When will indyref2 happen?

[Mr Heliums]

3 hours ago, Randy Giles said:

I don't think it will. If anything it'll remind soft no voters of how fucked over they were. For that reason I don't want him to f**k off.

 

The reason he's coming out with this now is to give Scottish Labour something to cling to when they vote against the Government in the debate next week. Voting with the Tories leaves them open to the old accusations. This way, they can pretend they're offering something positive. It's just window dressing though – they know Brown is a joke figure but it does get them in the papers.

 

[Granny Danger]

If Gordon Brown is daft enough to enter the arena it's only fair that we remind folk of his record.  As Chancellor he failed to regulate the banks which contributed directly to the severity of the banking crisis that cost the country a fortune.  He could not have stopped it but by more sensible regulation he could have mitigated the worst effects.

Also as Chancellor he heavily promoted PFI in its various forms, one of the most reckless acts that I can recall from a Chancellor.  There are people still paying for that stupidity and will be for years to come.  Let's not forget his motivation too, to avoid an increase  in PSB figures.

Oh, and of course, as Prime Minister he did .... well .... absolutely nothing.

A total failure of a man.

 

[williemillersmoustache]

Is there anything more desperate than rolling out Gordon Brown?  Shooting their devo-bolt pretty early too, the BritNats are absolutely terrified. 

[Sherrif John Bunnell]

"Do you think George Bush actually knows who Gordon Brown is? He probably just thinks Tony Blair’s put on weight and had a mild stroke."

[Benjamin_Nevis]

17 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

If Gordon Brown is daft enough to enter the arena it's only fair that we remind folk of his record.  As Chancellor he failed to regulate the banks which contributed directly to the severity of the banking crisis that cost the country a fortune.  He could not have stopped it but by more sensible regulation he could have mitigated the worst effects.

Also as Chancellor he heavily promoted PFI in its various forms, one of the most reckless acts that I can recall from a Chancellor.  There are people still paying for that stupidity and will be for years to come.  Let's not forget his motivation too, to avoid an increase  in PSB figures.

Oh, and of course, as Prime Minister he did .... well .... absolutely nothing.

A total failure of a man.

 

Did he not also completely f**k over Pension funds as Chancellor?

[dogmc]

Brown is there to try to distract voters that labour as per usual are hand in hand with the tories. Surely must be someone in slab that can see the game is up for them here until they embrace indy. They will never regain their support in scotland whilst opposing it. At least if they supported indy now, they might have a chance of rebuilding in an iscotland. Will take years granted.....but then the gravy trainers are more interested in Westminster power grabs and getting fitted for the £300 a day ermine.

[dogmc]

Did he not also completely f**k over Pension funds as Chancellor?

And flogged the gold at a ludicrous price. If and when indy comes future generations are not going to be celebrating his legacy too much.....

[Benjamin_Nevis]

2 minutes ago, dogmc said:

Brown is there to try to distract voters that labour as per usual are hand in hand with the tories. Surely must be someone in slab that can see the game is up for them here until they embrace indy. They will never regain their support in scotland whilst opposing it. At least if they supported indy now, they might have a chance of rebuilding in an iscotland. Will take years granted.....but then the gravy trainers are more interested in Westminster power grabs and getting fitted for the £300 a day ermine.

This is why I'm genuinely stunned by SLab's strategy over the last 3-4 years. They've been on a continual downward trend almost since the 2011 Elections. They must surely realise that their only chance of being relevant again is to try to form themselves into something less than shambolic while the dust settles in a post-Indy landscape. They are of course suffering for the total disdain they've shown Holyrood since it's inception, sending all their political "talent" to Westminster has left the Scottish branch stuffed full of joke politicians who'd be out of their depth as Councillors. It doesn't help of course that they've had a succession of utter fuckwits leading them. Ian Gray, Johann Lamont, Jim Murphy and Kez. I mean, fucking hell, that's a who's who of absolute failure. 

I can only assume that Dugdale's continued slavish devotion to helping the Tories oppose the SNP in the 2014 IndyRef and the next one is a desperate attempt for her to follow that bra-making harridan into the House of Lords. There's not a cat in hell's chance she'll get on Labour's old gravy train to Westminster otherwise. 

Rolling out Gordon Brown again with the same uninventive pish as last time won't wash. IMO the SNP/Greens have to shout loud and from the rooftops when Labour vote with the Tories against Section 30 next week. This should ensure they get a quite tremendous shoeing in the Council elections, which will be delicious. 

[Crùbag]

Gordon Brown......

Rolled out with yet more froth. He has no power to implement his ideas even if he were serious. Liar.

