Is the SNP a left wing party? (Or Social Democratic, or progressive..

[Granny Danger]

This is picking up on comments in various other threads and certainly merits a serious discussion.

I hope we can avoid getting bogged down in definitions but I would suggest that by 'left wing' we are talking about a political position that believes in redistributive policies, a fairly high level of state intervention and control of the economic and financial framework with rejection of free market capitalism, a non exploitative foreign policy, equal access to health and education, and protection for the vulnerable in society. I know that's not an exhaustive list but we could spend a whole thread on definitions.

I would also suggest that a left-wing perspective accepts the need for democratic structures both internally and externally. For the sake of this discussion it could probably be described as Social Democratic.

I think in this election the SNP manifesto was further to the left than any of the other major parties. The pledge on spending above the rate of inflation, the commitment to no further cuts and the abolition of Trident were all far more radical than the Labour position. I also believe that had the election ended up with an anti-Tory majority the SNP would have followed through in trying to have these policies adopted (though it was never going to happen with Trident).

However at a Scottish level the SNP government has been nowhere nearly as radical. The most glaring example being the freeze on the Council Tax which has been regressive, benefitting the wealthiest whilst leading to cuts in council services many of which hit the most disadvantaged.

Universal free prescriptions and no tuition fees for further and higher education could be argued to be similar in their effect, though there are many on the left who would argue (rightly in my point of view) that a free Health Service and free eduction are a cornerstone of a just society.

In short it could be argued that the SNP has presented itself as a left of centre party with little actual examples in its actions to back that up. Where it actually has power in Scotland more could have been to introduce redistributive policies.

Will we see the SNP moving further to the left? If so what would be the implications for the broad support it has?

Personally I would like to see a more radical position adopted in Scotland, however for me the goal must be independence and if we have to wait until that has happened to see a more left-of-centre party in power so be it.

[doulikefish]

Broad church is my preference,ive never hid the fact that id be on the right of centre in a indy Scotland and vote conservative in the euro elections.We must appeal to all.

[invergowrie arab]

Its further left than it ever has been in terms of policies and members.

[capybara]

I think in the past the old retort of Tartan Tories may have had an element of truth. Certainly some of their past successes were in former Tory areas. Perthshire , booting out Walker and taking seats such as Fairbairns old haunts with Rosanna Cunningham, hardly a shrinking rose.

But gradually they have become a party that can represent and win in all parts. Ward by ward, council by council. Yes they have had to compromise , a policy here is not always as popular as one elsewhere.

The fact that they have won in all parts of Scotland , rural and urban means they must be doing something right. But are those in rural Aberdeenshire in harmony with Glasgow's east end?

Is it opposition to Austerity and the bedroom tax or the reduction in Business rates? I do not know.

I am left of centre I am a socialist and I feel comfortable with most of the SNP agenda, if not all. I certainly feel far more at home with giving my vote to them than Labour.

I would be wary of trying to put a label on anything these days, it is a bit like trying to pin a tail on a rather angry donkey. Political parties need to change ( take note Labour) or suffer. But people are fickle ,voters will vote on a number of issues. Yes class and self interest. But equally on policy and personality.

I vote SNP and I am on the left of the political spectrum. After that it is for others to decide. And I am sure they will.

[Jim Leighton]

They go nowhere near far enough to justify their perception as a true left wing party. As the OP notes, almost all their social policies benefit the middle classes. Council tax freeze, free bus travel for all pensioners, free prescriptions for all - populist guff to get as many onside as possible to try and get independence.

They're a pressure group who've managed to dupe the mainstream.

[sophia]

They go nowhere near far enough to justify their perception as a true left wing party. As the OP notes, almost all their social policies benefit the middle classes. Council tax freeze, free bus travel for all pensioners, free prescriptions for all - populist guff to get as many onside as possible to try and get independence.

They're a pressure group who've managed to dupe the mainstream.

Bottom lip all aquiver

[NotThePars]

Sturgeon talks more left than Salmond and there's a possibility the swelling of new members could take further to the left. I hope so.

[Mr Bairn]

The SNP are one of the few parties that can appeal to people from all walks of the political spectrum. Leftists are happy with an alternative to the permanent centre right UK governments, a party that will defend public services, whilst those of the right vote SNP due to their competent management of the Svottish ecnomy and society

[Granny Danger]

I think in the past the old retort of Tartan Tories may have had an element of truth. Certainly some of their past successes were in former Tory areas. Perthshire , booting out Walker and taking seats such as Fairbairns old haunts with Rosanna Cunningham, hardly a shrinking rose.

But gradually they have become a party that can represent and win in all parts. Ward by ward, council by council. Yes they have had to compromise , a policy here is not always as popular as one elsewhere.

The fact that they have won in all parts of Scotland , rural and urban means they must be doing something right. But are those in rural Aberdeenshire in harmony with Glasgow's east end?

Is it opposition to Austerity and the bedroom tax or the reduction in Business rates? I do not know.

I am left of centre I am a socialist and I feel comfortable with most of the SNP agenda, if not all. I certainly feel far more at home with giving my vote to them than Labour.

I would be wary of trying to put a label on anything these days, it is a bit like trying to pin a tail on a rather angry donkey. Political parties need to change ( take note Labour) or suffer. But people are fickle ,voters will vote on a number of issues. Yes class and self interest. But equally on policy and personality.

I vote SNP and I am on the left of the political spectrum. After that it is for others to decide. And I am sure they will.

