When will indyref2 happen?

[BTFD]

Oh God, not the pensions again. Fully expect to be picking up my pension in an independent Scotland in 2050, with people telling me that I'm imagining it happening.

Spoiler

lol not really, we'll still be in the UK, there'll be no worthwhile state pension, and I'll be waving my wrinkly willy on OnlyFans to make ends meet.

 

[Dan Steele]

I see the old "ye'll no get a pension if you vote for independence" has raised its head again. Scotland, the only country that won't offer a pension.

[Dan Steele]

Snap!

[BTFD]

4 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

I see the old "ye'll no get a pension if you vote for independence" has raised its head again. Scotland, the only country that won't offer a pension.

Can't afford to, mate. Barnett 'n that, innit. Third world country.

[Left Back]

25 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

See link above.

It will not be subsidizing anything, because it will be part of a larger negotiated settlement over asset and liability .

However the likely reality is rUK will be paying a good proportion of our pensions for a long time.

Any other scenario is ludicrous and unworkable.

 

18 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

.... this then suggests that rUK will in fact assume liability for our pensions but expect Scotland to contribute an amount subject to negotiation.

 

 

You seem to be confused between funding and paying.  Funding is liability.  Paying is just the conduit.  It may be the case that UK will continue to facilitate the actual payment but now way would they to fund it.

[TheScarf]

That was the main reason auld duffers voted no last time IMO.

'Whit aboot ma penshunnnnnnn'

[Dawson Park Boy]

8 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

I see the old "ye'll no get a pension if you vote for independence" has raised its head again. Scotland, the only country that won't offer a pension.

You’ll get your pension from the SG and nobody else.

It will be paid from taxes and NI collected post independence.

Hopefully, they’ll be able to pay it.

[git-intae-thum]

2 minutes ago, Left Back said:

 

You seem to be confused between funding and paying.  Funding is liability.  Paying is just the conduit.  It may be the case that UK will continue to facilitate the actual payment but now way would they to fund it.

This is nonsense.

[Left Back]

9 minutes ago, BFTD said:

Oh God, not the pensions again. Fully expect to be picking up my pension in an independent Scotland in 2050, with people telling me that I'm imagining it happening.

  Reveal hidden contents

lol not really, we'll still be in the UK, there'll be no worthwhile state pension, and I'll be waving my wrinkly willy on OnlyFans to make ends meet.

 

 

8 minutes ago, The Skelpit Lug said:

I see the old "ye'll no get a pension if you vote for independence" has raised its head again. Scotland, the only country that won't offer a pension.

No-one is saying that at all.  Of course there will be a pension (that may be actually paid to you by the UK, I believe it's more likely to be paid to you by SG).  This discussion is about who will be funding that pension.  There seems to be a belief among certain posters that the UK taxpayer will merrily fund Scottish pensions for the decades it takes until all Scots that have accrued entitlements under the UK are deceased.  It's an insane position to take that SG will have no liability for funding pensions.  It's monumentally naive at best and downright stupidity at worst.

[git-intae-thum]

1 minute ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

You’ll get your pension from the SG and nobody else.

It will be paid from taxes and NI collected post independence.

Hopefully, they’ll be able to pay it.

This is over simplified nonsense as well. There will be a negotiated settlement with reciprocal arrangements. See above.

[Left Back]

1 minute ago, git-intae-thum said:

This is nonsense.

Really?  What part is nonsense?  Do you think that if the UK gov actually would pay your state pension post independence that means they're funding it?

This really is surreal.

[Dawson Park Boy]

5 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

This is over simplified nonsense as well. There will be a negotiated settlement with reciprocal arrangements. See above.

Why don’t you question your SNP MSP on this?

 

[Dawson Park Boy]

12 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

That was the main reason auld duffers voted no last time IMO.

'Whit aboot ma penshunnnnnnn'

And quite rightly so, in my opinion.

[Antlion]

14 minutes ago, Dawson Park Boy said:

Why don’t you question your SNP MSP on this?

 

Would said MP have to post his or her answer on the side of a bus before it met with your approval, though?

[git-intae-thum]

5 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Really?  What part is nonsense?  Do you think that if the UK gov actually would pay your state pension post independence that means they're funding it?

This really is surreal.

It is a bit more complicated than that.

Who will fund rUK citizens living in Scotland and vice versa? How would you determine entitlement?

After reading the excellent FOA summary, it is pretty clear the rUK will assume liability (therefore funding) of pensions of those living in Scotland with current entitlement but expect some trade off in return. (Perhaps debt allocation)

I know it doesn't sit well with the Daily Mail type crowd but that is the reality.

 

 

[doulikefish]

Only a few posts away from "you'll no get EastEnders" in an independent Scotland 

[Left Back]

8 minutes ago, git-intae-thum said:

It is a bit more complicated than that.

Who will fund rUK citizens living in Scotland and vice versa? How would you determine entitlement?

After reading the excellent FOA summary, it is pretty clear the rUK will assume liability (therefore funding) of pensions of those living in Scotland with current entitlement but expect some trade off in return. (Perhaps debt allocation)

I know it doesn't sit well with the Daily Mail type crowd but that is the reality.

 

 

 

I assume you're talking about the footnote rather than the summary.  If you are that simply sets out the current pension rules.  The article explains that those rules can be easily changed and even describes recent changes to them.

That article in no way claims that rUK will assume the liability and funding.

[Dan Steele]

24 minutes ago, Left Back said:

No-one is saying that at all.  

The thing is though, to their eternal shame, Labour went hand in hand with the Tories saying exactly that last time. Will either Party back track on that and admit to blatant lying or do it all over again? Of course, you're right when you say a pension will be paid and it'll happen, as has been noted, with rUK assuming liability. There are two major obstacles that I can see: 1 - Johnson set the standard on lying to Westminster and the country, so do we now believe Truss if (won't hold my breath) she says she'll work in good faith with the SG and 2 - she's on record trying to play down the importance of those in charge of a democratic mandate in Scotland and Wales. I suppose there's another distinct possibility of an attempt to dismantle/wind back Holyrood powers. Whatever happens, independence is yet another major problem she'll have to confront and not just spout pish about "do the right thing" "our great country" and, of course, putting the "Great British apple back on top of the tree".

[BTFD]

6 minutes ago, doulikefish said:

Only a few posts away from "you'll no get EastEnders" in an independent Scotland 

How on Earth this is a negative is beyond me. I'd want that in fucking writing.

[git-intae-thum]

The article points in that direction. The footnote makes it very clear.

A negotiated settlement wherebye rUK assumes liability for those with pension entitlement in exchange for some yet to be determined trade is the only sensible scenario.