[dogmc]

This is why I'm genuinely stunned by SLab's strategy over the last 3-4 years. They've been on a continual downward trend almost since the 2011 Elections. They must surely realise that their only chance of being relevant again is to try to form themselves into something less than shambolic while the dust settles in a post-Indy landscape. They are of course suffering for the total disdain they've shown Holyrood since it's inception, sending all their political "talent" to Westminster has left the Scottish branch stuffed full of joke politicians who'd be out of their depth as Councillors. It doesn't help of course that they've had a succession of utter fuckwits leading them. Ian Gray, Johann Lamont, Jim Murphy and Kez. I mean, fucking hell, that's a who's who of absolute failure. 
I can only assume that Dugdale's continued slavish devotion to helping the Tories oppose the SNP in the 2014 IndyRef and the next one is a desperate attempt for her to follow that bra-making harridan into the House of Lords. There's not a cat in hell's chance she'll get on Labour's old gravy train to Westminster otherwise. 
Rolling out Gordon Brown again with the same uninventive pish as last time won't wash. IMO the SNP/Greens have to shout loud and from the rooftops when Labour vote with the Tories against Section 30 next week. This should ensure they get a quite tremendous shoeing in the Council elections, which will be delicious. 

Agree totally. Must be someone somewhere in slab that can see this though. I know they are down to bare bones in terms of member n activists but there must be at least one person who can see that cosying up with the tories is suicidal. It's blindingly obvious to everyone else.

[Forest_Fifer]

Labour will never let the Scottish Branch support independence as that would mean losing any chance of ever forming a government at Westminster. Not that they've got any chance of doing it at the moment with Corbyn "in charge".

[Weesiecodal]

35 minutes ago, dogmc said:

Brown is there to try to distract voters that labour as per usual are hand in hand with the tories. Surely must be someone in slab that can see the game is up for them here until they embrace indy. They will never regain their support in scotland whilst opposing it. At least if they supported indy now, they might have a chance of rebuilding in an iscotland. Will take years granted.....but then the gravy trainers are more interested in Westminster power grabs and getting fitted for the £300 a day ermine.

I don't think they even have to embrace or support independence, i think they just have to acknowledge that people in their party have different opinions. The official party line could be against Indy, but individual members could make up their own mind. Kind of like the Green Party in reverse. Their official stance is in support of Indy, but they leave Green Party members to vote as they see fit (although I don't know of any green msps who voted NO last time)

Slab are driving their dwindling supporters away with this hard line. You would have thought they would have learned their lesson from the last time. There have apparently been thousands of people signing up to the Labour for Independence movement over the last week or so. They still identify as being Labour voters. SLab should be trying to harness and grow what little support they have left in Scotland. 

[Mr Heliums]

Perhaps the most frustrating thing about the Brown intervention – even more than the fact that the Labour Party were the ones viscerally opposed to the post-Vow transfer of powers in the Smith Commission – is the free ride he'll get from the media. It happened last time: endless sycophantic reporting, yet not one head-to-head interview with him challenging his nonsense. 

[Benjamin_Nevis]

10 minutes ago, Mr Heliums said:

Perhaps the most frustrating thing about the Brown intervention – even more than the fact that the Labour Party were the ones viscerally opposed to the post-Vow transfer of powers in the Smith Commission – is the free ride he'll get from the media. It happened last time: endless sycophantic reporting, yet not one head-to-head interview with him challenging his nonsense. 

Brown's intervention last time was pretty late in the day. This time round he's stuck his oar in early, so will hopefully be demolished by Ponsonby at some point. I wonder if he'll get to interview Kez again 

[Mr Heliums]

11 minutes ago, jupe1407 said:

Brown's intervention last time was pretty late in the day. This time round he's stuck his oar in early, so will hopefully be demolished by Ponsonby at some point. I wonder if he'll get to interview Kez again 

He won't be. He'll refuse interviews. He did last time and got away with it. It's scandalous, really.

[dirty dingus]

[Benjamin_Nevis]

28 minutes ago, Mr Heliums said:

He won't be. He'll refuse interviews. He did last time and got away with it. It's scandalous, really.

I didn't know that. What a fucking coward.

[invergowrie arab]

I know Labour blocked power after power coming to Holyrood during Smith after Browns last intervention but let's hear him out.

If his brilliant ideas are good all we have to do is sit back and cross our fingers that England elects a Labour govt.

[Benjamin_Nevis]

Just now, invergowrie arab said:

I know Labour blocked power after power coming to Holyrood during Smith after Browns last intervention but let's hear him out.

If his brilliant ideas are good all we have to do is sit back and cross our fingers that England elects a Labour govt.

I'd expect Brown will probably have died by 2035 tbh.

[invergowrie arab]

1 minute ago, jupe1407 said:

I'd expect Labour will probably have died by 2035 tbh.

FTFY