Bully Wee Villa Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I'd favour... 10th in League Two: relegated. 1st in Highland League play 1st in Lowland League. Winners promoted. 2nd Highland League vs 3rd Lowland League and 2nd Lowland League vs 3rd Highland League - winners progress to promotion playoffs. Promotion playoffs: 9th in League Two, loser of 1st vs 1st game and winners of two 2nd vs 3rd games. Semis then Final. Winner promoted (or stays up, if the 9th place team wins). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrigtonClyde Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 League One has three full-time sides, of which, Morton and Dunfermline continue to revenue and fanbase potential, many times over that of any side in League Two. And our squad is just peachy right now; thanks for asking. If the Highland League is so good then Lowland League sides will be winning precisely zero promotions to the national league for the foreseeable future; not a fast-track at all then. And as you've implicitly conceded, they have as much right to compete as any of the current 'Lowland' participants in League Two. What sanctions, specifically, have been threatened to keep an entire league of clubs with divergent interests schtum? This ought to be terrific stuff, as by your paranoid ramblings I've already half confused the powers of the Highland League authorities with those of a Third World junta. The reality of course is that there has been silence because there is in fact no substantial unrest. Your faux concern for the integrity of the leagues below is merely a sham to hide your own increasing rattled state, at the prospect of your club becoming either the 2nd biggest club in East Kilbride (third if you count the Juniors) or in time the 8th or 9th biggest club in Lanarkshire, by dropping out of the national league. You're fooling absolutely no-one. And neither are you Your obsession with my club & now by the sounds of it East Stirling is quaint, but hey, what else have you got to do in Largs but go fishing When your mum leaves a cup of tea on the sideboard for "when your finished" can you tell her 2 sugars? Cheers How many posts?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Well no, you've clearly not got a clue. The HL clubs were not asked to vote on this, their league officials told them that this was now part of the pyramid system & have threatened sanctions against any club who would refuse promotion. Your misinterpretation of silence as advocating the system shows how naïve you are. That isn't my understanding of what happened up north. According to what I've read on FitbaNorth and articles in the local press up there, there was a meeting where the SFA presented a proposal to form a new Highland Regional Division (in similar way to how LL formed)... HL clubs voted unanimously against this. Then at a subsequent meeting they voted overwhelmingly for HL itself to be the feeder: according to FN was 16-1 with Buckie (IIRC) the solitary 'No' and Cove's rep not present. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 BrigtonClyde answered your fully post but I would like to take issue with you with this part. You seem to have a problem with a team called East Stirling and this is not the 1st time. Presumably you are referring to a club of a different name so I will take it that you are one of the following: 1) being lazy in calling the club by the wrong name 2) you are being derogative by using the wrong name deliberately (e.g. should I call you call Gren Mort ?) 3) you are an idiot and know no better I will leave the choice of the above up to you. Perhaps there maybe is even another reason. Happy to hear it. I completely do not comprehend what you are trying to express when you say “potentially being in the same league as East Stirling or a league with nine East Stirlings instead?” Is this a pop at East Stirlingshire perhaps or at other current teams in the bottom SPFL ? I honest just don’t know what you are meaning. Do you want a 10 team league based on 1 team plus 1 team which also has 8 reserve teams and how would that benefit the SPFL? Please enlighten us. Even stranger is “ Yes, I'm sure they're pinching themselves at such good fortune.” East Stirlingshire along with the majority of the other clubs in the lower league voted to have the relegation play-offs. My club understood that at the end of this season that one club would end up bottom and would have to go through this process. We understood it may be our club but we accepted this for the good of the game. When Greenock Morton were in the bottom league not so long ago I would hope that your club directors would have voted as my club has done and you would have been proud that they did so. This is a serious question after other posters here have corrected your mis-informed gaffs above – Do you have real interest in this very important matter concerning the lower league clubs and top senior non-league clubs or are you just added posts to your posts tally for the sake of it? If it is the later, please be gone. Otherwise I welcome your educated and reasoned thoughts. You've simply gone off on here. The bottom line is this: there is little to no difference between the likes of East Stirling and the Lowland League teams - a point that discredited Brigton's tear-stained fretting about whether new clubs would "contribute" to the setup. And the only other aspect in which East Stirling could have been implicated, was as an example of a club that should have been relegated by any definition of footballing merit. And as I said above, it may well prove beneficial to clubs in that position to go down and rebuild, rather than shipping goals week after week, season after season. That being the case I'll leave you to deal with the absolutely massive, double fritter supper currently on each of your shoulders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vikingTON Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 And neither are you Your obsession with my club & now by the sounds of it East Stirling is quaint, but hey, what else have you got to do in Largs but go fishing When your mum leaves a cup of tea on the sideboard for "when your finished" can you tell her 2 sugars? Cheers How many posts?? I'd like to know which sanctions were specifically threatened by the all-powerful body that is, err, the relevant Highland League authorities, which so far is the only basis for your 'Highland League clubs were pushed into this against their will' claim. