The Greenock Morton Thread - It's Better Than Yours

[Colkitto]

15 hours ago, port-ton said:

 

When you're informed your budget is cut a substantial amount from the previous season

 

 

Where is this coming from? Has this been confirmed anywhere?

[The Ghost of B A R P]

17 hours ago, DreamOakTree1 said:

There’s something not quite right or something missing from Dougie’s statements, demeanour and/or team selections:

He signed up Blues, Jacobs, Muirhead etc. and some new signings from lower divisions.

He complained about lack of funding for players.

He played with one sub against Falkirk (to make a point?).

He blasted off to Chick Young about his situation.

He started Easdale against Clyde (to make a point?)

I feel there can only be one of two possible explanations here:

1/ Dougie has messed up and hasn’t used his funding effectively.

2/ Dougie’s been assured if he signs the above players there will be further funding to add the required two or three players of sufficient quality to make us challengers for top four. Then after he’s done so the board have said “sorry that’s it, no more signings”.

I sense that, by Dougie’s responses, it’s explanation 2, which has made him feel betrayed and feel the need to let people know his frustrations.

 

There's clearly something not right... but I don't think it's either of the two things you go on to suggest.

We were told at the MCT meeting that Imrie was, understandably, unhappy with a budget that was originally down on last year; but then, apparently, a new sponsorship deal meant that last year's level was restored... and he was 'happy' with that.

The disagreements since (whatever your take on them) suggest that maybe that money (the new sponsorship) is not entirely secure or they're still waiting on it; either way, it's possible that the tension isn't about how much money he has, but what he can do with it (e.g. commit a significant sum to a single signing)... or more likely how quickly he can do it.

I can see a scenario where Imrie has targets lined up and/or agreements in principle (we were rumoured to have 'agreed' to sign Robbie Crawford, for example, and he still hasn't signed for anybody else) and the BoD are saying 'we need to wait'. Manager desperate to get the business done, BoD playing it cautious is not some weird situation; in fact, it involves both parties doing more or less what they're supposed to be doing.

[Btw - although I don't believe this - if it is the case that there's no more money: a. we've been openly lied to and heads should roll; b. we'll go down; and c. Imrie will be away long before that's confirmed.]

15 hours ago, port-ton said:

I personally don't think the likes of giving Blues, Muirhead etc new contracts is a black mark against Imrie. 

When you're informed your budget is cut a substantial amount from the previous season and you've got multiple players already on bottom end full time wages at the club who you know what they're going to give you and have performed admirably for you already then it makes sense to keep them rather than take a risk trying to find cheap gems from places. 

 

I broadly agree with that (without going as far as using 'admirable' to describe either player's performances).

The bottom line is that Imrie thinks he won't get better and/or more 'reliable' (cannae believe I'm using that word even indirectly in relation to Muirhead...) for the same money. He'll be judged on that, like any other manager, as the season plays out.

So we need to get rid of this fantasy, as you're saying, that we can just bullet the 'dung' and get better players in on our budget. They're not 'dung', they're flawed/inconsistent/limited... but clearly good enough to be part of a Morton squad in our current circumstances. Trick is to add better quality on top of that, which both improves the first team and gives us more options to counter injuries and suspensions (and in the process reduces the chances of us having to rely on boys who are either not ready or never going to be good enough).

[The Ghost of B A R P]

4 minutes ago, Colkitto said:

Where is this coming from? Has this been confirmed anywhere?

No, it hasn't.

[vikingTON]

Cameron Blues and Jack Baird are absolutely dung, and they're dung that were handed extended deals on the manager's watch. We could quite easily have proceeded with neither and prioritised those funds for a centre forward. 

And if Robbie Crawford really is the one that got away then I'd be questioning our coaching staff's ability to pick any sort of midfield targets quite frankly. 

It's time for Uncle Neil to pay an extended visit. 

Edited July 18, 2022 by vikingTON

[port-ton]

1 hour ago, Colkitto said:

Where is this coming from? Has this been confirmed anywhere?

Gordon Ritchie confirmed that the budget was originally less than last season, so it's on the record that at the time Dougie was deciding who to offer contracts to that his budget was less than what Gus was given the previous season. 

*Removed this paragraph as reeks of " I know something you don't know" energy which I hate. *

Edited July 18, 2022 by port-ton

[port-ton]

With regards to the budget, even just using what is public knowledge;

We released our two highest earners Hamilton and Ugwu and replaced them with a couple of loans from Imrie's mate. 

Released Wilson, Oliver, Ledger, McLean and Russell and Reilly and Mcentee left as well so include whatever portion of their wages we were paying. 

