101 Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 3 hours ago, MixuFruit said: I think you just invented the forestry commission Which they chucked, don't know if ditching Forestry on its own has been good bad or indifferent. Back on topic it would be really cool to have a return to some kind of Caledonia forest 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 The amount of land in public hands (first problem to solve) which could be given over to this isn't actually all that much. There are basically three "empty" bits of Scotland e.g. minimal roads and settlements the Dee, Geldie, Feshie triangle, Sutherland and Ben Alder area. I think there is something to be said for trying to connect Rothiemurchas to Glen Feshie 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgun Posted November 19, 2020 Share Posted November 19, 2020 6 hours ago, jamamafegan said: What I meant in my previous post was the creation of a woodland thats purpose is to simply exist. It doesn’t need to produce timber - it’s there to provide a new home for wildlife and a place for people to visit, a place that’s good for our mental well being. 2 questions come to mind. 1. How much would rich people pay to use this forest? and more importantly.. 2. How much would rich people make off this forest? Unless the answer to those 2 questions is somewhere in the range of "a shit ton", then I'm afraid that's as far as your (excellent) idea will go. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dunning1874 Posted November 20, 2020 Share Posted November 20, 2020 21 hours ago, jamamafegan said: Doh! Okay, so this is more what I was thinking. When you open the FC website you are met with the message “forests and land that Scotland can be proud of.” I think that’s laughable. What is there to be proud about with non-native plantations used primarily for timber? What I meant in my previous post was the creation of a woodland thats purpose is to simply exist. It doesn’t need to produce timber - it’s there to provide a new home for wildlife and a place for people to visit, a place that’s good for our mental well being. Sorry for the length of it, but you'll probably be interested in Andy Wightman's conference speech from this year on Green proposals for reforestation: https://andywightman.scot/speech-to-sgp-autumn-conference-2020 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuckleMoo Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 Excellent article in the Guardian about the reintroduction of native species in Scotland paying particular attention to wolveshttps://www.theguardian.com/environment/2020/nov/24/landscape-of-fear-why-we-need-the-wolf-rewilding-scotland 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 I can't see large predators being reintroduced, there just isn't the public demand for it and land owners fencing off huge tracts of land would be opposed. Wouldn't mind hearing wolves howling while camping or seeing them at a distance but not sure how I'd feel if a pack of them turned up if I was fishing in a remote area. . 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
invergowrie arab Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 2 hours ago, MixuFruit said: was about to post a snorting 'oh come on they'll just keep their distance it'd be fine' but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks Most of these are in pish countries 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamamafegan Posted November 24, 2020 Author Share Posted November 24, 2020 I can't see large predators being reintroduced, there just isn't the public demand for itThe tide is definitely turning. Besides, what’s more important here is that nature demands it.land owners fencing off huge tracts of land would be opposed.Landowners already fence of huge tracts of land for various reasons. That’s what styles are there for (or if you are nimble like me, climb it.) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manifesto Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 4 hours ago, MixuFruit said: was about to post a snorting 'oh come on they'll just keep their distance it'd be fine' but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks Reminds me of the Elkhound getting surrounded 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Manifesto Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 2 minutes ago, MixuFruit said: Jings. Poor dug. In the description it says she has a steel vest that stopped them killing her, so that's nice I guess. Did feel like I was watching it's last day on earth. In Grizzly Man Herzog has this great line about the complete indifference of nature, you can see that in those wolves. That dug is just a meal not a kindred spirit. It's when the hound stops, and you just see a pair of eyes next to a tree trunk , then it's backs to the wall stuff from the dug. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 5 hours ago, MixuFruit said: was about to post a snorting 'oh come on they'll just keep their distance it'd be fine' but https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wolf_attacks A girl was killed, only her head was recovered. Will probably be on the poster should we try to bring them back, I would like to start with Lynx and Wildcats before going for Wolves. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afca32 Posted November 24, 2020 Share Posted November 24, 2020 Scotland is a boring country for dangerous wildlife. Walking through a field of cows is about as scary as it gets. Start with wolves, then work towards reintroducing grizzlies. A walk or camping trip in the hills should come with an element of fear and the chances of actually being attacked by a wolf are very, very slim. