1320Lichtie Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 11 minutes ago, philpy said: I noticed there's a few arbroath players signed contract extensions, what will happen with the part time players that have done so if they get promoted, as I'd imagine they'll go full time?? I was talking to mikey mckenna's old man on Friday, mikey won't be going full time if they go up. He's 31 with a great full time electrical business, so part time suits him better. I don’t think we will get promoted but.... if we did we’d stay part time or go hybrid I would guess. Maybe have a group of FT guys. I really don’t know.. But guys like McKenna etc would stay exactly as they are right now that’s a guarantee 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan3600 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 I noticed there's a few arbroath players signed contract extensions, what will happen with the part time players that have done so if they get promoted, as I'd imagine they'll go full time?? I was talking to mikey mckenna's old man on Friday, mikey won't be going full time if they go up. He's 31 with a great full time electrical business, so part time suits him better.He’s one of many in that situation. We won’t go full time in the unlikely event that we go up. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtie23 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Shocking negativity 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 34 minutes ago, philpy said: I noticed there's a few arbroath players signed contract extensions, what will happen with the part time players that have done so if they get promoted, as I'd imagine they'll go full time?? I was talking to mikey mckenna's old man on Friday, mikey won't be going full time if they go up. He's 31 with a great full time electrical business, so part time suits him better. even if we get promoted, we won't be going full-time 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan3600 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Shocking negativity Unlikely = less than 50% chance. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
afc_36_0 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 IF we went up this group of players 100% deserve the chance to play in the prem. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tattie36 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 There’s no way we could stay fully part-time if we went up, unless of course we were happy to come right back down again without much of a fight. If we want to go up and stay up for a bit then I would suspect we would have to go with a hybrid setup. A mix of part-time and full-time players, it’s been done before and would give us the best of both worlds - access to the best part-time players in the country combined with a mix of young and experienced full-timers. We would also need to increase the squad size and possibly re-establish a youth setup. To think we could go up and realistically compete while staying fully part-time is fantasy imo. I’m not sure if I think this is a great idea but there would be no real reason why we couldn’t even go totally full-time eventually. The massive financial increase - level of investment, sponsorship, increased gates, TV money, SPFL money etc etc would probably make it feasible. If Hamilton, Livingston, Ross County etc can do it then why couldn’t we? Obviously we would lose a large chunk of the current squad if this happened and I don’t think it ever will. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stan3600 Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 There’s no way we could stay fully part-time if we went up, unless of course we were happy to come right back down again without much of a fight. If we want to go up and stay up for a bit then I would suspect we would have to go with a hybrid setup. A mix of part-time and full-time players, it’s been done before and would give us the best of both worlds - access to the best part-time players in the country combined with a mix of young and experienced full-timers. We would also need to increase the squad size and possibly re-establish a youth setup. To think we could go up and realistically compete while staying fully part-time is fantasy imo. I’m not sure if I think this is a great idea but there would be no real reason why we couldn’t even go totally full-time eventually. The massive financial increase - level of investment, sponsorship, increased gates, TV money, SPFL money etc etc would probably make it feasible. If Hamilton, Livingston, Ross County etc can do it then why couldn’t we? Obviously we would lose a large chunk of the current squad if this happened and I don’t think it ever will.I’m glad it’s not my decision. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonLichtie Posted January 23, 2022 Share Posted January 23, 2022 Being the biggest/ best part time team in the country >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being one of the shittest/ smallest full time clubs in the country. The positives of being/ accepting our aim is being the former far outweighs the latter, regardless of the division we're competing in. There's many reasons I believe the above, but ultimately the costs of running a full time setup, for it to be better than what we currently have, is about so much more than just employing some full time football players. To have a proper full time setup in that regard would require millions of pounds of investment in facilities to be used on a daily basis/ for the club to be based out of and tens of thousands of pounds every month going out in fixed costs regardless of what happened in the future (i.e. we get relegated/ go back to our 3 digit home crowds). Obviously I don't think anyone is saying we should do the above, but to do less than that and become full time would be a sideways step, at best. We would then 'boost' ourselves to a Morton/ QotS/ Hamilton level of full time club...... Regardless of what division we're in, doing that wouldn't be in the clubs best interests in the short, medium or long term. What is in the clubs interests in the short, medium and long term, which can be hugely boosted by our stay in the Championship or a wild promotion to the Premiership, is using the additional income and increase in interest to boost ourselves to a level where we are the part time club in Scotland over a long period of time. The best full time players aim