When will indyref2 happen?

[DeeTillEhDeh]

20 minutes ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

I think you know. The EU is not about decentralised power and decision making. Get rid of Westminster and replace with Brussels - is that a noticeable improvement?

PS before you ask I voted to stay in the EU.

Yes.  Anything is an improvement on Westminster.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

Fair enough. All about opinions. 

[DeeTillEhDeh]

1 hour ago, The_Kincardine said:

If you followed either 'The Ferries' or 'That Salmond Stuff' - either of which should have led to resignations or sackings - and saw how poorly enabled HR committees are to bring government to account - then you can't possibly vaunt HR's democracy.  A sleekit operator like Sturgeon - realising committees are toothless - ran rings round them.

Scotland was cursed with 8 years of Sturgeon's lies, deceit, mendacity, redaction and bluster and HR wasn't able to touch her.

How good are Westminster committees at keeping the Government accountable?  

Anyone who follows the Scottish Parliament knows that outside of the yah-boo pish of FM questions there is actually a lot of cooperation and agreement.  That's down to having the Parliament elected by PR - it's almost impossible to ride roughshod over Parliament in the way the Tories are doing right now af Westminster.

Edited April 19, 2023 by DeeTillEhDeh

[DublinMagyar]

2 hours ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

Don't necessarily disagree.

I just perceive the risk to all of us as being lower with the status quo than allowing this shower loose on building a new country with all the organisations, institutions and relationships that would need to constructed and developed. The idea that they operate on a higher plane, both on a  moral and capability level, has been and well and truly decimated. 

"too stupid"

[Benjamin_Nevis]

3 hours ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

i am interested in who exactly would govern this future independent country if not the Nats, Greens, Albas? The independent Scottish government would be filled with the same  quality of politician we have now except now they would have free rein to do anything without reference to Westminster and any checks the make on them (accepting they hardly cover themselves in glory). The standard of person involved is woeful, and they are lording it over the country as politicians with no experience of anything much beyond being a politician (or councillor). 

Desperate days. 

I would hope for some sort of cross-party alliance between what would be left of the SNP and Labour tbh.

I would also expect the SNP's WM representatives would replace many of the clowns they have in HR, after all there would be no need for SNP representation in WM in this situation. Flynn, Black, Sheppard etc are levels above pretty much all the current MSPs. 

As much as I take the piss out of Labour, they're not totally awful. Monica Lennon for example is a decent sort. I would further hope to see the Greens sidelined, I had previously hoped they would proved useful partners in the SG as long as they kept the lunatics at bay, however they are a rabble of wanks and need fired into the sun at the earliest opportunity. 

As for the minority parties, Alba are a still going to be irrelevant moonhowlers, the Lib Dems will still be absolutely pointless and just f**k the Tories. 

[Antlion]

3 hours ago, DublinMagyar said:

"too stupid"

Better just to squat in someone else’s burning house - we’d only burn our own down anyway.

[Billy Jean King]

9 hours ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

i am interested in who exactly would govern this future independent country if not the Nats, Greens, Albas? The independent Scottish government would be filled with the same  quality of politician we have now except now they would have free rein to do anything without reference to Westminster and any checks the make on them (accepting they hardly cover themselves in glory). The standard of person involved is woeful, and they are lording it over the country as politicians with no experience of anything much beyond being a politician (or councillor). 

Desperate days. 

I agree there should be standards but what "qualifications" are you advocating ?

 

I'm sure a few years back there were proposals for some sort of minimum criteria to be met be local council candidates but they never seemed to materialise. Our local Council consists of ancient old troughers who have been there for decades, retired old farts and  behemoths of local business including taxi drivers and letting agents !

[TheScarf]

20 hours ago, Antlion said:

Will Brussels hold the reserved powers Westminster does?

Such a daft argument isn't it.  It suggests all EU member states are governed by Brussels.  It's surprising that Pro-Indy voters come out with that pish.  Being in the EU, whether independent or as part of the UK, is far better than being out of it.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

46 minutes ago, TheScarf said:

Such a daft argument isn't it.  It suggests all EU member states are governed by Brussels.  It's surprising that Pro-Indy voters come out with that pish.  Being in the EU, whether independent or as part of the UK, is far better than being out of it.

If you read what I said, I would rather be in the EU. However, Brussels does have some control in some areas so it is an topic to be debated as to how much and in what areas. Currency is a huge area of discussion. You cannot dismiss Westminster as all bad, and the EU as a rose garden. So no, not daft at all.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

14 hours ago, Billy Jean King said:

I agree there should be standards but what "qualifications" are you advocating ?

 

I'm sure a few years back there were proposals for some sort of minimum criteria to be met be local council candidates but they never seemed to materialise. Our local Council consists of ancient old troughers who have been there for decades, retired old farts and  behemoths of local business including taxi drivers and letting agents !

I am not advocating any, simply saying a lifetime in politics is perhaps not the best all round experience required to run a country and work effectively with al stakeholders. Our current batch of politicians, both UK and Holyrood are lacking somewhat.

[Blue Brazil Forever]

1 hour ago, TheScarf said:

Such a daft argument isn't it.  It suggests all EU member states are governed by Brussels.  It's surprising that Pro-Indy voters come out with that pish.  Being in the EU, whether independent or as part of the UK, is far better than being out of it.

The EU ie the Commission in Brussels has very recently told off Poland and Hungary for going their own way on agricultural matters.

Just saying like.

[Antlion]

2 hours ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

If you read what I said, I would rather be in the EU. However, Brussels does have some control in some areas so it is an topic to be debated as to how much and in what areas. Currency is a huge area of discussion. You cannot dismiss Westminster as all bad, and the EU as a rose garden. So no, not daft at all.

And you cannot claim Brussels would “replace” Westminster.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

I think indy’s fucked for a while now lads. 
Hopefully our grandchildren wont be a shower of gimps and go ‘haha look at what our grand parents were like eh?’ And get themselves out the UK. 

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

1 hour ago, Antlion said:

And you cannot claim Brussels would “replace” Westminster.

Thanks for that clarity and insight. 

[Antlion]

4 hours ago, SouthLanarkshireWhite said:

Thanks for that clarity and insight. 

Thank you for building that lovely straw-man of folk claiming the EU is a “rose garden” in comparison to the UK, and then thoughtfully knocking it down.

[SouthLanarkshireWhite]

15 hours ago, Antlion said:

Thank you for building that lovely straw-man of folk claiming the EU is a “rose garden” in comparison to the UK, and then thoughtfully knocking it down.

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

Guess whose corpse has been defrosted again?

https://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/why-scotlands-problem-isnt-with-vast-majority-of-english-people-gordon-brown-4161787

Who needs independence when we could have a regional mayor instead!

[lichtgilphead]

According to Gordy, the first step appears to be "abolition of the decrepit House of Lords"

Where have we heard that before?

Labour have been promising to abolish the Lords since before Dundee last won the Scottish Cup.

[BFTD]

More likely that Labour will be abolished before the Lords.

You could argue that, as representative of the working class, they already have been.

[D Angelo Barksdale]

If only he'd been the prime minister at some point he could have done all this stuff eh.