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Bul21402

The same old same old topic

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From a personal perspective and someone who was involved at the time the decision was taken for 2pm kick offs, I'm afraid for me it was personal convenience.

3pm kickoffs invariably meant not getting home till 8pm by the time all the necessary tasks were finished after the game and any chance of a social evening out with the family was gone.

I know that might be seen by one or two on here as another example of a typically small club mindset but that was the reality of the situation for many Committee members at the time, maybe things have changed since my days though

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What clubs voted for or against 2pm kick offs Hibee Jibee?

I just went to the old threads.

Most seemed to suggest 2pm was wanted by many smaller clubs which together with some Lanarkshire clubs won the various days.

e.g.

The vote was only won by a small majority. Someone on the Pollok forum checked out the voting and only two of the clubs in the Super League voted for it.

As for the constant 2pm throughout the season, yes - that was the original reason for it. But that was before there were SPL games kicking off even earlier. Things changed for a lot of clubs when it started affecting the gate money.

It's had a huge impact at Pollok, but I guess that's reason for some clubs to keep 2pm. :rolleyes:

the vote saw only 2 Superleague clubs in favour, but the vast majority of District sides want 2pm... why not let the Superleagues kick-off at 2:30pm or 3pm, with Districts remaining at 2pm

Cmontheloknow will have the answer to this, but I'm fairly sure that it was Shotts who proposed the move to 2pm kick offs. (something to do with their travelling I think)

Arthurlie, along with several others, have been trying in vain to get the league to revert to 3 pm, due to the effect of the luchtime SPL games on attendances.

Lots of rumours of the 2pm origin. In order to get the results on Radio Clyde, so Shotts' bus missed the football traffic coming over Kingston Bridge, and the most bizarre one so one of the WRSJFA officials could get out early for his tea!

Then as monthelie says, a few seasons later, Setanta started doing 12.30pm kick offs and gates had been hammered ever since, and the clubs with supports have been trying to ditch it. So far it has failed to be removed at the 2006 and 2007 WRSJFA AGMs and was not permitted to be on the agenda in 2008 on a technicality.

coach

Posted 07 May 2010 - 18:20

Totally agree Jon. However, the West Region "top brass" wont take on any ideas to improve our game.

For a start, the 2pm kick-offs have been killing our game in recent seasons. If the mafia dont want to go back

to 3pm, what about 2.30pm? Do the East Region league games not kick-off at 2.30pm?

That said the kick-off point was a bit of a tangent, granted. Question was about fixtures coming week-to-week and if/why clubs don't want it changed. Apologies.

Edited by HibeeJibee

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Think the Clydebank fan has a point here - don't see why he's being attacked. Small clubs with minimal attendances will be less bothered by gate income, cash from programme sales and match sponsorship, and so on - and therefore are probably less bothered about only getting their fixture the previous weekend. And they are more likely to be in the district leagues (and the West Region doesn't cover a huge area anyway), so things like arranging coaches in advance is less of not an issue. Same sort of situation as 2pm kickoffs, 3rd Saturday in July rule, floodlights ban, September holiday weekends, U-turn on West Region reconstruction, etc. etc.

Ultimately the LL has a season-long fixturelist, the EOSL has half-season lists, the SOSL has theirs out to the end of the season and so on. Even the North Juniors tend to have theirs out further in advance, IIRC. Only real differences seem to be the Junior Cup and the non-use of floodlights.

North Juniors seem to have a more liberal view on artificial light, and most of their clubs go out of the Junior Cup in the early rounds in the autumn; meanwhile in the senior leagues only the South Challenge Cup has priority over league games, and full use is made of floodlight.

Junior Cup? As proposed but rejected a few years ago (2007 I think) played to a finish in the early rounds in one game as all local cup ties are from late August to November and we have a chance of a fixture list. What? The National trophy that is so sacrelige that we have companies clambering over themselves to Sponsor it and replays barely cover the expenses of both teams, lets move on, make Junior football a bit more professional and the chance of a fixture list for the real sponsors ie the the money that lands in clubs hands. Time for change. Even TJ mentioned this himself a couple of years ago despite being totally against it at the time in 2007. Who has the guts to take it forward and save the Junior game?

Edited by tellyboy

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Junior Cup? As proposed but rejected a few years ago (2007 I think) played to a finish in the early rounds in one game as all local cup ties are from late August to November and we have a chance of a fixture list. What? The National trophy that is so sacrelige that we have companies clambering over themselves to Sponsor it and replays barely cover the expenses of both teams, lets move on, make Junior football a bit more professional and the chance of a fixture list for the real sponsors ie the the money that lands in clubs hands. Time for change. Even TJ mentioned this himself a couple of years ago despite being totally against it at the time in 2007. Who has the guts to take it forward and save the Junior game?

