Sons v Rovers

[Michael W]

It's probably just as well that no-one has tried to justify it, then. Pointing out that it happens to plenty of people in their working lives (which is also unjustified) doesn't mean it's acceptable in football.

It isn't right, but it happens. Unless you can find a way to drastically alter human nature, it will keep happening.

[Muzza81]

Spot on. If you gave me an option between my cosy little office job or play for Raith on £700 pw but have to suffer some mild abuse for a couple of minutes a week, I know what one id take.

'Abusing' is also a bit far. I would wager the majority of the 'abuse' was telling them how bad they are at football. Big deal.

[roverthemoon]

Not totally convinced by the 'it isn't right but it happens' approach to this. If folk had taken this approach to something like racism in grounds then we'd still be in the situation where it would be acceptable to abuse players because of the colour of their skin because you could probably argue that it's human nature to be racist.

OK, shouting at Grant Anderson for being unable to deliver a cross or Joe Cardle for his inability to beat the first man at a corner isn't on a par with racism or homophobia or sectarianism but it does help create a fairly unpleasant atmosphere at times. I've got up and moved seats at Rovers games in the past so my kids aren't having to listen to some red faced, vein popping, angry bloke screaming abuse at Rovers players. Call me a liberal soft arse but even when I'm at games without my kids I'd rather be in a crowd offering reasonably positive encouragement than moaning, booing or screaming abuse. It creates a shite atmosphere and suspect it does nothing to make the players actually up their performance.

[Nowhereman]

Not totally convinced by the 'it isn't right but it happens' approach to this. If folk had taken this approach to something like racism in grounds then we'd still be in the situation where it would be acceptable to abuse players because of the colour of their skin because you could probably argue that it's human nature to be racist.

OK, shouting at Grant Anderson for being unable to deliver a cross or Joe Cardle for his inability to beat the first man at a corner isn't on a par with racism or homophobia or sectarianism but it does help create a fairly unpleasant atmosphere at times. I've got up and moved seats at Rovers games in the past so my kids aren't having to listen to some red faced, vein popping, angry bloke screaming abuse at Rovers players. Call me a liberal soft arse but even when I'm at games without my kids I'd rather be in a crowd offering reasonably positive encouragement than moaning, booing or screaming abuse. It creates a shite atmosphere and suspect it does nothing to make the players actually up their performance.

Excellent post. Unfortunately the folk who give abuse are usually the ones who shout loudest.

[Muzza81]

Is shouting at someone for hitting the first man with a cross really abuse? Jeezo.

How do you guys feel about shouting at the ref for making a bad decision? Are you okay with that?

[Yoss]

How do you guys feel about shouting at the ref for making a bad decision? Are you okay with that?

No.

[Michael W]

Unless we strip the human race of emotion, these things will happen. People get carried away and say/shout things that are irrational/wrong/not justified in the heat of the moment. I've no doubt many will regret things said when they've had time to contemplate it.

I don't see why racism is relevant here, given that abusing someone because of their race is illegal and generally shouting abuse at someone more than likely isn't. That doesn't make abusing someone acceptable behaviour.

It is unhelpful, and I agree it creates a nasty atmosphere. If you expect people to continue acting completely rationally when they are frustrated/annoyed, then IMO you have very unreasonable expectations of people as a whole. Emotions influence actions often without thought and some people control this better than others.

I don't see the point in shouting abuse at the team - it achieves nothing. I don't think those that do see the point in it either, but maybe they express their emotions more openly than me who'll moan about it anyway without screaming at the players (often on here).

[Muzza81]

No.

Absolutely agree with this but it happens and no one ever (well rarely) moans about it. They just accept that but as soon as it happens to a player people moan about that.

I assume these same people will be fuming when their own players 'abuse' a referee. No difference from a fan 'abusing' a player.

[Rovers_Lad]

dont think its much to do with supporters shouting at players or refs its.what they shout is more of an issue

[Ebanda's Handyman Services]

Is shouting at someone for hitting the first man with a cross really abuse? Jeezo.

How do you guys feel about shouting at the ref for making a bad decision? Are you okay with that?

I'm fine with shouting at the ref for a bad decision as I feel it's part and parcel of the game.

I'd also be completely fine with the ref shouting back at me to sit doon and shut my stupid pus.

This should go for players as well. If you're big enough to shout abuse at someone, you should be big enough to expect some back.

Folk will scream all kinds of obscenities at players and then get all indignant if the player has enough and simply asks them to f**k off.

It's embarrassing.

[Muzza81]

Not disagreeing with that. I've been told to f**k of a few times by opposition players, I couldn't give a solitary f**k and I would call out anyone who complains when they get a bit back.

The reality is, if a ref have the w****r sign to a set of fans who were abusing him it would be mayhem. The ref would need escorted out the ground.

Football fans are, by and large, morons.

[Bring Back Paddy Flannery]

I mind a guy running up and telling a steward Darren Gribben gave Sons fans the finger. This was after he'd spent the entire game giving him relentless abuse. When I see the guy I still have a burning hatred for him due his little bitch reaction, I'd have preferred if Gribben drop kicked him.

I actually quite enjoy it when the players give a bit back.

[Ebanda's Handyman Services]

Not disagreeing with that. I've been told to f**k of a few times by opposition players, I couldn't give a solitary f**k and I would call out anyone who complains when they get a bit back.