Replacents for those are Gillespie, Quitongo and Baird who are all in the category of struggling to get a full time deal and Pigniatello a youngster from Livingston. O'connor is probably the only one of the permanent signings that could be considered a bit of a coup for us. 

Regardless of giving Blues and Muirhead new deals and Strapp an improved contract, the finances from last season to this season just don't add up. 

You now have Imrie in the media with his squad at this point saying he will only get more players if the club give him money, and that they want him to give the kids a go this season. 

It's not even a dig at MCT or the board. The finances are what they are and if the money isn't there to give to the playing budget then they're not there. The club is debt free and cappielow is secured and that's the main aim, but unless there's outside investment the fans will need to get used to it and I don't imagine someone like Imrie will be around too long if the squad is out of its depth this season. 

[Mr Toon]

1 minute ago, port-ton said:

With regards to the budget, even just using what is public knowledge;

We released our two highest earners Hamilton and Ugwu and replaced them with a couple of loans from Imrie's mate. 

Released Wilson, Oliver, Ledger, McLean and Russell and Reilly and Mcentee left as well so include whatever portion of their wages we were paying. 

Replacents for those are Gillespie, Quitongo and Baird who are all in the category of struggling to get a full time deal and Pigniatello a youngster from Livingston. O'connor is probably the only one of the permanent signings that could be considered a bit of a coup for us. 

Regardless of giving Blues and Muirhead new deals and Strapp an improved contract, the finances from last season to this season just don't add up. 

You now have Imrie in the media with his squad at this point saying he will only get more players if the club give him money, and that they want him to give the kids a go this season. 

It's not even a dig at MCT or the board. The finances are what they are and if the money isn't there to give to the playing budget then they're not there. The club is debt free and cappielow is secured and that's the main aim, but unless there's outside investment the fans will need to get used to it and I don't imagine someone like Imrie will be around too long if the squad is out of its depth this season. 

Fair enough but if the 'squad is out of its depth this season' that will reflect on Imrie too and on his marketability.  No doubt his very decent start to management will have had some taking notice. Its largely up to him to build on that or to blow it and that's largely  about results but also about how he conducts himself.

[port-ton]

1 minute ago, Mr Toon said:

Fair enough but if the 'squad is out of its depth this season' that will reflect on Imrie too and on his marketability.  No doubt his very decent start to management will have had some taking notice. Its largely up to him to build on that or to blow it and that's largely  about results but also about how he conducts himself.

Alternatively after reinvigorating a club and fanbase that was in disseray in the space of less than 6 months, he probably feels entitled to be given at least the same resources to compete. 

I don't think he's conducted himself that poorly either, especially in the eyes of other clubs. All he's said is that he needs more players but doesn't have the budget to do so at the moment.  He's had his head down and got on with it all summer even when the rumours that he was going to walk away over a budget fallout were rife. 

[gmfc]

41 minutes ago, port-ton said:

With regards to the budget, even just using what is public knowledge;

We released our two highest earners Hamilton and Ugwu and replaced them with a couple of loans from Imrie's mate. 

Released Wilson, Oliver, Ledger, McLean and Russell and Reilly and Mcentee left as well so include whatever portion of their wages we were paying. 

Replacents for those are Gillespie, Quitongo and Baird who are all in the category of struggling to get a full time deal and Pigniatello a youngster from Livingston. O'connor is probably the only one of the permanent signings that could be considered a bit of a coup for us. 

Regardless of giving Blues and Muirhead new deals and Strapp an improved contract, the finances from last season to this season just don't add up. 

You now have Imrie in the media with his squad at this point saying he will only get more players if the club give him money, and that they want him to give the kids a go this season. 

It's not even a dig at MCT or the board. The finances are what they are and if the money isn't there to give to the playing budget then they're not there. The club is debt free and cappielow is secured and that's the main aim, but unless there's outside investment the fans will need to get used to it and I don't imagine someone like Imrie will be around too long if the squad is out of its depth this season. 

If that is the case MCT and the board need to have a re think of the way ahead before we end up in free fall. If  that is the sort of squad they are going for maybe time to put their hands up and say it is not working out the way expected before they really damage the club.

[Colkitto]

1 hour ago, port-ton said:

With regards to the budget, even just using what is public knowledge;

We released our two highest earners Hamilton and Ugwu and replaced them with a couple of loans from Imrie's mate. 

Released Wilson, Oliver, Ledger, McLean and Russell and Reilly and Mcentee left as well so include whatever portion of their wages we were paying. 

Replacents for those are Gillespie, Quitongo and Baird who are all in the category of struggling to get a full time deal and Pigniatello a youngster from Livingston. O'connor is probably the only one of the permanent signings that could be considered a bit of a coup for us. 