Also, if you prevent any Junior Cup ties taking place between November and the end of Feb, then the wrecking-ball effect of ongoing postponements is also removed.

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Also, if you prevent any Junior Cup ties taking place between November and the end of Feb, then the wrecking-ball effect of ongoing postponements is also removed.

Hopefully that'll be a given at the agm this summer .

LADESIDE

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The changes I would make is:

Junior Cup 3rd/4th Round played by mid November then restart mid/end February. You may not be able to fit in Junior Cup well if don't use November or February at all. This would hopefully cut out as many postponements and Junior Cup affecting league so much. Can have just league games during December & January when postponements ver likely and if postponed no need for changing fixtures every week.

I'd have 3pm kick offs in months that possible for Super League teams. Could trial it in August / September with teams.

14 or 16 team league is essential for the top league. No reason why can't do this and could start league 2/3 weeks earlier to fit in the games. The Ardagh Cup / Central Cup doesn't seem like will be scrapped so probably have to go for 14 teams. Plenty of teams in Super First could add to Super Premier and would give top end Super First clubs better chance for promotion and top league less cut throat and fairer as 22 games is in my opinion too few to decide relegation / Champions.

Edited by Shannon

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The way it works in the Lowland League is that we have dedicated league weekends and perhaps one weekend out of four is given to the various cup competitions. A few league fixtures are held back at the beginning of the season (most fixtures are published for the year) to give some flexibility where teams have been knocked out of their various cup competitions.

This weekend is cup weekend for the Lowland League. However as ourselves and Selkirk were knocked out in the previous round we can fit in the league match that was frozen off a few weeks back.

This means that we can plan ahead with a certain degree of confidence (weather dependant).

It worked a treat last season and seems to be working well again this year

Edited by Cicero

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The changes I would make is:

Junior Cup 3rd/4th Round played by mid November then restart mid/end February. You may not be able to fit in Junior Cup well if don't use November or February at all. This would hopefully cut out as many postponements and Junior Cup affecting league so much. Can have just league games during December & January when postponements ver likely and if postponed no need for changing fixtures every week.

I'd have 3pm kick offs in months that possible for Super League teams. Could trial it in August / September with teams.

14 or 16 team league is essential for the top league. No reason why can't do this and could start league 2/3 weeks earlier to fit in the games. The Ardagh Cup / Central Cup doesn't seem like will be scrapped so probably have to go for 14 teams. Plenty of teams in Super First could add to Super Premier and would give top end Super First clubs better chance for promotion and top league less cut throat and fairer as 22 games is in my opinion too few to decide relegation / Champions.

The problem with 3pm ko's was that they had to be changed to 2.45, 2.30,2.15, 2pm as the Winter kicked in, you had to keep checking ko times and many fans were turning up after games had started.

A 16 team top division is a must 16-16-15 simple but the league cup like in the East must go but when you have influential figures like Kennie vehemently opposed it won't happen.We seen that even when the clubs do vote for change with the St Ants proposal if those at the top don't want it, they will make sure it doesn't happen.

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What I never understood was why the reconstruction proposal wanted 4 region-wide divisions? I.e. over 4 tiers:

16

16

16

16

That'd potentially be unpopular with smaller clubs concerned about travelling, and Ayrshire clubs not wanting dropped a tier.

Doing a mirror of the East Region reconstruction, with 2 expanded region-wide divisions then 2 districts (NE & SW), would seem the perfect compromise:

16

16

16 16

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My team play on 3G and had three out of our first four games at home. Bonkers when we would have a better chance of playing at home in the winter.

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Give it four years till I retire and I'll do it with a pencil and notepad. Get the furthest distance away games played on a Saturday early in the season, allowing for cup ties teams play home and away every two weeks and only in exceptional circumstances to teams play twice before they have played everyone else once. How hard can it be, we put men on the moon nearly 50 years ago but can't run a 14 team league.

In our division (superleague first) furthest away game is Maybole/Kilsyth and indeed it was played early in the season, but for Maybole that was a home game so by your logic the return game should take place late in the season, and it probably will.

Clubs in close proximity should by the same logic have both their games in mid-season, one after the other so we should have played Cumbernauld and Rob Roy home and away in the last two weeks of December and the first two weeks in January. Fine, but for the small matter of grounds being playable, Scottish cup ties (and replays) taking priority, etc.

Keep your pencil sharpener and a large supply of paper handy

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Clubs in close prowimity should b kept 4 midweek games instead of sending teams all over the country 4 half 6 kick offs

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