When will indyref2 happen?

[Loondave1]

Did I say we were?  Regardless it's worth a shit ton of money and accounts for the vast majority of the natural resources of the UK.  Countries fight wars over oil FFS.  The oil in the North sea is worth more than the UKs entire national debt.
 
It's just wilful ignorance to pretend this isn't the number one issue.

"worth a shit ton of money" is the kind of depth of detail that might sway me. Hopefully Nicola will use that exact phrase in her "can doon the road" revelation today.

[Loondave1]

Oil revenue amounted to 0.29% of UK GDP in 2016 apparently. It's really not a huge deal.
https://www.theglobaleconomy.com/rankings/Oil_revenue/
 

But it's "worth a shit ton of money" according to an earlier post, that's the fine detail.

[Kuro]

4 hours ago, welshbairn said:

Oil revenue amounted to 0.29% of UK GDP in 2016 apparently. It's really not a huge deal.

https://www.theglobaleconomy.com/rankings/Oil_revenue/

 

What about income tax from workers in the sector?  What about underwriting borrowing?  What about corporation tax?   You're quoting just the tax on the profits of oil.companies (PRT), there are a myriad of.income streams from oil.  In short, youre lying.  

[Kuro]

3 hours ago, welshbairn said:

Most of these jobs are already in Scotland. England wouldn't really be losing that much. Of course oil's important for the Scottish economy but the rUK won't panic at thought of losing their share.

Have you been living under a fucking rock? The UK has been panicking like f**k about it for 45 years.  Do some research.

[Kuro]

3 hours ago, AUFC90 said:

3 hours ago, welshbairn said:

Most of these jobs are already in Scotland. England wouldn't really be losing that much. 

40% are in England. I'm sure they'll hand us control of this huge industry seeing as it makes f**k all.

And decommissioning,which is set to be a massive industry.  The UK government is directing most of that to NE England.  I wonder why.

[Kuro]

3 hours ago, welshbairn said:

It is for the Scottish economy but it's not hugely significant for the UK economy as a whole. Certainly not enough to make it the main reason for English unionists being opposed to Scottish independence, and while they're quite happy to do far more damage to their economy by pursuing Brexit.

Brexit makes it even more imperative to keep the oil. Obviously. I think maybe thinking isn't for you tbh.

[Kuro]

Just now, MixuFixit said:

This is the big one that is the tremendous benefit to Scotland and mortal threat to rUK

And also why it was simply and obviously a lie to.say they would refuse a currency union.  If we'd voted yes they'd have begged us for one the next morning.

[AUFC90]

It is for the Scottish economy but it's not hugely significant for the UK economy as a whole. Certainly not enough to make it the main reason for English unionists being opposed to Scottish independence, and while they're quite happy to do far more damage to their economy by pursuing Brexit.

It is hugely significant and has been for 40 years. To suggest otherwise is just complete shite talk if I'm honest. The main reason for English unionist is coz flags etc. It's defo one of the main reasons that English politicians want to keep us.

[welshbairn]

Much of the benefits of oil are already in the Scottish economy. The parts that aren't in the hands of global corporations, and still go to Westminster, will have roughly 10% of the effect on rUK compared to the Scottish economy, just because of population and relative economy size. I don't think it is high in the priorities English Unionists. We're not going to get the hundreds of billions back from being part of the UK since oil was discovered in the North Sea.

Edited April 23, 2019 by welshbairn

[Kuro]

Just now, welshbairn said:

Much of the benefits of oil are already in the Scottish economy. The parts that aren't in the hands of global corporations, and still go to Westminster, will have roughly 10% of the effect on rUK compared to the Scottish economy, just because of population and relative economy size. I don't think it is high in the priorities English Unionists.

Yet its worth more than all the rest of the UK's natural resources put together.  Give it up man, you're basically trying to argue water isn't wet.  

[Kuro]

10 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Much of the benefits of oil are already in the Scottish economy. The parts that aren't in the hands of global corporations, and still go to Westminster, will have roughly 10% of the effect on rUK compared to the Scottish economy, just because of population and relative economy size. I don't think it is high in the priorities English Unionists. We're not going to get the hundreds of billions back from being part of the UK since oil was discovered in the North Sea.

I don't know why I'm even indulging your thick headed nonsense, but here is those notorious supporters of Scottish independence the Daily fucking Telegraph briefly explaining the value of oil to the UK economy.  Its literally the number one most valuable thing they could possibly lose, by miles.

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/newsbysector/energy/oilandgas/11844812/Britain-cant-afford-to-write-off-North-Sea-oil-after-40-years.html

[Kuro]

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11373208/Falling-oil-price-a-curse-not-a-tax-cut-for-British-economy.html

 

A few quotes from those two articles, in the massively SNP supporting DAILY FUCKING TELEGRAPH

 

"The industry around Aberdeen is vital to the overall health of the UK economy providing one of the few reliable sources of revenue for the Government since drilling began around the North east coast of Scotland in the early 70s. Around 450,000 people are employed in the oil and gas industry across the UK and in the financial year ending 2013 the Government earned £6.5bn in taxes from petroleum producers."

 

"Since the first oil produced off the north-east coast of Scotland arrived for processing onshore in the summer of 1975, more than 43bn barrels of crude have been pumped. That crude has been worth around £1.4 trillion – a figure greater than the country’s entire national debt – based on an average oil price over the period of $50 per barrel. However, that sum doesn’t come close to reflecting the true value of the North Sea to the British economy."