to play for the best full time club they can, our aim should be for the best part time players aim to be to play for the best part time club..... us. Regardless of the above, take two different random low level Premiership football teams: Diddy A - Home crowds of 1500ish, a full time club who lose their better players after a year maximum to a bigger club/ better wages. Struggle to make the books balance year after year and if relegated, there will be large cuts in every budget/ area of spending with no other choice due to dependence on Premiership cashflow Glorious Maroon Machine - Home crowds of 1500ish, a part time club who have kept the core of their team together for a number of years, with all of them being at the highest level they can play due to other interests (work, education/ own business etc.) Easily balancing the books due to significently less outgoings compared to competitors around them and able to easily scale the budgets due to this. Diddy A is competing for players with 3/4 other full time clubs around them, inflating the wages of all clubs. The Maroon Machine are picking up the best available part time players in the country, who are more than equal to the full time players around them, and competing with other part time clubs wage wise on that basis - £500 is a very good part time wage for a footballer in this country; £1000ish being a bottom end Premiership full time wage. There's more ambition in becoming the best part time team, by a distance, and over a long period of time, than there is in us becoming a full time football team just waiting for one or two bad seasons on the pitch and suddenly we're in the complete and utter shit. I firmly believe if you got a squad of the best 22 part time players in this country, who had the attitude and complemented each other, that squad wouldn't be relegated from the Premership. I also believe you'd be on a much smaller budget than the teams around you, allowing for plenty leeway and additional spending on the community/ off the pitch side of things, continued marketing and all round building of the football club. One full time employee on the community side is worth more to us in the short, medium and long term than a full time football player. That's one employee where one didn't previously exist, as opposed to one full time football player replacing a part time one, with no guarantee whatsoever that he'll be any improvement. There isn't one good argument for Arbroath to be a full time football club in my opinion 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DUAFC Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 Wow - people have been awarded PhDs for less work..... Let's see where we end up first. If Killie don't win the league I'll be astonished, no pressure !! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 I don’t like discussing it because I don’t think it’s a problem we’d ever have but for full time in the Prem on a hybrid system you’d literally need a full time coach to do 2 training sessions during the day and to book a place to train for 2 hours a day 2 days a week and then have the FT players n coach to turn up to our night sessions and the rest of the club could just run as normal 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtie23 Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 2 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said: I don’t like discussing it because I don’t think it’s a problem we’d ever have but for full time in the Prem on a hybrid system you’d literally need a full time coach to do 2 training sessions during the day and to book a place to train for 2 hours a day 2 days a week and then have the FT players n coach to turn up to our night sessions and the rest of the club could just run as normal I’m pretty sure Raith went hybrid a few years back. Don’t think it worked out for them 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 45 minutes ago, SimonLichtie said: Being the biggest/ best part time team in the country >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being one of the shittest/ smallest full time clubs in the country. The positives of being/ accepting our aim is being the former far outweighs the latter, regardless of the division we're competing in. There's many reasons I believe the above, but ultimately the costs of running a full time setup, for it to be better than what we currently have, is about so much more than just employing some full time football players. To have a proper full time setup in that regard would require millions of pounds of investment in facilities to be used on a daily basis/ for the club to be based out of and tens of thousands of pounds every month going out in fixed costs regardless of what happened in the future (i.e. we get relegated/ go back to our 3 digit home crowds). Obviously I don't think anyone is saying we should do the above, but to do less than that and become full time would be a sideways step, at best. We would then 'boost' ourselves to a Morton/ QotS/ Hamilton level of full time club...... Regardless of what division we're in, doing that wouldn't be in the clubs best interests in the short, medium or long term. What is in the clubs interests in the short, medium and long term, which can be hugely boosted by our stay in the Championship or a wild promotion to the Premiership, is using the additional income and increase in interest to boost ourselves to a level where we are the part time club in Scotland over a long period of time. The best full time players aim to play for the best full time club they can, our aim should be for the best part time players aim to be to play for the best part time club..... us. Regardless of the above, take two different random low level Premiership football teams: Diddy A - Home crowds of 1500ish, a full time club who lose their better players after a year maximum to a bigger club/ better wages. Struggle to make the books balance year after year and if relegated, there will be large cuts in every budget/ area of spending with no other choice due to dependence on Premiership cashflow Glorious Maroon Machine - Home crowds of 1500ish, a part time club who have kept the core of their team together for a number of years, with all of them being at the highest level they can play due to other interests (work, education/ own business etc.) Easily balancing the books due to significently less outgoings compared to competitors around them