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15 minutes ago, johnnydun said:

Nah, can't get on board with this Ludo.

Robinson being good at holding the ball up is a myth imo. He only ever makes an attempt to get the ball if it is right at him.

Better than Cummings? 

He plucked the ball out the air on a six pence about ten times today, how can you say his hold up play isn't good? If he's running onto balls put in behind or hunting down defenders that isn't hold up play.

He was excellent today but had absolutely nothing around him. A big part of our inconsistency this season is the isolation of whoever is upfront. Bowyer has to sort it out ASAP. Robinson is good enough to be part of a team that gets promoted out this division.

As for Grayson he played well against Ayr last week and should have been starting today ahead of Williamson.

Thank you.

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44 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

What treatment of Byrne?

He tried to get Byrne off the wage budget but couldn't. Byrne was then injured and after that had been getting a spot on the bench before being part of the group that got ill. 

I'm not particularly worried and if honest, expected this type of season since we still have a McPake 11.

Am I worried about Robinson getting a game ahead of Rudden? No.

Am I worried about Williamson getting a game ahead of Robertson or Anderson? Not really. They're all much of a muchness.

I am worried about Cameron playing well then struggling to get a sniff in the team though and McGowan being dropped like a stone.

Bowyer is definitely a flawed manager. Far too cautious for a team that needs to be going all out but think it's clear he doesn't rate many in the squad at all. With time, I reckon he could build us into a decent outfit. No point getting overly upset when it's still McPake's squad he's got and I think that in itself explains why he feels the need to tinker.

Ludo, you and I both know Byrne should be playing ahead of Grayson, McGhee and Williamson in midfield. The zero minutes on the park is disgraceful. 
 

Williamson isn’t good enough to sacrifice our own young players development coming through for. He’ll disappear off in the summer and we’ve messed our own players about over him. He’s miles behind Gowser as well. 
 

Robinson should 100% be playing before Rudden. What McPake saw in Rudden I’ve yet to see 10 months later. 
 

Also worried he isn’t able to attract players to the club. Numerous times he said over the summer transfer window he expected to get players through the door in the next few days only to fall through time and time again. 
 

Read from fans of clubs he previously managed that he was very negative in the last 10 minutes of games and would always try to hold onto what they had whether it was a point or 3. Today’s starting 11 takes that negativity to a whole new level. 
 

Shoogily peg time. 

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Just now, Yenitit said:

Ludo, you and I both know Byrne should be playing ahead of Grayson, McGhee and Williamson in midfield. The zero minutes on the park is disgraceful. 
 

Williamson isn’t good enough to sacrifice our own young players development coming through. He’ll disappear off in the summer and we’ve messed our own players about over him. He’s miles behind Gowser as well. 
 

Robinson should 100% be playing before Rudden. What McPake saw in Rudden I’ve yet to see 10 months later. 
 

Also worried he isn’t able to attract players to the club. Numerous times he said over the summer transfer window he expected to get players through the door in the next few days only to fall through time and time again. 
 

Read from fans of clubs he previously managed that he was very negative in the last 10 minutes of games and would always try to hold onto what they had whether it was a point or 3. Today’s starting 11 takes that negativity to a whole new level. 
 

Shoogily peg time. 

Agree with all of that except the last line. Nowhere near that stage for me. Needs to be given a chance to build his own squad.

Do think it's typical Nelms though. Finally make an appointment that's outside the box but also has a decent enough pedigree. Bring in a manager from down South that probably has less experience of our leagues than the precious duds we've appointed and then give him absolutely f**k all to work with after basically chucking money at complete non-entities in the managerial world.

It's typical Dundee really.

With a bit of time and a bit of money, I still reckon Bowyer has 'it' for us. I just don't think he'll get either and he'll go down as the latest dud when it's a case of what could have been IMO.

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1 hour ago, johnnydun said:

There was a few incidents in The Derry today too. Didn't even realise Mulligan had been sent off, the stewards got a right mouthful after trying to throw out a wee boy and his mother for no reason at all, needless to say, they didn't get thrown out.

There’s a boy in the Bobby Cox who constantly berates the players all game (unless we’re winning then he’s clamped) but his shouts generally involve calling the players poofs. He should be punted out the ground imo but the stewards always turn blind eye to it. Today someone clearly had enough of him and started on him and it escalated to them trying to climb over rows of seats and being held back, but basically just saying they were going to smash each other. Stewards ran away as this happened. The homophobe also ran away on the 80th min so clearly shat it. I’m no happy clapper but I have no idea why him and others even bother showing up for games when they are seething messes from kick off. An old boy today was going apeshit before the game even started when bowyer came out to applaud the crowd, Boy was screaming at him for not being in the dressing room telling the players what to do. It was 14:57 man, if the players don’t know what they’re doing by that time then things are worse than I thought.