 

"Would the UK have been able to afford a free-to-access National Health Service without the North Sea oil windfall which has arguably helped to fund it?"

 

"Total tax receipts from oil and gas production from the UK Continental Shelf (UKCS) since 1975 have exceeded £330bn but that figure doesn’t reflect the worth of the industry to the Treasury. The North Sea supports the employment of around 450,000 people in the UK, all of whom pay income tax and spend their wages on the usual things such as homes and new cars."

 

"And this is why the country cannot afford to give up on its shrinking offshore oil and gas industry, despite the protests of the climate change lobby and economic cranks who dismiss its overall importance to British society. "

 

 

The UK has basically nothing left of any tangible value, we make nothing, have no natural resources left, except oil.  Its all services and financial instruments.  Oil is the jewel in the crown of the UK economy, and if we leave we take all of it.

 

A good rule of thumb is the more WM tells you oil is worthless and unimportant (slogan for 79 devo referendum 'Gone by 1990', Darling during 2014 referendum 'oil will run out by 2017') the more important it is and the more they can't afford to lose it.

[Tibbermoresaint]

13 minutes ago, Kuro said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11373208/Falling-oil-price-a-curse-not-a-tax-cut-for-British-economy.html

 

A few quotes from those two articles, in the massively SNP supporting DAILY FUCKING TELEGRAPH

 

"The industry around Aberdeen is vital to the overall health of the UK economy providing one of the few reliable sources of revenue for the Government since drilling began around the North east coast of Scotland in the early 70s. Around 450,000 people are employed in the oil and gas industry across the UK and in the financial year ending 2013 the Government earned £6.5bn in taxes from petroleum producers."

 

"Since the first oil produced off the north-east coast of Scotland arrived for processing onshore in the summer of 1975, more than 43bn barrels of crude have been pumped. That crude has been worth around £1.4 trillion – a figure greater than the country’s entire national debt – based on an average oil price over the period of $50 per barrel. However, that sum doesn’t come close to reflecting the true value of the North Sea to the British economy."

 

"Would the UK have been able to afford a free-to-access National Health Service without the North Sea oil windfall which has arguably helped to fund it?"

 

"Total tax receipts from oil and gas production from the UK Continental Shelf (UKCS) since 1975 have exceeded £330bn but that figure doesn’t reflect the worth of the industry to the Treasury. The North Sea supports the employment of around 450,000 people in the UK, all of whom pay income tax and spend their wages on the usual things such as homes and new cars."

 

"And this is why the country cannot afford to give up on its shrinking offshore oil and gas industry, despite the protests of the climate change lobby and economic cranks who dismiss its overall importance to British society. "

 

 

The UK has basically nothing left of any tangible value, we make nothing, have no natural resources left, except oil.  Its all services and financial instruments.  Oil is the jewel in the crown of the UK economy, and if we leave we take all of it.

 

A good rule of thumb is the more WM tells you oil is worthless and unimportant (slogan for 79 devo referendum 'Gone by 1990', Darling during 2014 referendum 'oil will run out by 2017') the more important it is and the more they can't afford to lose it.

£6.5bn is marginally more than 1% of total UK tax receipts. 

[Kuro]

2 minutes ago, Tibbermoresaint said:

£6.5bn is marginally more than 1% of total UK tax receipts. 

The 2008 financial crash that decimated the UK economy represented a temporary drop of 2% in GDP.  Losing oil would be a permanent drop, and that is only the tax on oil companies taking oil out of the sea.  They also pay corporation tax, which typically contributes 16-17% of the UK's entire corporation tax take.  Anyone claiming oil isn't a huge part of the UK economy is simply lying.

[Tibbermoresaint]

6 minutes ago, Kuro said:

The 2008 financial crash that decimated the UK economy represented a temporary drop of 2% in GDP.  Losing oil would be a permanent drop, and that is only the tax on oil companies taking oil out of the sea.  They also pay corporation tax, which typically contributes 16-17% of the UK's entire corporation tax take.  Anyone claiming oil isn't a huge part of the UK economy is simply lying.

The £6.5bn includes Corporation Tax, dimwit.

[welshbairn]

Weird that indy fanatics are arguing that England can't afford to lose us. Our biggest asset is renewables by the way.

[Kuro]

3 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Weird that indy fanatics are arguing that England can't afford to lose us. Our biggest asset is renewables by the way.

Why would that be weird?  Its a simple fact.  And yes it is, another industry we will be subsidising them with for decades if we don't leave.

[Tibbermoresaint]

7 minutes ago, Kuro said:

Why would that be weird?  Its a simple fact.  

Nonsense. Most of them won't even notice we've gone.

[renton]

Before May 2021 apparently.

[Ross.]

17 minutes ago, renton said:

Before May 2021 apparently.

Comments on the BBC article are as expected.

PS, in terms of the UK's balance of payments, North Sea Oil is absolutely huge. The prospect of losing that would see a similar, if not greater hit, to the value of GBP as we seen post Brexit vote.

PPS, for the reason above, please vote for independence. All the debt I carry is in GBP and it would be borderline worthless if Scotland voted Yes. This would please me immensely.