and able to easily scale the budgets due to this. Diddy A is competing for players with 3/4 other full time clubs around them, inflating the wages of all clubs. The Maroon Machine are picking up the best available part time players in the country, who are more than equal to the full time players around them, and competing with other part time clubs wage wise on that basis - £500 is a very good part time wage for a footballer in this country; £1000ish being a bottom end Premiership full time wage. There's more ambition in becoming the best part time team, by a distance, and over a long period of time, than there is in us becoming a full time football team just waiting for one or two bad seasons on the pitch and suddenly we're in the complete and utter shit. I firmly believe if you got a squad of the best 22 part time players in this country, who had the attitude and complemented each other, that squad wouldn't be relegated from the Premership. I also believe you'd be on a much smaller budget than the teams around you, allowing for plenty leeway and additional spending on the community/ off the pitch side of things, continued marketing and all round building of the football club. One full time employee on the community side is worth more to us in the short, medium and long term than a full time football player. That's one employee where one didn't previously exist, as opposed to one full time football player replacing a part time one, with no guarantee whatsoever that he'll be any improvement. There isn't one good argument for Arbroath to be a full time football club in my opinion Well said Simon If (and that's a big if) we go up, the current squad should be given their chance 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 It wouldn’t be ideal but if the unthinkable somehow happened and this next 3 month go ridiculously well I think you’d have to consider it. We wouldn’t even be able to get loans from clubs other than Celtic and Rangers really. You’d probably need to sign a wee group of FT guys and see how we got on. We’re gonna be keeping all our best PT players anyway so the worst that would happen is relegation back to this league but we’d be expecting that anyway. Either way the longer we are staying up in this league or potentially the prem (can’t believe I’m even saying that) we are building for the long term. Bottom of the Prem even gets something like 1.2 million pound in prize money. Never mind the ridiculous crowds we’d be getting every week. We’d average about 3/4 thousand. Dundee/United/Aberdeen/Hibs/Hearts/Rangers/Celtic would all be selling 2-3.3k away tickets. Sure we will come back to reality with a bang soon but it’s good to dream. Kind of like thinking about what you’d do if you won the lottery 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 Just now, lichtgilphead said: Well said Simon If (and that's a big if) we go up, the current squad should be given their chance Of course???? Not one person would disagree on that, that’s not really the discussion happening here 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtgilphead Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 3 minutes ago, 1320Lichtie said: Of course???? Not one person would disagree on that, that’s not really the discussion happening here Yeah. Right. 3 hours ago, Tattie36 said: Obviously we would lose a large chunk of the current squad if this happened and I don’t think it ever will. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tattie36 Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 3 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said: Yeah. Right. If you read my post again you will see that I said we would (obviously) lose a large chunk of our squad if we went full-time not that I could ever see that happening, or indeed don’t think I would want to see it happening. I didn’t say we would lose them if we got promoted as I think we would go hybrid. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1320Lichtie Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 10 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said: Yeah. Right. Yeah but he was not saying we should do that Best just waiting to see what goes on, the next 2 league games could be huge. I’m just thinking about Saturday... if we win. 11 points ahead of Partick Thistle. Kilmarnock play Inverness, if that was a draw and we were to win... be 5 ahead of ICT and 6 ahead of Killie with Killie at home the week after. Imagine going into that Killie game knowing a win could take you 9 clear of them with 12 to play. Crazy 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clashcityrocker Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 We already have full time players at the club and have done for a few years - the loan players we have train with the club they are signed to during the week and get two days off per week to train in the evening with Arbroath ( correct me if I am wrong on that ) ? Arbroath are the best in form team in the league and are serious contenders to win the league - I have not seen any team in the league play better than Arbroath - so promotion is very much a possibility. Regarding the part time Vs full time debate, I don't know the financial costs of running a football club ( either full time or part time) - so would be out of my depth to comment, but I had assumed if the club win promotion they would remain part time, but have a bigger squad of players ( but best leave these matters to the people running the club). One thing is for sure, the players are winners, they don't like losing and will want to finish as high up the league table as possible - they are enjoying sitting top of the league and will be determined to remain there. Dick Campbell and the management team will be looking to make history - with 13 league games to go it's all to play for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AFC360PUNK1320 Posted January 24, 2022 Share Posted January 24, 2022 IF we did go up there is no way we would even think of going full time, anybody who was at the last Q&A with Pink and the AFC Board would tell you that as the question was asked. As has been previously said IF we did go up the present squad deserve the chance to compete in the SPL. Let us all just enjoy the ride and let's see where it takes us. C'Mon the Red Lichties, 36-0. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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