This is my position too; and I've gone further and joined. However if the SNP is to present itself as the party of social justice, as it did during the election, it has to do more than it has in terms of redistributive policies.

[pandarilla]

They go nowhere near far enough to justify their perception as a true left wing party. As the OP notes, almost all their social policies benefit the middle classes. Council tax freeze, free bus travel for all pensioners, free prescriptions for all - populist guff to get as many onside as possible to try and get independence.

They're a pressure group who've managed to dupe the mainstream.

The principle of free travel for pensioners and free prescriptions for all are ones which no left wing person could argue with. Means testing should be for a bare minimum of the welfare state as a whole.

The SNP for many is a vehicle to independence. Until then they have a difficult balance to keep - but under excellent stewardship over the last few years they've been managing that just fine.

I want to see the Greens be more prominent in Scottish politics - to keep the SNP honest if nothing else.

[pandarilla]

Its further left than it ever has been in terms of policies and members.

This is a VG point. Political parties move and evolve with their members.

The SNP has become what Scotland wants it to become.

[Geronimo]

They are certainly not a left-wing party. There are people in the SNP who's political view isn't too dissimilar to some Tories with regards to economic issues, while others would align their outlook more with members of the Green Party.

They appeal to a large segment of the political spectrum - both left and right - with independence obviously being central to the parties ethos. Take that away, and you get a weird Labour/LibDem love child.

In today's terms, they are perhaps a 'progressive party', but in modern day Westminster that's not particularly difficult. In a theoretical post-Independence Scotland, they wouldn't get my vote and I wouldn't consider them the long-term solution to the political omnishambles of western Europe.

[Granny Danger]

They are certainly not a left-wing party. There are people in the SNP who's political view isn't too dissimilar to some Tories with regards to economic issues, while others would align their outlook more with members of the Green Party.

They appeal to a large segment of the political spectrum - both left and right - with independence obviously being central to the parties ethos. Take that away, and you get a weird Labour/LibDem love child.

In today's terms, they are perhaps a 'progressive party', but in modern day Westminster that's not particularly difficult. In a theoretical post-Independence Scotland, they wouldn't get my vote and I wouldn't consider them the long-term solution to the political omnishambles of western Europe.

In a post-Inpendence Scotland we would still need a multi party system, it would be very undemocratic to have anything else. Though I think the SNP as a political force would hold sway for a while it would be interesting to see where they would eventually end up on the political spectrum.

[strichener]

Left wing/right wing are terms best consigned to the dustbin. The electorate are far more complicated and intelligent for this old school division to be meaningful in todays politics.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

If we were to use the European view of political parties I'd say they were a mix of social and christian democracy.

[Granny Danger]

Left wing/right wing are terms best consigned to the dustbin. The electorate are far more complicated and intelligent for this old school division to be meaningful in todays politics.

Absolute utter pish. The way in which we govern our country is very much on a left/right division.

The views anyone, including you, hold on a range of issues can be very easily identified as left or right.

As for the electorate being more intelligent on issues of politics, the overwhelming majority must have chosen to stay silent during the election campaign.

[Geronimo]

In a post-Inpendence Scotland we would still need a multi party system, it would be very undemocratic to have anything else. Though I think the SNP as a political force would hold sway for a while it would be interesting to see where they would eventually end up on the political spectrum.

Of course we should continue to promote a multi-party system, although I'd hope the SNP would take considerable strides towards breaking up media monopolies and removing political corruption altogether so to ensure proper democracy is resumed, as is not the case today in the UK. Replacing the FPP system would also be an absolute must.

They would probably settle as a party of the centre-left and retain some of their core vote, although people seeking further drastic political change would look elsewhere.

[strichener]

Absolute utter pish. The way in which we govern our country is very much on a left/right division.

The views anyone, including you, hold on a range of issues can be very easily identified as left or right.

As for the electorate being more intelligent on issues of politics, the overwhelming majority must have chosen to stay silent during the election campaign.

Maybe to folk that are closer to drawing their pension than starting a family.

I have what would traditionally be called right wing views on a range of subjects (private health care would be one). At the same time, as I have just been posting in the last day or so, left wing views in relation to employment. So am I left or right wing or maybe I am centre right or centre left.

OR

Maybe I am too unique to be classed in terms or left and right.

[Pete's Frontier]

I'd call them old redundant left, no concept of fiscal responsibility: want to spend big on things that are just pure cash burn like benefits that are already too high, up taxes on wealthy which chases money and investment away, weak on how to run and what makes a strong competitive economy in a global marketplace, naive about things like nuclear deterrents - willing to unilaterally disarm in the face of increasing threats. All the sort of things the old left in Labour were forced to confront to be electable in the 90's, but then allowed to creep back in with predictable results. If this was 1975 and we still had forty years of peak north sea oil production to come I could indulge the SNP's old style tax and spend, but we are not in that position or even close. So naively old left and in for a rude awakening.

[pandarilla]

Maybe to folk that are closer to drawing their pension than starting a family.

I have what would traditionally be called right wing views on a range of subjects (private health care would be one). At the same time, as I have just been posting in the last day or so, left wing views in relation to employment. So am I left or right wing or maybe I am centre right or centre left.

OR

Maybe I am too unique to be classed in terms or left and right.

The terms are as meaningful as ever. You have some right wing views and some left wing views - that has always been the case for many politically active people.