When will indyref2 happen?

[Gaz FFC]

2 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

5 hours ago, Hedgecutter said:

 

 that's why I can tell Malky doesn't really understand the figure!!

I didn't need to go to school to know he's talking shite.

My 14 month old toddler who shits himself daily just told me Malky talks bollocks. His 1st words. I'm so proud

[tbsouth]

#GE2019 if only 18-24 year-olds could vote:

LAB: 544 (56%)
SNP: 58 (5%)
LDM: 22 (11%)
CON: 4 (21%)
GRN: 1 (4%)
PLC: 1 (0.5%)
IND: 1

Northern Ireland: SF 7, DUP 6, ALL 2, SDLP 2, UUP 1.

Labour Majority of 438.

#GE2019 if only 25-49 year-olds could vote:

LAB: 310 (43%)
CON: 240 (34%)
SNP: 56 (5%)
LDM: 21 (13%)
PLC: 3 (0.5%)
GRN: 1 (3%)

Northern Ireland: DUP 8, SF 7, SDLP 2, ALL 1.

Labour 16 short of a Majority.

#GE2019 if only 50-64 year-olds could vote:

CON: 421 (50%)
LAB: 149 (17%)
SNP: 47 (4%)
LDM: 9 (12%)
PLC: 4 (0.5%)
GRN: 1 (3%)

Northern Ireland: DUP 8, SF 6, SDLP 2, ALL 1, UUP 1.

Conservative Majority of 192.

#GE2019 if only over 65 year-olds could vote:

CON: 562 (64%)
LAB: 51 (17%)
LDM: 10 (11%)
SNP: 5 (3%)
PLC: 2 (0.5%)
GRN: 1 (2%)

Northern Ireland: DUP 8, SF 4, SDLP 3, ALL 2, UUP 1.

Conservative Majority of 474.

[John Lambies Doos]

Even within the 50-64 group, SNP still get 47 seats. Tick tock

[git-intae-thum]

They stats are shocking and a sad indictment against our older generation.

It shocks me the amount of seats in Scotland that turn Tory based on the over 65 vote.

Selfish bast@rds.

 

[DeeTillEhDeh]

They stats are shocking and a sad indictment against our older generation.
It shocks me the amount of seats in Scotland that turn Tory based on the over 65 vote.
Selfish bast@rds.
 

Baby boomers seem to be getting this reputation as being a selfish generation - not sure how true this is in reality.

[dirty dingus]

5 hours ago, DeeTillEhDeh said:

6 hours ago, git-intae-thum said:

They stats are shocking and a sad indictment against our older generation.
It shocks me the amount of seats in Scotland that turn Tory based on the over 65 vote.
Selfish bast@rds.
 

Baby boomers seem to be getting this reputation as being a selfish generation - not sure how true this is in reality.

They are sellfish but that's human nature, they grew up in a time where people still believed in the empire and the effects of war were still very close to home with their parents. Many thought  Immigration was in place short term to rebuild and get the superpower GB back then folk would be shipped back home after servicing the mother nation. All this 60's sex, drugs and rock'n'roll was never a big thing outside a few hipster places, the majority of the UK has always been reserved and conservative, happy to do a little bit of grumbling from time to time but always fall back into line and back the powers that represent the stiff upper lip we're British types. I don't blame them as they have been spoon fed this crap all their lives from the establishment media.

[Dons_1988]

They are sellfish but that's human nature, they grew up in a time where people still believed in the empire and the effects of war were still very close to home with their parents. Many thought  Immigration was in place short term to rebuild and get the superpower GB back then folk would be shipped back home after servicing the mother nation. All this 60's sex, drugs and rock'n'roll was never a big thing outside a few hipster places, the majority of the UK has always been reserved and conservative, happy to do a little bit of grumbling from time to time but always fall back into line and back the powers that represent the stiff upper lip we're British types. I don't blame them as they have been spoon fed this crap all their lives from the establishment media.

What a load of patronising shite.

[doulikefish]

Fray Bentos are ace

Quite enjoying all these "this Christmas, reach out to a lonely pensioner" messages and thinking na, f**k the no voting Tory lot of them, away and enjoy your fray bentos and individual fruit trifle.

[Stellaboz]

Fray Bentos are ace

Aye, if you have the pallette of a dog.

[Malky3]

On 22/12/2019 at 00:53, git-intae-thum said:

Can only be arsed replying to the Malky3bot with a cut and paste.

SIU really need to give it a software update.

This often disproved GERs deficit patter is boring.

Right wing unionist think tank

- Fraser of Allander:

“It is always important to remember that GERS takes the current structure of UK Government reserved taxation and spending as given. If the very purpose of independence is to take different choices about the type of economy and society that we live in, then a set of accounts based upon the current constitutional settlement and policy priorities will tell us little about the long-term finances of an independent Scotland.”

Institute of Fiscal Studies also concur that the figures are not designed to represent the economy of an independent Scotland.

You've quoted that but do you even know what it means? 

I absolutely agree with that statement. It's 100% correct. The GERs Report is a statement about Scotlands current fiscal position. It's what Scotland spends today and what it earns in revenue under the current systems. 

What I have always asked is how would Nationalists do things differently to the current system to make the changes that balance the books. Look back, I've asked the question "What would Nationalists cut to make the books balance" so many times I was accused of spamming with it. 

