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Mr Bairn

Mhairi Black appreciation thread

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Books have to be balanced . Governments in the period from 2000 to 2008 worked on the assumption that borrowed money could be used for current expenditure . The welfare state is under pressure because the assumptions on which it was based are becoming more and more obsolete .

Books have to be balanced eh? That explains why the national debt under Gideon's expert stewardship has DOUBLED to £1.5 trillion since they came to power in 2010?

In what way is the welfare state becoming more obsolete? One of the basic tenets of any welfare system is public responsibility for those unable to avail themselves of the minimal provisions for a basic standard of life.

How do you think disabled people with no prospect of an improvement in their quality of life feel to hear the Tories bang on about aspirations and hard working families? Don't you think they have aspirations too? Or are they just not as important as those who "contribute"?

I genuinely hope you are trolling. If not... Jesus.

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You are not really understanding my point but I suspect you don't really want to given your polemic rants . The assumptions on which affordabillity of welfare states were based are changing , ie higher life expectancy , erosion of traditional manufacturing industries , globalisation etc ..... . What grinds my goat is politicians making promises in old money so to speak .

Most countries have ran deficits since 2008 due to the aftershock .

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You are not really understanding my point but I suspect you don't really want to given your polemic rants . The assumptions on which affordabillity of welfare states were based are changing , ie higher life expectancy , erosion of traditional manufacturing industries , globalisation etc ..... . What grinds my goat is politicians making promises in old money so to speak .

Most countries have ran deficits since 2008 due to the aftershock .

None of which alters the fact that a welfare state should be society's safety net for it's weakest and most vulnerable. Which politicians have made promises in old money?

I accept that most countries run a deficit. Two questions though:

1) Did poor and disabled people cause the financial crash?

2) Is attacking and slashing welfare the most cost effective and best way of attacking the deficit and saving money?

Edited by Fide

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None of which alters the fact that a welfare state should be society's safety net for it's weakest and most vulnerable. Which politicians have made promises in old money?

I accept that most countries run a deficit. Two questions though:

1) Did poor and disabled people cause the financial crash?

2) Is attacking and slashing welfare the most cost effective and best way of attacking the deficit and saving money?

1) no and 2) yes and no . Agree with you on weakest and most vulnerable 100 % but it aint that simple .

Every politician is in denial on costs of welfare and health and even worse how to pay for it . They are in the business of winning elections .

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1) no and 2) yes and no . Agree with you on weakest and most vulnerable 100 % but it aint that simple .

It really is.

A 5 year old could tell you of better ways to run a country.

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Funny how the developed countries that didn't practice austerity and actually increased spending, got to pre recession levels a lot quicker.

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Let me tell you something . No tooth fairy & no magic money tree .

I don't think anyone of an SNP/ Yes persuasion is under any illusions in that respect.

What IS certain however, is that there are at least 134 different ways the Conservatives can look to reduce spending before pushing vulnerable people closer to the edge of the precipice.

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Funny how the developed countries that didn't practice austerity and actually increased spending, got to pre recession levels a lot quicker.

Those countries were ran prudently with largely sustainable income and expenditure . Uk , ireland and others ran bubbles . I want a sustainable society not one based on sand and non sustainable promises .

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Those countries were ran prudently with largely sustainable income and expenditure . Uk , ireland and others ran bubbles . I want a sustainable society not one based on sand and non sustainable promises .

That can only be done by growth. Not imaginary growth but good growth spawned by wise investment. Austerity harms meaningful growth.

As for sustainable society. Any society that's happy to throw the bottom 10% to the dogs is no society at all.

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That can only be done by growth. Not imaginary growth but good growth spawned by wise investment. Austerity harms meaningful growth.

As for sustainable society. Any society that's happy to throw the bottom 10% to the dogs is no society at all.

Completely agree.

What is galling is when people, including those who know better, talk about 'the economy' in the same way as they talk about the weather; as if it is a natural force over which societies have no control. We have a great deal of control over how to organise our economies, we just need the political will to exercise that control.

We are rapidly returning to dogmatic politics where economic theory is used as a tool to meet specific political objectives regardless of the effectiveness of the policies and the long term societal damage.

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Anyone who doesn't see how the Tories are using the financial difficulties over the last few years to hammer the poor and restructure the economy to benefit the better off is quite frankly a moron. The type of person who thinks using the phrase 'economically illiterate' makes them sound clever because they've heard a hundred other people use the phrase.

Edited by Gordon EF

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No one wants "austerity " but we can't keep borrowing and borrowing . Sorrow to rain on the groupthink here.

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No one wants "austerity " but we can't keep borrowing and borrowing . Sorrow to rain on the groupthink here.

As I said before, not "borrowing and borrowing" is working out just super for Gideon. Since 2010, national debt has DOUBLED from over £700bn to £1.5 trillion. Do you realise how much IDS and his sadistic chums stand to "save" from welfare reform? I'll give you a hint - it's a fucking drop in the ocean compared to unpaid corporate tax.

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No one wants "austerity " but we can't keep borrowing and borrowing . Sorrow to rain on the groupthink here.

In what way is the current government not "borrowing and borrowing"?

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In what way is the current government not "borrowing and borrowing"?

You are right, they are borrowing too much . It is not sustainable.

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You are right, they are borrowing too much . It is not sustainable.

Behave yourself.

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Funny how the developed countries that didn't practice austerity and actually increased spending, got to pre recession levels a lot quicker.

Is there a source for this anywhere?

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