Regardless of giving Blues and Muirhead new deals and Strapp an improved contract, the finances from last season to this season just don't add up. 

You now have Imrie in the media with his squad at this point saying he will only get more players if the club give him money, and that they want him to give the kids a go this season. 

It's not even a dig at MCT or the board. The finances are what they are and if the money isn't there to give to the playing budget then they're not there. The club is debt free and cappielow is secured and that's the main aim, but unless there's outside investment the fans will need to get used to it and I don't imagine someone like Imrie will be around too long if the squad is out of its depth this season. 

 

If that is the budget then we should not have been looking at Full Time football this season. If there are no more additions to the squad then there has been one wholly f**k up! 

If what was said in the public domain regards budget and it has now drastically changed then we should be due an explanation from the Board pronto!  

[gmfc]

26 minutes ago, Colkitto said:

 

If that is the budget then we should not have been looking at Full Time football this season. If there are no more additions to the squad then there has been one wholly f**k up! 

If what was said in the public domain regards budget and it has now drastically changed then we should be due an explanation from the Board pronto!  

Good luck with that one.

[Jamie_M]

2 hours ago, port-ton said:

We released our two highest earners Hamilton and Ugwu and replaced them with a couple of loans from Imrie's mate. 

Released Wilson, Oliver, Ledger, McLean and Russell

We didn't 'release' any of them except Russell, we tried to keep them all (haven't seen any reports of derisory offers).

Anyway, the natives are getting restless, so the board sanction the signing of a youth ringer 2nd keeper.

 

[port-ton]

21 minutes ago, Jamie_M said:

We didn't 'release' any of them except Russell, we tried to keep them all (haven't seen any reports of derisory offers).

Anyway, the natives are getting restless, so the board sanction the signing of a youth ringer 2nd keeper.

 

Ugwu wasn't offered anything as far as I remember as both him and the club mutually agreed quite early on in the summer to move on and Ledger was released as well but the term released was more in terms of they were under contract and now they're not. 

 

[The Ghost of B A R P]

33 minutes ago, Jamie_M said:

 

Anyway, the natives are getting restless, so the board sanction the signing of a youth ringer 2nd keeper.

 

Fair enough, actually. Inexpensive cover for Schwake getting injured or sent off.

Three more please, with at least one coming in before the Hamilton game.

[Ludo*1]

Where's Hamilton off to?

[The Ghost of B A R P]

9 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

Where's Hamilton off to?

Nobody knows…

[Jamie_M]

2 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

Where's Hamilton off to?

The only talk has been St Johnstone but that seems to have cooled.

[Jamie_M]

2 hours ago, port-ton said:

Ugwu wasn't offered anything as far as I remember as both him and the club mutually agreed quite early on in the summer to move on and Ledger was released as well but the term released was more in terms of they were under contract and now they're not. 

 

OK, missed Ledger on the list, but Ugwu was said to be 'in discussions' until just over a month ago rather than instantly binned at the end of the season like others.

[vikingTON]

5 hours ago, port-ton said:

Alternatively after reinvigorating a club and fanbase that was in disseray in the space of less than 6 months, he probably feels entitled to be given at least the same resources to compete. 

Where does he expect these resources to come from, and why did he show no such qualms either when applying for the job eight months ago or in accepting an 18 month deal? Neither the regime nor the fundamental financial facts have changed since then (other than rising costs that apply across the board). 

I'm nowhere near as convinced as you are in this latest stab in the back myth. Scottish football management is a tough job at this level, but rather than admitting that they drop a bollock from time to time, it's nowadays fashionable for managers to just peddle nonsense about 'circumstances behind the scenes' to whitewash their records. Just last week a previous Morton manager was laughably claiming to a national newspaper that similar boardroom shenanigans were responsible for him getting binned at Falkirk. As opposed to his policy of signing a parade of utter haddies on ludicrously expensive contracts, before getting relegated and floundering a league below.

Imrie's not in the same league of total bullshitter as McKinnon (for it was he) but this is a wider pattern among Scottish football managers at the moment that is getting tiresome. That's the context on which I read his recent comments - to which I reply 'nobody forced you to give Blues or Baird extended deals - get on with it'. 

Edited July 18, 2022 by vikingTON

[vikingTON]

NB: And of course, if the manager felt that the current model and budget was unworkable, then he could have used his leverage towards the end of last season to push for a different one and extolled the virtues of an Arbroath model or similar. I don't recall any such messaging in public though and his recent statements don't suggest that either. Instead it reads as just 'gies more money', under the same unsustainable model.