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Don't buy ST's and don't buy from SD was the war cry last season from the Mad King causing the club to haemorrhage millions in the process and now you think he is fulfilling his promises ?

Yes I do understand it is nice or better for the club to at least like it's trying to try to live within it's means, but it certainly wasn't the message he promised before he took office was it ?

It was all spend, spend, spend to match Celtic or compete with Celtic and how the club needed off the radar funding from outside investors to take the club to the level he kept harping on about to get Champions League music back to Ibrox.

Funny seeing you and your fans when he took power all ballsy about how millions upon millions would be pumped into the playing squad to get promoted this season and to have a squad of players that would make a title challenge in their first season in the top tier with a years experience in the Chumpionship. Now what you have is a squad that would just about compete for a top 6 place in the Premiership and the fans have been told to cough up or it's your fault Celtic will get 10 in a row, and he'll use the same excuse over and over again that at this time he doesn't need to invest because the club doesn't need his investment and the fans will have to cough up and do their bit or they have let the club down.

He said one thing before wrestling power from Ashley's boys and now you have all been told something completely different !, wake up ffs and smell something at least never mind the coffee because that will be too late.

Me and my fans said no such thing.

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Concerned about an interview which you yourself said contained sensible ideas?

As far as I can see funding is available from the main shareholders while the clubs chairman has said that he wants as many fans as possible to spend money, also funding the club. I'm sure most club chairmen would say similar regarding getting fans in?

It seems the best strategy for going forward.

Many chairmen would indeed make similar noises, but they hadn't all said very different things beforehand in order to launch what amounted to a hostile takeover of their clubs.

Is this point not at least worth acknowledging?

Anyway, having now watched the interview, I've got to say that King's performance is hugely eclipsed by Jim White's in terms of providing moments to wince at.

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Do you think he should have went ahead with his egm era comments regardless?

They were comments which shouldn't have been made, a bit naive on his part at the time and maybe he should address them but I agree with today's comments.

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Do you think he should have went ahead with his egm era comments regardless?

They were comments which shouldn't have been made, a bit naive on his part at the time and maybe he should address them but I agree with today's comments.

So you admit he has been a shameless liar to get onto the RIFC board then ?

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This season, there will be no 5 million from Ashley, no Commonwealth Games money, no share issue. On the other side of the ledger, your wage bill might have gone down by a million or two.

Will your income be higher?

Our money effectively ran out in November last year, this year we hace 10k more ST's, at higher price, less wages and likely more fans will go on a game by game basis

The money from the commonwealth games wouldn't have been groundbreaking, and any cup game money for using ibrox wasnt paid until the new year

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Our money effectively ran out in November last year, this year we hace 10k more ST's, at higher price, less wages and likely more fans will go on a game by game basis

The money from the commonwealth games wouldn't have been groundbreaking, and any cup game money for using ibrox wasnt paid until the new year

If the manager doesnt get 3 wins in the first 3 league games, game by game attendance will drop

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Our money effectively ran out in November last year, this year we hace 10k more ST's, at higher price, less wages and likely more fans will go on a game by game basis

The money from the commonwealth games wouldn't have been groundbreaking, and any cup game money for using ibrox wasnt paid until the new year

If sales do hit 35,000 with an average price of £250 (http://www.rangers.co.uk/tickets/season-tickets) that's an extra £3.5M plus an extra £270K from the 5% price increase on last season's 21,000. So that's £4M extra season ticket income (less a slight drop in pay-at-the-gate takings since they're all buying STs this season).

Offset that against the Commonwealth Games-related income (£1.3M), Ashley's loan (£5M - a loan but used as operating capital so we can treat it as income for these purposes) and the share issue (£3M - ditto) and you're actually going to be bringing in £5M less this year.

The salary delta isn't likely to be much more than a few million - 10 out (say £10K pw each on average) and 5 in (say £5K pw each on average). That's your outgoings reduced by £4M.

Overall, you're £1M worse off than last season. And you owe Ashley £5M. And I've erred on the side of being generous to Rangers in these calculations.

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Our money effectively ran out in November last year, this year we hace 10k more ST's, at higher price, less wages and likely more fans will go on a game by game basis

This seems approximately correct. There may be higher ST sales this season, but no guarantee of rights issue or CG money. The big difference is that last season the ST money came in against a balance of (approximately) zero; this season it comes in against a debt of about £8m. As an order of magnitude, that roughly means that the ST tranche has been pre-spent. There's not really any doubt about those facts, with the caveat that they are indeed just order-of-magnitude numbers.

The motivation for the OP was to seek views on how this circle could be squared; King's interview has clarified that, and it now looks as though the promises of (very early and significant!) fund raising through share issues is no longer being seriously contemplated. It seems increasingly, to me, as though King is aiming for an end-game where the narrative will be that previous boards and other bogeymen have forced him down a route he never intended taking. Paul Murray seems a bit eager in this respect, and has already blamed the previous board, the outgoing and prospective NOMADs, AIM and ISDX for their unreasonable actions.

I think that bennett makes several perfectly fair points, or makes the same fair point several times: a chairman encouraging fans to support the club with their disposable income is quite normal. However, the fact that he has lured shareholders, fans and the SMSM with such different, fabulous tales and now seems completely unabashed about changing his story so radically is what I would find concerning: the whole model for the club being sustainable and surviving appears to be treated as "say anything they will believe for a few weeks". Does anyone think the fan base would have bought into his latest "vision", if he'd stated it then as he does now, and hadn't consistently stated that he would be putting in N x £10m (where N = 1 to 5)?

