All things Dundee FC

[Dundee-FC92]

McGowan was hardly a messiah, remembering his disgraceful display at Cove in our most humiliating result of the season as well as a horror show at Ayr away.

Some may think he would make a difference and that's people's opinion but in my eyes he was pretty much finished. Of course the effort would've been there and maybe that's what people want to see.

Thank you.

[Wee jeemie]

14 minutes ago, DieDee said:

Grayson, Tolaj, Clampin, Hannant, Maguire, Kwame with Williamson, Robinson and French. Enough there to make a mark. I can't help but thinking, if Bowyer had insisted, that McGowan could have played a part till the end of this season too instead of one of the crap signings mentioned. Bowyer had to be given time to get the best out of what I would regard as a decent squad for this level. Unfortunately the more time passes the worse we seem to be getting. At this stage I am extremely worried that, given his track record, his next signings will not improve the squad one bit.  

Only French and possibly Robinson have improved the squad , it’s no coincidence the form has dropped dramatically since French got a leg break 

[Liam899]

23 minutes ago, DieDee said:

Grayson, Tolaj, Clampin, Hannant, Maguire, Kwame with Williamson, Robinson and French. Enough there to make a mark. I can't help but thinking, if Bowyer had insisted, that McGowan could have played a part till the end of this season too instead of one of the crap signings mentioned. Bowyer had to be given time to get the best out of what I would regard as a decent squad for this level. Unfortunately the more time passes the worse we seem to be getting. At this stage I am extremely worried that, given his track record, his next signings will not improve the squad one bit.  

I take your point but scrambling about in January for loan signings is going to be miss more often than hit. Unfair to judge him on those signings. What I do judge him on though is his inability to identify a consistent team that can get results in this league. 

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

Do people on here trust Bowyer with the summer re-build? I really don't know, want the guy to succeed but the past few weeks (most of the season) have been brutal and totally infuriating/unacceptable.

Probably, slightly in the 'bin him camp', see what he does with the few games left.

No DAB playoff.

Thank you.

Edited March 20, 2023 by Bigmouth Strikes Again

[johnnydun]

34 minutes ago, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

No DAB playoff.

TBH, I can't see either of us making the Play-off Final.

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

16 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

TBH, I can't see either of us making the Play-off Final.

Here's hoping, couldn't cope with another clusterfuck.

[Boo Khaki]

1 hour ago, Bigmouth Strikes Again said:

Do people on here trust Bowyer with the summer re-build? I really don't know, want the guy to succeed but the past few weeks (most of the season) have been brutal and totally infuriating/unacceptable.

Probably, slightly in the 'bin him camp', see what he does with the few games left.

No DAB playoff.

Thank you.

Only thing I'll say is that last summer and through January he was trying to bring players in against the backdrop of an already bloated squad of McPake's duds soaking up most of the wage budget.

That shouldn't be a problem come June because about 90% of the first team squad are out of contract, so not only can he be very choosy about who exactly he wants back, but the much reduced squad should also afford him more scope to offer slightly improved terms to tempt players here over and above those he could this past season.

I'm not exactly on the Bowyer bandwagon given what has happened since January, but I think if he was fired this summer then that's a bit like firing him for something that James McPake is still in large part responsible for. If he makes a mess of the run to xmas 2023/24, then aye, sack him, and to be honest I think that's what will probably happen anyway, because I can see a scenario where even though performances are better and we are putting up more points per game than we have been this season, we may well still find ourselves adrift of the top place team the way we were when we were behind an all-conquering Hearts team a couple of seasons ago, and at that point I think Nelms and co would pull the plug. There's a good portion of the fanbase who would be baying for Bowyer's blood under those circumstances, even if the team he puts out next season is an obvious, and significant improvement on this lot.

[Crawford]

I know he's not popular amongst the support, but Bowyer deserves the time to build and to be honest, out of any of our managers in the last decade, is the only one I would trust to do so.

He had many a signing rejected and knocked back for cost savings and with most players out of contract soon, we have a real opportunity to see a revival at Dens. 

We also have a real opportunity to see things go to shit very quickly. I'm excited.

[Fifespud]

I’m defo in the get rid camp. 
Nice hasn’t worked, we need some right nasty cunto now. 

[LM_0803]

I liked the fact bowyer was an outside choice last summer, as it was nice to get someone in after the Ross and Maloney saga. Some fans have argued that he's underestimated the league with his signings, french and Robinson (first half of the season) have been good, the others less so, imo. 

 

Not yet fully in the "get rid" group yet, because there's been a few times that his selections and subs have led to poor performances and results. On top of that, playing McGhee in midfield instead of Finlay and Byrne is ridiculous to me, aswell as the signing and initial persistence to play Grayson. Finally, the decision to let McGowan go is still crazy to me. 

Reminds me of the 19/20 season under mcpake, pre COVID. We had a 6 game unbeaten run, similar to the run we had earlier this season during winter, but much of it was difficult to watch. 

Not sure who we would be able to get - or who we would go for, for that matter - if we did part ways with him at the end of the season. I know that's not a good reason to keep him if it's not gone well but we have to be realistic. 

 

I realise that we have an expectation to go straight back up but the majority of the team is poor. We're not likely to spend money on a player, so loans and free agents will be the option come the summer. Maybe a controversial opinion but I'd settle for another season in the championship if we can develop young players in the first team, who are prepared for the premiership the season after. 

[hk blues]

I might be mistaken, but weren't we warned/advised about Bowyer by fans of his other club/clubs?  That he would provide a steady hand but few wins and a lot of draws?  