The SNP's last published document on it's spending plans for an Independent Scotland claimed - the White Paper - claimed that an Independent Scotland would look just the same as Scotland today. We'd still fund the NHS in the same way, still pay pensions, welfare, etc, etc in exactly the same way. But because of the huge oil revenues we'd all be enjoying we'd pay less tax therefore making us all richer. 

This was complete lie. Had we voted Yes in 2014 we'd have ran up over £45Bn worth of debt in just over 3 years - if a new state could even borrow that money in the first place - and taxation cuts would have been nothing more than a pipedream since oil revenues fell through the floor. 

So I ask again. If we were to vote for Independence what would you cut and how high would you take taxation in an attempt to give Scots the kind of public sector spending we enjoy just now? 

 

Oh and BTW the Fraser of Allander Institute is anything but a right wing think tank. Its a completely independent research group associated to the University of Strathclyde. However it is interesting that you as a nationalist have thought to paint them that way. Is that because they consistently publish reports and blogs that don't suit Nationalist thinking? You know, like in the same completely laughable way Nationalists have decided that the BBC is a right wing broadcaster. 

Edited December 23, 2019 by Malky3

[Malky3]

On 22/12/2019 at 01:28, git-intae-thum said:

You should also quote the tax revenue that the English economy generates from that 20 billion borrow and spend.

That revenue multiplies as it filters down the whole secondary and service supply chain.

Flippin hell the English economy is looking good.

Percentage of that revenue that is then assigned back to the Scottish revenue take for the purpose of truthful accounting.......

= 0

Welcome to GERs.

It's not a conspiracy. The fact you think it is suggests you have no confidence in the Scottish Government, it's financial analysts and it's actuaries. 

If you insist on dividing the countries then ofcourse England looks healthy because London, the South East and the East of England are all running large surpluses. If you break it down into the 14 regions as the IFS does then you see that Scotland isn't really any worse than Wales, North East or the North West of England. But no-one down there is stupid enough to be demanding a vote on Independence. 

Edited December 23, 2019 by Malky3

[jakedee]

[emoji849]

[Malky3]

4 hours ago, Dons_1988 said:

 

What a load of patronising shite.

 

Yep it is. It's a constant trend these days in politics. There seems to be a drive to believe that everyone can be categorized and put into certain boxes without ever looking for the real reasons why people vote in the way that they do. 

On this forum it seems to be seen as a given that if you vote Tory you deserve to die for your greedy selfishness. Invariably you must be rich, over 70, and determined to suppress the prospects of every generation that follows you. And they use that categorization despite  telling us all that UK pensions are the worst in the western world and that pensioners are dying in poverty. 

People like Dirty Dingus should be ignored - however sadly there are so many idiots like him on this part of the forum that to ignore them all would make the forum look empty. 

[hearthammer]

21 minutes ago, Malky3 said:

Yep it is. It's a constant trend these days in politics. There seems to be a drive to believe that everyone can be categorized and put into certain boxes without ever looking for the real reasons why people vote in the way that they do. 

On this forum it seems to be seen as a given that if you vote Tory you deserve to die for your greedy selfishness. Invariably you must be rich, over 70, and determined to suppress the prospects of every generation that follows you. And they use that categorization despite  telling us all that UK pensions are the worst in the western world and that pensioners are dying in poverty. 

People like Dirty Dingus should be ignored - however sadly there are so many idiots like him on this part of the forum that to ignore them all would make the forum look empty. 

Irony has never featured in your small, hubristic universe, has it ??

[Granny Danger]

6 minutes ago, hearthammer said:

Irony has never featured in your small, hubristic universe, has it ??

[Dons_1988]

Yep it is. It's a constant trend these days in politics. There seems to be a drive to believe that everyone can be categorized and put into certain boxes without ever looking for the real reasons why people vote in the way that they do. 
On this forum it seems to be seen as a given that if you vote Tory you deserve to die for your greedy selfishness. Invariably you must be rich, over 70, and determined to suppress the prospects of every generation that follows you. And they use that categorization despite  telling us all that UK pensions are the worst in the western world and that pensioners are dying in poverty. 
People like Dirty Dingus should be ignored - however sadly there are so many idiots like him on this part of the forum that to ignore them all would make the forum look empty. 

I do kind of agree with this post but I also think you’re an absolute melt of a human so deal with that as you will.

[SandyCromarty]

Ireland got their Independence without a penny in the bank and not a pot to piss in, they survived happily without the english and continue to do so.

So feckin what if we have nothing, at least we will be Free.

[welshbairn]

19 minutes ago, SandyCromarty said:

Ireland got their Independence without a penny in the bank and not a pot to piss in, they survived happily without the english and continue to do so.

So feckin what if we have nothing, at least we will be Free.

I wouldn't use Ireland as an example myself, it took them 70 years to get their act together, forcing mass emigration in the meantime, much of it to England.

[John Lambies Doos]

I wouldn't use Ireland as an example myself, it took them 70 years to get their act together, forcing mass emigration in the meantime, much of it to England.

I would. Ireland started from nothing. Ireland has no right to be currently outperforming Scotland with their paucity of resource but guess what they are. Wonder why? Answer they have control of their own affairs

[SandyCromarty]

2 hours ago, welshbairn said:

I wouldn't use Ireland as an example myself, it took them 70 years to get their act together, forcing mass emigration in the meantime, much of it to England.

I mentioned in my post that the Irish had feck all

And how about the mass Scottish emigration in the fifties and sixties to Canda, Australia and NZ, how do you account for that?

And I'll add in Corby and elsewhere in the shires.

Was it anything to do with twice the unemployment rate in Scotland compared to england?