The reality is, if a ref have the w****r sign to a set of fans who were abusing him it would be mayhem. The ref would need escorted out the ground.

Football fans are, by and large, morons.

Stupidly, a footballer I have great respect for is Charlie King.

Purely down to flicking me the middle finger with a grin on his face when I levelled some cheek at him up at Brechin.

As you say though, not everyone is capable of taking shit back. Some getting to the point where they want to run on the pitch to make an even bigger c**t of themselves than their 'banter' has already.

[The Moonster]

I mind a guy running up and telling a steward Darren Gribben gave Sons fans the finger. This was after he'd spent the entire game giving him relentless abuse. When I see the guy I still have a burning hatred for him due his little bitch reaction, I'd have preferred if Gribben drop kicked him.

I actually quite enjoy it when the players give a bit back.

To be fair, Gribben is a horrible, slimy, stealing c**t*.

*Allegedly.

[Yoss]

The ref having the ability to shout abuse back wouldn't make it any better. I still wouldn't want to do my job, or their job, on those terms.

The only occasion, offhand, when I can vaguely recall shouting in the general direction of a ref was that time the Pars brought two subs on and only took one player off. I seemed to be the only person in my immediate vicinity who noticed, and that was a situation that actually needed to be rectified. So it'd be fair to say I was endeavouring to bring the issue to general attention, but it'd still be a stretch to call it "shouting at the ref", and there was certainly nothing that could be construed as abuse.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not suggesting a zero-tolerance approach; it doesn't bother me in the least practice when other people do it (or I wouldn't go to games, I guess). But if you're asking me, in principle, whether I think it's okay then the answer is still no.

[Ebanda's Handyman Services]

Thinking of this, one of the most embarrassing things I've ever seen when following the Rovers was a wee ball boy at Alloa getting ripped to shreds by grown men.

Seriously, the poor wee lad couldn't have been any older than 12 years old and was being taken to bits about his weight and parentage amongst other questionable slurs.

Cringing just thinking about that. The boy was just trying to wind up rival supporters and was left close to tears while doing a job for his team.

[CALDERON]

I personally dont mind it when players give stick back, but its silly on their part.

Morons have been going to the football shouting keech since time began. It will always be part of the game, no point pretending otherwise.

[ADMO]

On the subject of shouting shite at the players, obviously human emotion is a big part of this, the club being in what looks like yet another on the field decline is a part of this, the manager being clueless is a part of this, the board not sacking him is a part of this, the list can go on, not saying its correct but it doesn't help the situation ...

Personally I try stay away from it, unless the player is having an absolute howler E.G scores an OG then gets sent off for a drop kick to the opponents face, I feel idiotic behavior like this merits being called a c**t so to speak ...

Perhaps Its just me, but I also feel like players who show a bit of fight and determination to do well for the club usually get away scotch free and deservedly so, nothing annoys me more than seeing certain players stroll through games without breaking a sweat, knowing they'll get their paycheck at the end of the week !

End of the day shouting abuse at the players/ref/manager/coaches/linesmen happens probably every week, in every football game up and down the country, unless your team is a Real or a Bayern or a Barca who win weekly !

[Yoss]

Perhaps Its just me, but I also feel like players who show a bit of fight and determination to do well for the club usually get away scotch free and deservedly so, nothing annoys me more than seeing certain players stroll through games without breaking a sweat, knowing they'll get their paycheck at the end of the week

See, even if I agreed with that in principle, by and large I find fans - especially the ones who are quickest to jump to such conclusions - are a terrible judge of when someone is or isn't "trying". The "not trying" or "not caring" jibes whenever a team isn't doing too well are one of the worst and laziest reactions. Different players have - legitimately - different styles, different body language, different tactical instructions from managers, different levels of health of fitness. There have certainly been times when players who could quite legitimately have declared themselves unfit have played through it to help the manager out, only to get pelters for not chasing everything down or working like dervishes. (And I rather suspect that may have been true in one or two cases this season.)

[ADMO]

See, even if I agreed with that in principle, by and large I find fans - especially the ones who are quickest to jump to such conclusions - are a terrible judge of when someone is or isn't "trying". The "not trying" or "not caring" jibes whenever a team isn't doing too well are one of the worst and laziest reactions. Different players have - legitimately - different styles, different body language, different tactical instructions from managers, different levels of health of fitness. There have certainly been times when players who could quite legitimately have declared themselves unfit have played through it to help the manager out, only to get pelters for not chasing everything down or working like dervishes. (And I rather suspect that may have been true in one or two cases this season.)

I totally agree tbh, your on point different players have different ways of playing, different rates of fitness, some enjoy runs, some enjoy sitting, some dig in hard, some prefer to play more laid back and yes some even play through injury ...

But for instance at this minute in time Elliot is a prime example for me, to make it clear I definitely don't intend to get on his back from the off every week, and perhaps like people have said he may be injured, but the constant rolling about, diving, looking for cheap fouls, shoulders slumping, huffing and puffing and his body language in general to me says he just can't be assed ! Even more annoying when youngsters like Vaughen are sitting on the bench, or Stewart other weeks ...

Perhaps I'm totally wrong and off and that's just his "style", but if it is I'd rather he sat on the bench !