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15 minutes ago, K.T said:

There’s a boy in the Bobby Cox who constantly berates the players all game (unless we’re winning then he’s clamped) but his shouts generally involve calling the players poofs. He should be punted out the ground imo but the stewards always turn blind eye to it. Today someone clearly had enough of him and started on him and it escalated to them trying to climb over rows of seats and being held back, but basically just saying they were going to smash each other. Stewards ran away as this happened. The homophobe also ran away on the 80th min so clearly shat it. I’m no happy clapper but I have no idea why him and others even bother showing up for games when they are seething messes from kick off. An old boy today was going apeshit before the game even started when bowyer came out to applaud the crowd, Boy was screaming at him for not being in the dressing room telling the players what to do. It was 14:57 man, if the players don’t know what they’re doing by that time then things are worse than I thought.

some of our fans are really special....boys booing like f**k when lawlor didnt hoof the ball long when down to 10 men and no fucker up front while morton player blocked him from kicking it quickly anyway. 

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16 minutes ago, Meeniedee said:

some of our fans are really special....boys booing like f**k when lawlor didnt hoof the ball long when down to 10 men and no fucker up front while morton player blocked him from kicking it quickly anyway. 

That’s not the time it was 2 on 2 and the ball should’ve been played in behind the Morton right back for McMullan to have a foot race against him was it? Boiled my piss at the game he never did that early and the kick out the time before. 

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He plucked the ball out the air on a six pence about ten times today, how can you say his hold up play isn't good? If he's running onto balls put in behind or hunting down defenders that isn't hold up play.
He was excellent today but had absolutely nothing around him. A big part of our inconsistency this season is the isolation of whoever is upfront. Bowyer has to sort it out ASAP. Robinson is good enough to be part of a team that gets promoted out this division.
As for Grayson he played well against Ayr last week and should have been starting today ahead of Williamson.
Thank you.

I wasn’t convinced with Robinson over the first couple of games but he’s grown on me and today he was excellent. Managing to take the ball and generally lay it off to somebody whilst getting bodied by some weegie brute, very impressive.

Although he’s been hot and cold I’d pick Grayson over Byrne (any debate about Williamson is null and void). Some folk seem to be forgetting how many utterly shite games Byrne has had for us.

The game today was crying out for a spark of something, how on earth Cameron didn’t get on is a total mystery.

As I said on the match thread it was obvious Mulligan’s frustration could easily end with him getting a red, poor man management by Bowyer there.

I’m putting today’s insipid performance down to illness and injury.

On a positive note Lawlor didn’t look quite as pish as the last time we saw him.
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1 hour ago, Dundee-FC92 said:

He plucked the ball out the air on a six pence about ten times today, how can you say his hold up play isn't good? If he's running onto balls put in behind or hunting down defenders that isn't hold up play.

He was excellent today but had absolutely nothing around him. A big part of our inconsistency this season is the isolation of whoever is upfront. Bowyer has to sort it out ASAP. Robinson is good enough to be part of a team that gets promoted out this division.

As for Grayson he played well against Ayr last week and should have been starting today ahead of Williamson.

Thank you.

I'm not saying he's a bad player, he's OK, I just don't see what he offers as a striker. I can only remember him taking the ball down from height on a sixpence once. I think his hold up play is average and this part of him is  overrated. Just different opinions though. 

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Our fans have let the side down a few times this season. Booing Robinson going off was embarrassing. 

Shouting 'Bowyer out!' when he applauded the fans at the end today was a minter.

Scrapping in the stands at Arbroath was a low moment.

Fans arguing with Legzdins, McMullan and Robinson all in separate incidents was another shite laugh from our fans.

I know we've a reputation to keep up but f**k sake.

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1 hour ago, K.T said:

There’s a boy in the Bobby Cox who constantly berates the players all game (unless we’re winning then he’s clamped) but his shouts generally involve calling the players poofs. He should be punted out the ground imo but the stewards always turn blind eye to it. Today someone clearly had enough of him and started on him and it escalated to them trying to climb over rows of seats and being held back, but basically just saying they were going to smash each other. Stewards ran away as this happened. The homophobe also ran away on the 80th min so clearly shat it. I’m no happy clapper but I have no idea why him and others even bother showing up for games when they are seething messes from kick off. An old boy today was going apeshit before the game even started when bowyer came out to applaud the crowd, Boy was screaming at him for not being in the dressing room telling the players what to do. It was 14:57 man, if the players don’t know what they’re doing by that time then things are worse than I thought.

It's mental that people are still like that and turning up every week just to get it out. I've met a good few fans that have said this is the type of stuff that's stopped them coming. Personally I suspect it's more the consistent disappointment on the pitch but it's still shite behaviour that needs punted.

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Another thing is whenever the subject of the fans behaviour is brought up you get people saying your a happy clapper who'll accept anything. As if there's no in between of voicing your disapproval and being a negative dick about everyone from getting to the stadium to leaving. It's why I tend to avoid the Facebook pages and single team forums. Thankfully I've not seen it on here much recently. 