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 Nice video on rewilding 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scary Bear Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 2 minutes ago, 101 said: Nice video on rewilding Cool. Now we Just need a few bears and wolves. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamamafegan Posted November 25, 2020 Author Share Posted November 25, 2020 Video from the wilds of Finland. You can see the habitat we are missing out on in the background - pine woodland and scrub growing on boggy ground. Aspen and birch in there as well.This is what Scotland would have looked like 2000 years ago - complete with bears and wolves. Many people think the idea of us living alongside big predators is ludicrous. If everyone in the world had that attitude the big land predators of the world would all be extinct. The fact of the matter is that these predators belong in the country and biodiversity is poorer without them. The pace at which action is being taken sickens me - it’s a snails pace. There’s no reason why Lynx shouldn’t be in our forests by now. Start with them and then get the wolves in. Give the farmers plenty of notice to get their shit together with regards to electric fences and guard dogs if they need them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
101 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 3 minutes ago, jamamafegan said: Video from the wilds of Finland. You can see the habitat we are missing out on in the background - pine woodland and scrub growing on boggy ground. Aspen and birch in there as well. This is what Scotland would have looked like 2000 years ago - complete with bears and wolves. Many people think the idea of us living alongside big predators is ludicrous. If everyone in the world had that attitude the big land predators of the world would all be extinct. The fact of the matter is that these predators belong in the country and biodiversity is poorer without them. The pace at which action is being taken sickens me - it’s a snails pace. There’s no reason why Lynx shouldn’t be in our forests by now. Start with them and then get the wolves in. Give the farmers plenty of notice to get their shit together with regards to electric fences and guard dogs if they need them. Lynx wouldn't touch a herd of sheep that had an alpaca even, not sure if they would be sufficient deterrent to a wolf right enough but like you say no reason not to try it we need something to control our eco system 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MuckleMoo Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 Video from the wilds of Finland. You can see the habitat we are missing out on in the background - pine woodland and scrub growing on boggy ground. Aspen and birch in there as well.This is what Scotland would have looked like 2000 years ago - complete with bears and wolves. Many people think the idea of us living alongside big predators is ludicrous. If everyone in the world had that attitude the big land predators of the world would all be extinct. The fact of the matter is that these predators belong in the country and biodiversity is poorer without them. The pace at which action is being taken sickens me - it’s a snails pace. There’s no reason why Lynx shouldn’t be in our forests by now. Start with them and then get the wolves in. Give the farmers plenty of notice to get their shit together with regards to electric fences and guard dogs if they need them.Magnificent beasts! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G51 Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 (edited) The problem with rewilding is that it’s perceived as gentrification for rural communities. Often proposed by the upper and middle classes living in England or the Central Belt, it tends to see the Highlands as nothing more than empty land that’s being misused - not unlike the attitude deployed during the Clearances. Proponents of rewilding and the reintroduction of wolves need to understand this and better understand the social effects of what they’re proposing. Edited November 25, 2020 by G51 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbornbairn Posted November 25, 2020 Share Posted November 25, 2020 54 minutes ago, G51 said: The problem with rewilding is that it’s perceived as gentrification for rural communities. Often proposed by the upper and middle classes living in England or the Central Belt, it tends to see the Highlands as nothing more than empty land that’s being misused - not unlike the attitude deployed during the Clearances. Proponents of rewilding and the reintroduction of wolves need to understand this and better understand the social effects of what they’re proposing. As a farmer's wife once said to me "Ye canna bile a view". Any proposal to change the use of land in the Highlands has to be profitable but as has been said already, a diverse and natural environment should be a far bigger moneyspinner than the narrow, elitist, outdated way it's used just now. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rizzo Posted November 26, 2020 Share Posted November 26, 2020 (edited) If anyone fancies a laugh check out the SGAs response to the fact grouse moors now require to be licenced with plans for this to commence immediately. https://news.scottishgamekeepers.co.uk/2020/11/chairman-comment-grouse-moor-licensing.html?m=1 Edited November 26, 2020 by Rizzo 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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