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamamafegan Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The sooner the set-up changes to make it easier for positive, aspiring clubs to enter League 2 the sooner we'll see no marks like East Stirling and Clyde disappear and finally serve their time. Out with the old, in with the new. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dzall Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 In reading this conversation, I keep seeing complaints about what the LL & HL teams are going to add to SPFL2. What standard are people wanting/expecting? Teams that could compete for European football in their 1st season in the national league? As has already been said this is the start of a long slow journey which will hopefully see improvements at all levels of Scottish football. Yes it may take a few years for teams to settle into their 'proper' level but that was always going to happen during the transitional period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thom & Gerry Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Caley Thistle, Ross County started out in HL, were given an opportunity and seized it. Potential is no use without opportunity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 This is a serious question after other posters here have corrected your mis-informed gaffs above – Do you have real interest in this very important matter concerning the lower league clubs and top senior non-league clubs or are you just added posts to your posts tally for the sake of it? If it is the later, please be gone. Otherwise I welcome your educated and reasoned thoughts. Gave you a greenie for use of "top senior non-league clubs". Maybe Brigton Clyde will finally get the message that the Lowland League and the Highland League (not too mention the East of Scotland and South of Scotland leagues) are senior leagues, and the SPFL leagues aren't the only senior leagues in Scotland! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karpaty Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The sooner the set-up changes to make it easier for positive, aspiring clubs to enter League 2 the sooner we'll see no marks like East Stirling and Clyde disappear and finally serve their time. Out with the old, in with the new. but Spartans want in..they want in!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawfieldAggro Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Gave you a greenie for use of "top senior non-league clubs". Maybe Brigton Clyde will finally get the message that the Lowland League and the Highland League (not too mention the East of Scotland and South of Scotland leagues) are senior leagues, and the SPFL leagues aren't the only senior leagues in Scotland! Maybe clubs who wanted the status of operating under a 'senior' umbrella ought to clarify their desire or otherwise to competing in 'senior' (or in proper wording, 'national') competitions. Not for the good of any club staring down the barrel, but in the interest of credibility. It's been a half arsed attempt from the beginning, and the standard of the HL hasn't changed one iota because of the implementations. So why should their status?? VT is usually full of wind and pish, but his point about Elgin maybe going down, recharging then returning stronger further down the line is, in theory, more appealing than forcing clubs into a status they just don't want. Turriff in the L2. Aye right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Maybe clubs who wanted the status of operating under a 'senior' umbrella ought to clarify their desire or otherwise to competing in 'senior' (or in proper wording, 'national') competitions. Not for the good of any club staring down the barrel, but in the interest of credibility. It's been a half arsed attempt from the beginning You realise 'senior' has referred to all such leagues not just SFL since Victorian times? You want Crichton, Kelso, Orkney etc to play nationwide?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hampden Diehard Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Pity all the redevelopment work had to be funded via the public purse, SFA coffers and the National Lottery to prevent it being closed during the 1990s though, wasn't it? And so what that QP invested in it 100 years ago - so did thousands of other clubs, but they don't all expect the rest of the world to bail out their White Elephant 24/7 (hate to break it to you, but if Hampden was reliant on pop concerts to pay its way, the bulldozers would have been in decades ago - hence the whole "national stadium" fantasy and the moving of the various tiers of Scottish football into it to help justify its existence).Like I said, QP fans have a colossal gall taking any other club to task about where they get their funding from, being the biggest shower of unashamed spongers this side of the royal family. Lots of ground development all over the UK was funded by the public purse and the lottery from 1975 onwards to assist with making them all-seater and safer. No one puts cash into Hampden because of Queen's Park; they do it to give Scotland a football ground that isn't run by either side of the Old Firm. That we own it is a bonus for us. Hooray! And I wasn't sneering about sugar daddies funding teams or about where else they get their cash. Again you make your own assumptions on what people say to suit your argument. My point is