Anyway it was my first game in a while and I was happy lawlor wasn't as bad as I feared. He did have one bomb scare moment but got away with it. Was mulligans second yellow a foul? I didn't think so at the time and ref had lost it by that point. I don't think we'd have scored with him on the pitch for the rest of the game anyway.

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May as well be honest and type what I'm thinking, Gary Bowyer is not the solution and never will be, imho.

The 'successful' signings are mid Championship at best, however Joe Grayson and the currant bun, wtf is that all about. Gentle reminder to all, we are DUNDEE FOOTBALL CLUB unless we or John Nelms' have both forgotten.

With the extremely restricted limitations at our disposal, why ostracise McGinn and Byrne when much to my and our dismay, they're still considerably better than most alternatives available in our midfield collective.

Therefore, I also get the strong opinions out there he has not been allowed to sign his own targets, however I'm far from convinced due to his background managerial record he can be trusted with our precious finances.    

I am Dark Blue to the very core; however, this is an absolute ongoing shite state of affairs, that is all. 

Regards as always.

  

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Whilst I’m not convinced about Bowyer I disagree regarding McGinn and Byrne. Yesterday’s men. Byrne has been an overwhelming disappointment in his time with us and we should never have signed McGinn, he’s finished.

Just my opinion of course.

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English style of football is all about physicality which isn't the case in Scottish football. It's all about being big, strong and fast. Footballing ability is secondary to that.

You see that during pre season whenever we play an English team and we look like dwarves in comparison.

It's no surprise to see the likes of Byrne, McGinn (although he's not helped himself IMO) and McGowan being marginalised and Cameron not get the same opportunities that Mulligan has had despite being more deserving based on performances.

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50 minutes ago, This Charming Man said:

May as well be honest and type what I'm thinking, Gary Bowyer is not the solution and never will be, imho.

The 'successful' signings are mid Championship at best, however Joe Grayson and the currant bun, wtf is that all about. Gentle reminder to all, we are DUNDEE FOOTBALL CLUB unless we or John Nelms' have both forgotten.

With the extremely restricted limitations at our disposal, why ostracise McGinn and Byrne when much to my and our dismay, they're still considerably better than most alternatives available in our midfield collective.

Therefore, I also get the strong opinions out there he has not been allowed to sign his own targets, however I'm far from convinced due to his background managerial record he can be trusted with our precious finances.    

I am Dark Blue to the very core; however, this is an absolute ongoing shite state of affairs, that is all. 

Regards as always.

  

Greenie for the use of ostracise. Word of the day

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20 minutes ago, Ludo*1 said:

English style of football is all about physicality which isn't the case in Scottish football. It's all about being big, strong and fast. Footballing ability is secondary to that.

You see that during pre season whenever we play an English team and we look like dwarves in comparison.

It's no surprise to see the likes of Byrne, McGinn (although he's not helped himself IMO) and McGowan being marginalised and Cameron not get the same opportunities that Mulligan has had despite being more deserving based on performances.

Is physicality and being big and strong not the same thing? When we played Blackpool pre season a few years ago I was amazed at how big they all were and it was their first pre season game so they weren't up to speed but if they were we would have got hammered from them. If Bowyer wants everyone to be big and strong I'm all for it but it will take time for him to get it right and I personally think he wll

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Don't get me wrong guys, five or six seasons ago no one would wish a permanently ineffectual  Byrne or a bone idle thick headed and skinned McGinn anywhere near our club, let alone the first eleven. However these are desperate times following James McPake's bloated tenure and alternatives are at a premium.

This is truly a Mickey Mouse standard of league this season and we have a 50% points return at this time. Wtf.

I shit you not, if we collated most of the thoughts and opinions on this very thread we would be top of this Donald Duck league with room to spare.

What on earth criteria is John Nelms being measured against when he has an annual appraisal?

We have already been blown out of the water by Jim McIntyre, are we really waiting on James McPake doing likewise next season?

Seriously concerned regards.

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67 points won the league last season. I'd argue the league is even poorer than last season.

As demoralising as it is, as long as we are in the pack we are in no worry territory. 

It's gonna be a shite team that wins the league this season, we just have to believe it'll be us.

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3 hours ago, Ludo*1 said:

Agree with all of that except the last line. Nowhere near that stage for me. Needs to be given a chance to build his own squad.

Do think it's typical Nelms though. Finally make an appointment that's outside the box but also has a decent enough pedigree. Bring in a manager from down South that probably has less experience of our leagues than the precious duds we've appointed and then give him absolutely f**k all to work with after basically chucking money at complete non-entities in the managerial world.

It's typical Dundee really.

With a bit of time and a bit of money, I still reckon Bowyer has 'it' for us. I just don't think he'll get either and he'll go down as the latest dud when it's a case of what could have been IMO.

Against what comparable squad in this division has your manager been given "absolutely f**k all to work with"? And what was your superstar manager doing over the summer to ship out all these obvious duds?

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