fine, at least they've made a genuine attempt to research such an important matter as the implications of independence.. No voters that can't be bothered doing their own research and follow the mantra of Alistair Darling and Gordon fucking Brown, the two people who lead our country into horrendous debts which we barely got ourselves out of, really need to shake themselves. Brit Nats are beyond help. My tuppence worth - the SNP's record in government is a complete irrelevance to Independence and a referendum. There will be an election and a centre left party other than the SNP - you know, what labour used to be - would have a great shot of getting into Government. They would have a great deal of fiscal responsibility and the ability to grow the Scottish economy and invest in infrastructure in the ways that we require/want to. It's not going to be a cakewalk, but I find the notion that Scotland couldn't cope as an Independent country highly offensive. What makes Scotland, a country so much more rich in natural resources than most countries our size and with an already established economy/trade links worldwide, so unable to run its own affairs? Unbelievable lack of belief in ourselves from some. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julie the A9 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 "I had a nightmare once, I was stuck in a lift with Nicola Sturgeon" A line from by the character Kirk on last nights Coronation Street Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loondave1 Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 Scotland is equated to being SNP when the end result is good for labour. Scotland is NOT THE FUCKING SNP YOU CYBERNAT ARSE HOLES when it is bad for labour. Labour drones, eh? And renton - you really need to get yourself out and about during the next referendum. You articulate things in a way that even Kev the fucking dee can understand. Absolutely sensational post. Again. No voters that can't see the wood for the trees are fine, at least they've made a genuine attempt to research such an important matter as the implications of independence.. No voters that can't be bothered doing their own research and follow the mantra of Alistair Darling and Gordon fucking Brown, the two people who lead our country into horrendous debts which we barely got ourselves out of, really need to shake themselves. Brit Nats are beyond help. My tuppence worth - the SNP's record in government is a complete irrelevance to Independence and a referendum. There will be an election and a centre left party other than the SNP - you know, what labour used to be - would have a great shot of getting into Government. They would have a great deal of fiscal responsibility and the ability to grow the Scottish economy and invest in infrastructure in the ways that we require/want to. It's not going to be a cakewalk, but I find the notion that Scotland couldn't cope as an Independent country highly offensive. What makes Scotland, a country so much more rich in natural resources than most countries our size and with an already established economy/trade links worldwide, so unable to run its own affairs? Unbelievable lack of belief in ourselves from some. Im not so much disputing whether Scotland can support itself or not im interested in whether it will be better.Thats a different point.I also think ARSE HOLES is one word by the way.Generally I find the Cybernat world way too optomistic and bordering on a faith rather than a rational position.Your points however I take onboard as they appear not fanboy based.I will quible about Gordie and the debt though its so much more global than that. Ironically he signed off all the generous tax credits we are now whining about losing.Seems a little hypocritical to me. I also don't buy the idea the SNP just disappear after independence and usher in a new left of centre govt.That to me is complete bollocks.That is all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TapothehullDee Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 It's "inevitable" the Earth will burn up one day, more than l;ikely before Scotland votes for independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colkitto Posted August 18, 2015 Share Posted August 18, 2015 "I had a nightmare once, I was stuck in a lift with Nicola Sturgeon" A line from by the character Kirk on last nights Coronation Street Thought that was a wind up - it's not! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kF4gjycWgnE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 It's "inevitable" the Earth will burn up one day, more than l;ikely before Scotland votes for independence. Do you ever post anything other than your desperate cries that Independence will never happen? You're protesting way too much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassiveFanDan Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Jeremy Corbyn won't be another Michael Foot. Scotland voted for Michael Foot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kevthedee Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 No, no they're not. HTH. Thought so,i guess its because they are criticising the snp and their policies which is just not the done thing snp bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fide Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Thought so,i guess its because they are criticising the snp and their policies which is just not the done thing snp bad. The Scotsman, much like yourself, has lost all credibility in it's utter utter obsession with SNPbad. Unlucks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted August 19, 2015 Share Posted August 19, 2015 Yeah I'm not so certain the SNP would implode on independence either. If the SNP could remain in government till a referendum and secure a less than decisive victory I reckon they'll maintain their current form and to try and steady the ship post transition. If the SNP were seen to be instrumental in guiding Scotland through the initial choppy waters then it's difficult to see why a lot of current MPs and MSPs would want to risk splitting away and consigning themselves to opposition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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