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Some probably did, it was never going to happen tho...

Rep!y to QC.

Do you therefore recognise that King appears to have gained control via false pretences?

I fully accept that you're not troubled by what he's now saying as it strikes you as more sensible and realistic than his previous pledges.

Is there not however an issue, regarding the "some (who) probably did"? Will they be as accommodating as you in addressing this change of direction?

Please don't say I'll have to ask them, because I can't. Do you think King will get an easy enough ride from fans as it becomes ever clearer that he has no plans to be a sugar daddy?

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Monkey at 8.33am

I'd say that most fans would realise that a lot of the early statements were guess work and will show some leeway regarding this. A large part of yesterday's interview seemed to me that it was based on hinting that the retail deal could work out better for both parties if it was less onerous.

There does seem to be some fans wanting to spend spend spend but surprisingly they are in the minority, most fans see the sense in what's currently happening.

What happens on the park will have a part to play in how easy a ride he gets, if the team gels and gets results or shows signs of building towards a strong side then it'll be easier.

Guesswork on my part but I think the board are now being a bit coy when talking of finances, not wanting to show their hand.

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Tbf a lot of good points from many posts and I do prefer talking football tactics rather than the politics but that is virtually impossible when Rangers is the subject. We must all agree nobody would have thought it was possible what has happened to Rangers over the last three years. I never thought for one moment that King was going to be a ' Rangers sugar daddy' but one thing for sure whatever he said to convince the majority that the past board had to go had to be said. This is a very long process. There is little doubt Rangers financially imo are really struggling. Listen to the interviews and look at the calibre and cost of the player they have 'bought' for this season. I recognise it's very early however I am more than happy with the appointment of Warburton. I mean this genuinely. He is changing the way they play for the better and new fresh players have come in and unlike last season will be better coached and more enthusiastic. He has virtually to sign a championship winning squad with an inadequate budget ( it will be interesting to know at the end of the transfer window, the amount spent and savings on the wage bill compared to last season) Do I think the calibre of player being brought in is going to have the quality to win the Championship? More than difficult. Hibs have a more settled squad and will have learned from last season. Hearts were my favourites last season and Hibs are this season however it will be tight however taking Allan out of Hibs and placing him in Rangers midfield would certainly give the helicopter pilot a problem. Both teams and others will have to achieve Hearts consistency or fail. Warburton squad this season should have been started when in Division two however the difficulty is, its the Championship Rangers need to win.

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If sales do hit 35,000 with an average price of £250 (http://www.rangers.co.uk/tickets/season-tickets) that's an extra £3.5M plus an extra £270K from the 5% price increase on last season's 21,000. So that's £4M extra season ticket income (less a slight drop in pay-at-the-gate takings since they're all buying STs this season).

Offset that against the Commonwealth Games-related income (£1.3M), Ashley's loan (£5M - a loan but used as operating capital so we can treat it as income for these purposes) and the share issue (£3M - ditto) and you're actually going to be bringing in £5M less this year.

The salary delta isn't likely to be much more than a few million - 10 out (say £10K pw each on average) and 5 in (say £5K pw each on average). That's your outgoings reduced by £4M.

Overall, you're £1M worse off than last season. And you owe Ashley £5M. And I've erred on the side of being generous to Rangers in these calculations.

why are you mentioning things that happened AFTER we ran out of money last season, you posted this

And 'the latter part of the season' is likely to come around much faster than it did last season.

so how can more early season income generated through ST's, more matchday income overall (predicition given the new management team etc) and less player wages equate to us needing loans sooner than we did last season

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why are you mentioning things that happened AFTER we ran out of money last season, you posted this

so how can more early season income generated through ST's, more matchday income overall (predicition given the new management team etc) and less player wages equate to us needing loans sooner than we did last season

I'm not sure whether you're serious or not (Joker gif, someone, please).

You're going to run out of money SOONER this season than you did last. Given your indebtedness, your ST money might just about move you into a cost-neutral position til the end of this month or next but, after that, you're borrowing again - earlier than you did last season.

ETA: you don't really think your benefactors are going to let their current loans ride, do you? They'll want the money back now so that they can be seen to lend it again next month.

Edited by The DA
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I recognise it's very early however I am more than happy with the appointment of Warburton. I mean this genuinely. He is changing the way they play for the better and new fresh players have come in and unlike last season will be better coached and more enthusiastic. He has virtually to sign a championship winning squad with an inadequate budget ( it will be interesting to know at the end of the transfer window, the amount spent and savings on the wage bill compared to last season) Do I think the calibre of player being brought in is going to have the quality to win the Championship? More than difficult. Hibs have a more settled squad and will have learned from last season. Hearts were my favourites last season and Hibs are this season however it will be tight however taking Allan out of Hibs and placing him in Rangers midfield would certainly give the helicopter pilot a problem. Both teams and others will have to achieve Hearts consistency or fail. Warburton squad this season should have been started when in Division two however the difficulty is, its the Championship Rangers need to win.

Will this "inadequate budget" of Rangers be smaller than any other side's in the division?

Why would it be necessary for either, let alone both of, Rangers and Hibs to achieve Hearts' level of consistency this time? Hearts' form last year up until when the title was sealed was truly remarkable, eclipsing that required by most title winning sides at this level, by miles.

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