Maybe I dreamt that though!

[Ludo*1]

Really think that Bowyer is our best manager in a long time - not much evidence of that right enough but he just doesn't come across as blatantly shite like pretty much every other manager since Hartley.

Think he's had his hands tied behind his back and been desperate to lower the budget so he could get his guys in. That's proved to be more difficult than he ever envisioned and he's on record as saying that. I think his one permanent signing in French is a player that'd still get a game for us in the top flight.

Every other signing has been from the bargain basement or loans of young fodder from down South that won't require much.

We've had the likes of McGinn, Byrne, Lawlor etc amongst a lot of others that are all apparently on very, very good money that we've struggled to get off the books.

I think it's impressive that Bowyer has managed to build the best defensive side in the league with utter shite like Cammy Kerr, Lee Ashcroft, Ryan Sweeney & Jordan Marshall making up the backline all the whilst giving game time to a whole host of youth players.

So for me, he probably does deserve a chance next season either way but football doesn't work like that. As soon as it turns poisonous, and it will if we don't go up, then it'll probably be best for a new guy to oversee the overhaul.

Bit shite on Bowyer considering the circumstances, but we can't afford a manager that will now have a considerable amount of baggage with us, rebuilding a whole new squad and then getting off to even a slightly slow start as that'd muck up the whole of the next season.

[Derry Alli]

His biggest redeeming factor in my eyes is he realises this squad is absolutely shite and hasn't been handing out new deals like most previous incumbents. That gets him some of next season for me.

[The Derry]

52 minutes ago, Derry Alli said:

His biggest redeeming factor in my eyes is he realises this squad is absolutely shite and hasn't been handing out new deals like most previous incumbents. That gets him some of next season for me.

Could not agree more, the thought of some of these gimps playing for us next year is giving me the boke.  I'm assuming Bowyer feels the same as me.

[Fifespud]

7 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

 

I think it's impressive that Bowyer has managed to build the best defensive side in the league with utter shite like Cammy Kerr, Lee Ashcroft, Ryan Sweeney & Jordan Marshall making up the backline all the whilst giving game time to a whole host of youth players.

 

I think it's because those 4 are not as shite as they are made out to be. IMO Cammy and Ashcroft are very solid defenders and Sweeney has the odd bombscare in him but is in the main pretty solid too. For a fair chunk of the season Cammy has played at left back, and French etc at right back and that's a pretty solid Championship defence, as the stats bare out. Ashcroft in particular is the no nonsense CH most teams in the Championship are crying out for.

ETA - due to lack of options Bowyer has been forced into a consistent defence selection - if only he'd managed to settle the rest of the areas.

Edited March 21, 2023 by Fifespud

[Shadow Play]

2 hours ago, Fifespud said:

I think it's because those 4 are not as shite as they are made out to be. IMO Cammy and Ashcroft are very solid defenders and Sweeney has the odd bombscare in him but is in the main pretty solid too. For a fair chunk of the season Cammy has played at left back, and French etc at right back and that's a pretty solid Championship defence, as the stats bare out. Ashcroft in particular is the no nonsense CH most teams in the Championship are crying out for.

ETA - due to lack of options Bowyer has been forced into a consistent defence selection - if only he'd managed to settle the rest of the areas.

That’s Bowyer’s 2nd biggest fault IMO.  The constant, very often unnecessary, changing of the team, does not help anyone.  At first I thought it was because he was trying to find his best starting 11 but given we are in March if that is still the case he really isn’t the manager to take us forward.  I‘m more inclined to think he is overthinking things. 

His biggest fault is still believing McGhee is a midfielder! 

[Pens_Dark]

Bowyer has left a lot to be desired this season. That said I think he has to get the chance to build his own squad. We all knew that this squad was full of imposters from seasons before and he has been forced to try and find basement bargains over January. 

We can't just keep chopping and changing managers. Continuity is equally as important sometimes. 

[ScottyDee1893]

I'm not sure if GB will want to be around next season if we don't get promoted. I guess it all depends on how much the board will back him in player recruitment.

FWIW I don't think him heading back down south would be a total disaster. I'd go for Murray at Raith if he does. Still a youngish manager who has done well at clubs with limited budgets. Had a hard time at Hibs but likely down to getting the job too early in his managerial career. He knows the Scottish pool of talent and I'd suggest better than GB does.

There's a few teams in this league who have a player or two that would improve our squad and I'd like to see that approach over the next few years. Get laddies in the 20-25 age bracket who still have hunger and are willing to work their socks off.

[Bigmouth Strikes Again]

2 hours ago, ScottyDee1893 said:

I'm not sure if GB will want to be around next season if we don't get promoted. I guess it all depends on how much the board will back him in player recruitment.

FWIW I don't think him heading back down south would be a total disaster. I'd go for Murray at Raith if he does. Still a youngish manager who has done well at clubs with limited budgets. Had a hard time at Hibs but likely down to getting the job too early in his managerial career. He knows the Scottish pool of talent and I'd suggest better than GB does.

There's a few teams in this league who have a player or two that would improve our squad and I'd like to see that approach over the next few years. Get laddies in the 20-25 age bracket who still have hunger and are willing to work their socks off.

Good shout for Murray, done well at Raith, and they don't have a pot to piss in.

[Ludo*1]

Peterhead have punted David Robertson. Was there not someone on here wanting him to get the Dundee job?

Seems a bit harsh considering the mess they started the season in under McInally. Always a difficult one to turn round.