that a club funded via a rich individual will come a cropper when that stream of funding dries up, which it quite often does, unless there is a sustainable stream of income to follow it. Which there generally isn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawfieldAggro Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 You realise 'senior' has referred to all such leagues not just SFL since Victorian times? You want Crichton, Kelso, Orkney etc to play nationwide?! Yer arse. The definition of senior, in a Scottish football context, is 'national'. In the way English football's definition is/was 'full members'. Come on, up the game. You're maybe not as on-the-ball as you think. And fwiw, i couldn't care less where any club plays......just as long as they don't greet about the pitfalls of being part of a national set-upwhich they are otherwise keen to exploit. I guess the same argument about this could go the same way as those about clubs opting to make a deliberate action to spunk fortunes on players, but not basics like travel and accomodation. In many cases, the money is clearly there. What would now be the point of Mr Brora or Mr Fortmartine doing so to win a league, and not embracing the opportunity presented, other than lining the pockets of players who'd be making the very same decision?? 'No time-wasters, please' should have been requested. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clyde01 Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The sooner the set-up changes to make it easier for positive, aspiring clubs to enter League 2 the sooner we'll see no marks like East Stirling and Clyde disappear and finally serve their time. Out with the old, in with the new. Would this be the same no mark Clyde who regularly made st johnstone our bitches in division 1 in the not so distant past? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Yer arse. The definition of senior, in a Scottish football context, is 'national'. In the way English football's definition is/was 'full members'. Come on, up the game. You're maybe not as on-the-ball as you think. And fwiw, i couldn't care less where any club plays......just as long as they don't greet about the pitfalls of being part of a national set-upwhich they are otherwise keen to exploit. I guess the same argument about this could go the same way as those about clubs opting to make a deliberate action to spunk fortunes on players, but not basics like travel and accomodation. In many cases, the money is clearly there. What would now be the point of Mr Brora or Mr Fortmartine doing so to win a league, and not embracing the opportunity presented, other than lining the pockets of players who'd be making the very same decision?? 'No time-wasters, please' should have been requested. The term senior in no way relates to national. We are a non-league club who played in the regional senior East of Scotland League and now play in the regional senior Lowland League. The distinction between junior and senior is often mixed up by West of Scotland residents because (for years) they didn't have a senior non league set up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShawfieldAggro Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Nonsense. As far as i can remember, any collective description of SFL/SPL-SFL 38/40/42 clubs, until 2013, has been as 'senior clubs'. The other clubs who made up the rest of the Scottish Cup, whetever they played, were simply non-league. The reason, to my understanding, that WoS didn't/doesn't have its own non league setup is because most of the clubs can sustain themselves at national level, although granted, not all do much better than that. This is most probably down to the populations of most of these areas being able to support senior football, and most from the very earliest days of Scottish football. So no real need to 'create' clubs in the West to clutter things up further. Also, there is a vibrant well-supported Junior scene, which isnt difficult to distinguish from the Seniors either. Its a completely different game altogether. There have always been five levels of the game in Scotland, and even still, only two are remotely connected and have only been so previously through full SFA membership and formerly entry to the Qualifying Cup, and now via the fifth tier; it may be that others use the terms 'senior' or 'junior' based on age; in that case,,your mistake is applying logic where its not required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacksgranda Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Highland_Football_League "Historically, the league was one of the three senior leagues outwith the Scottish Premier League and Scottish Football League, along with the East of Scotland and South of Scotland Leagues" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 The North Caledonian League is technically part of the senior grade as well given it's run by the North of Scotland FA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HibeeJibee Posted February 18, 2015 Share Posted February 18, 2015 Yes, I don't know what ShawfieldAggro is on about here, it's like arguing that ketchup is blue. It's not unheard of for people - even journalists - to say 'Senior' when they mean 'SPFL'. But that isn't the definition. Senior has meant 'clubs', 'leagues' and 'clubs in leagues' in direct SFA membership since the days of top hats and handlebar moustaches. Many people actually call the EOS League "the East Seniors"... i.e. to distinguish from the East Juniors (themselves officially "East Region, Scottish Junior FA" IIRC). Ask Spartans, Huntly, Duns, Wigtown or Golspie if they're Senior, their answer will be a puzzled "of course?". Afterall they aren't Amateur or Junior. There are 6 Senior leagues at the moment and about 110 Senior clubs? So those Seniors playing nationwide only represent ~35%. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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