Granny Danger Posted December 28, 2014 Author Share Posted December 28, 2014 No, I really don't think it will. Still a few days to go so I could be wrong............but I doubt it . Gerry Hassan summarised the position well: Making the mistake that Yes speaks for Scotland misunderstands politics on numerous levels: the nature of democratic legitimacy, the contours of the No victory, and any notion of future political and constitutional change. Pro-independence opinion has to grasp that it does not speak for majority Scotland; it must reach out, listen and empathise, and not engage in the politics of smugness and self-righteousness. Quoting Gerry fucking Hassan is a sign of absolute desperation. I remember him from Dundee about 30 odd years ago; a wannabe Labour Party apparatchik. If you really want to quote an 'academic' try to quote one who doesn't have his tongue quite so far up the establish rectum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 Yes, maybe the price of oil will be at record levels come 2016. Who knows? Nobody, because the price of oil can be highly volatile at times. Which is kind of the point being made. If politicians have radical plans for change, it's entirely reasonable for folk to ask how they intend to continue paying for roads and hospitals and pensions and so on. When people asked the SNP this question during the referendum, what they got repeatedly was dismissive claims that the oil would pay, followed by glib pronouncements about people "running Scotland down" and snotty remarks about how, like, the UK is in lots of debt, innit. Well, if we want an example of how an economy that's based on products that have volatile prices fares in times of hardship, Russia looks like a good one right now. There are plenty of differences of course, but more than enough similarities for concern. It speaks volumes that the best, most sensible responses to that fact appear to be - acknowledging that oil prices are volatile but that they may not be in a year's time, or just the usual empty-headed patrio-trolling bollocks. It looks quite a lot like neither the SNP nor their followers give even the slenderest of shits whether the nation will be helped or harmed by their plans, and a lot more like they're willing to gamble everyone's livelihoods upon a deliberately vague promise of jam tomorrow, for daft misty-eyed, anthem-singing flag-wavey reasons. And that's probably because they are. A few questions: - Do you know how much of the Scottish economy is based on oil? - Do you think Scotland could run its own affairs (to a similar standard) without the oil revenues - Did you intend to link the Scottish and Russian economies in the way you did? Its a ridiculous comparison. - You laugh off the argument about the UK's debt - but is that not core to your argument? How reliant is the UK economy on the City of London - and how stable is that sector? - Do you really think the success of the Yes campaign was based on flag-waving and anthem-singing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Todders Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 Yes, maybe the price of oil will be at record levels come 2016. Who knows? Nobody, because the price of oil can be highly volatile at times. Which is kind of the point being made. Which is why it's a sensible idea to create an oil fund to protect income against volatility. An idea which unionist idiots sniggered at during the campaign. If politicians have radical plans for change, it's entirely reasonable for folk to ask how they intend to continue paying for roads and hospitals and pensions and so on. When people asked the SNP this question during the referendum, what they got repeatedly was dismissive claims that the oil would pay, followed by glib pronouncements about people "running Scotland down" and snotty remarks about how, like, the UK is in lots of debt, innit. That simply never happened. The answer given was that these services would be paid for in the same way as they are now...the same way as every other civilised nation on Earth pays for them. Through taxes. To suggest Scotland could not accomplish this IS "running Scotland down" as it's suggesting we are unable to manage our own affairs in the same way that every other nation of people do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I'd say it was a year when the people of Scotland voted decisively against independence and a massive crash in the price of oil demonstrated beyond all debate that the SNP's economic policy is worse than back-of-a-fag-packet nonsense - just utter who-cares, worry-later gibberish and fvck the consequences. Still, who knows? There are hundreds of thousands of people in the country who are loudly and unashamedly declaring that they couldn't give a damn about how the bins are going to get emptied and how the hospitals are going to stay open, because the most important thing is getting it right up Labour. So you're probably correct that this is the decisive moment for the future of the independence cause. Strike while the people are clueless, angry and utterly disinterested in the reality of governance, and anything might happen. Its been a terrific year for the Union. The people have spoken...in incredible numbers due to the unprecedented turnout to commit the nation to the union. Its been an annual horribilis for the separatists. Though not for the SNP. Who to be fair knew long long before the vote that No was a certain winner.. And have planned for the future on that basis. Salmond has slunk off.. Tail firmly between legs. With him goes the failure and monumental failure it was. For the SNP though. The future within our Union is very bright. Which is good to see. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 Dont feed the obvious troll. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I thought no had won. It did The people of Scotland took the opportunity to come out in our droves to affirm our support for the union and utterly reject secession by a massive majority. Very very very pleasing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkinFighter Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 So he's still at it eh Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 Dont feed the obvious troll. Which part isn't true? I'm intrigued. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I do understand the seethe and anger the separatists have. It must be crushing to have your hopes dashed by democracy. Its a real b*****d. Its why we've seen the lashing out and the rage infused posts over the past few months. Really though.. Going into 2015 you should try and relax...let the anger go. Come to terms with the fact that Scotland utterly rejected separatism. Try to plan for the next campaign if you choose to.. That's democracy... But just control your rage. At least a little bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I think it lovely that the "flock" have created yet another thread, just to share the "seethe" of the day, sit round the camp fire so to speak and have a right good "agree" with each other Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HaikuHibee Posted December 28, 2014 Share Posted December 28, 2014 I think it lovely that the "flock" have created yet another thread, just to share the "seethe" of the day, sit round the camp fire so to speak and have a right good "agree" with each other Aye ecto, that's right. We should swallow HBs pish. Tired BritNat urine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Quoting Gerry fucking Hassan is a sign of absolute desperation. I remember him from Dundee about 30 odd years ago; a wannabe Labour Party apparatchik. If you really want to quote an 'academic' try to quote one who doesn't have his tongue quite so far up the establish rectum. Absolute desperation :lol: says the guy who claims 2014 is the year of independence. Democracy rocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ForzaDundee Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Tubbs is seething because the Union is dying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YassinMoutaouakil Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 I think we need to shut the f**k up about independence for a while tbh. The best way to actually change something is by being proactive and working with what weve got (ie Holyrood) instead of focusing on something that the Scottish people clearly don't want right now. Sure, we might get 48% in a referendums in a few years but if we want to actually win then we need to give it time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Absolute desperation :lol: says the guy who claims 2014 is the year of independence. Democracy rocks. Yes... I believe losing heavily in the.. Independence vote.. Was a victory for independence What 2014 has conclusively proved is that the Scottish electorate dont wish us to secede from the union. That is now factually determined. And by a huge majority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Tubbs is seething because the Union is dying. Is this in the same way as the sun is also dying ? Wise words. I seem to remember being told by the CDU crew that the Union was going to die this year. How did that work out for you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Must say it was nice of Old Man Danger to start this abomination of a thread to deflect somewhat from Colkittos Gotterdammerung. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Aye ecto, that's right. We should swallow HBs pish. Tired BritNat urine. the 1st to react, how predicable, how tiresome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AUFC90 Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Everyone should just keep ignoring the troll. The last time he was getting ignored for a while he went into a meltdown that lasted weeks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted December 29, 2014 Share Posted December 29, 2014 Everyone should just keep ignoring the troll. The last time he was getting ignored for a while he went into a meltdown that lasted weeks. so that will be everyone except you, thanks for confirming that most on here unable to make decisions for themselves, that a "cheerleader" is required Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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