Casual Bystander Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 ...that their vote will, in some small way, go to the removal of the UK (and by implication Scotland) from the EU? Clearly there are a lot of anti-European No voters anyway, so I'm guessing that those people will be happy and nothing further needs to be said, but to those who wish to stay in the UK and stay in the EU do you realise that is effectively a mutually exclusive stance? The cabinet reshuffle only went to underline the way in which the Westminster Conservative government is heading. UKIP has scared them into action and already you are seeing the support for UKIP declining and returning to the Tories. Labour are not winning the next election. The gap between them and the Tories was already small and it's shrinking, all this while the government has presided over some of the most hated cuts and "austerity" measures this country has seen since the war, or perhaps the depression before that. The Liberals have been cast into political purgatory and will remain there for a generation, while UKIP are being undone by having to be seen as a mainstream rather than a protest vote. The tories have promised a referendum on staying in Europe when they win the next election. Scotland is in general pro-European, England in general is not. We all know who would be the winner in that battle. You mat argue that a Yes vote reduces the chances of EU participation, well a No vote ensures that Scotland will not be part of it. It's a fait accomplis; vote No and you are guaranteeing a European exit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proposed_referendum_on_United_Kingdom_membership_of_the_European_Union#Opinion_polling The opinion polling shows plural support for remaining in the EU. In saying that I'd prefer an independent Scotland in Europe than a United Union outside of Europe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casual Bystander Posted July 15, 2014 Author Share Posted July 15, 2014 It's far too early to know whether support is heading back to the Tories from UKIP. How could you possibly know this. Cameron only made the changes today. Guardian/ICM poll has UKIP losing ground from their EU election results. Vox pop reactions to the cabinet reshuffle has backed this up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 The Conservatives want to renegotiate Britain's relationship - they don't want to leave. At any rate, a Conservative majority will be required before talk of a referendum can even look like a glimmer of reality. Hopefully we'll all be spared the UKIP scaremongering too, as they'll be lucky to pick up a single seat. Interesting that support for the EU on renegotiated terms beats leaving 2:1 - seems many Brits want reform rather than leaving. To answer the original question - yes, I'd be happy.I can't see it ever happening, but I would like Britain to leave the EU and join EFTA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 The Tories are actually now 1 point ahead in the poll. No way will the poll even come up to leave the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highlandmagyar Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 If it means that OP bawling like a wean when the referendum goes against him it will be worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casual Bystander Posted July 15, 2014 Author Share Posted July 15, 2014 The Tories are actually now 1 point ahead in the poll. No way will the poll even come up to leave the EU. A referendum has been promised by the Tories if they win the next election, and they will. The Conservatives want to renegotiate Britain's relationship - they don't want to leave. At any rate, a Conservative majority will be required before talk of a referendum can even look like a glimmer of reality. The Conservatives are going to win, and it's clear that the fear mongering that went on up to the EU elections will also happen before a EU referendum. As I say, a fait accomplis. If it means that OP bawling like a wean when the referendum goes against him it will be worth it. I am rather touched that you base your entire political ideology around my feelings, but don't you think that you should consider something a little more holistic than your petty anguish on an anonymous forum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 We can go on and on about broken promises from politicians. Add that to previously broken 'cast iron' promises from Cameron and I'm not quite buying it. What scaremongering during the EU election will happen again? I don't recall much scaremongering occurring during the campaign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bastion Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 Guardian/ICM poll has UKIP losing ground from their EU election results. Vox pop reactions to the cabinet reshuffle has backed this up. Your signature is the most ridiculous thing I have read in a while....... talk me through that thought process? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 The Tories are actually now 1 point ahead in the poll. No way will the poll even come up to leave the EU. With a set of polling figures that still translate into a Labour majority government. They have to lose by more than 4 points and be below 32% in the final result just to not be the biggest party. Only 1 pollster, ICM, have them not winning the popular vote and none of them have the Tories above 34% (they almost certainly need more than 38% just to be the largest party this time out). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Al666 Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 ...that their vote will, in some small way, go to the removal of the UK (and by implication Scotland) from the EU? Clearly there are a lot of anti-European No voters anyway, so I'm guessing that those people will be happy and nothing further needs to be said, but to those who wish to stay in the UK and stay in the EU do you realise that is effectively a mutually exclusive stance? The cabinet reshuffle only went to underline the way in which the Westminster Conservative government is heading. UKIP has scared them into action and already you are seeing the support for UKIP declining and returning to the Tories. Labour are not winning the next election. The gap between them and the Tories was already small and it's shrinking, all this while the government has presided over some of the most hated cuts and "austerity" measures this country has seen since the war, or perhaps the depression before that. The Liberals have been cast into political purgatory and will remain there for a generation, while UKIP are being undone by having to be seen as a mainstream rather than a protest vote. The tories have promised a referendum on staying in Europe when they win the next election. Scotland is in general pro-European, England in general is not. We all know who would be the winner in that battle. You mat argue that a Yes vote reduces the chances of EU participation, well a No vote ensures that Scotland will not be part of it. It's a fait accomplis; vote No and you are guaranteeing a European exit. Rubbish, 1. Only if they win the next election by an overall majority. 2. Only if they keep the promise to hold a vote on Europe. 3. Only if the majority vote to leave. However a yes is the one that actually ensures that Scotland will not be a member of the EU. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted July 15, 2014 Share Posted July 15, 2014 However a yes is the one that actually ensures that Scotland will not be a member of the EU. Source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Double Jack D Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Rubbish, 1. Only if they win the next election by an overall majority. 2. Only if they keep the promise to hold a vote on Europe. 3. Only if the majority vote to leave. However a yes is the one that actually ensures that Scotland will not be a member of the EU. Good headline to your post! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRob72 Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Source. Not at least until 2019 it seems! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/10968820/Juncker-deals-blow-to-Alex-Salmonds-EU-claims.html Salmond's claim that we will be 'fast-tracked' into the EU after a Yes vote is another seperatist plan drawn up on the back of a fag packet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 Not at least until 2019 it seems! http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/scotland/10968820/Juncker-deals-blow-to-Alex-Salmonds-EU-claims.html Salmond's claim that we will be 'fast-tracked' into the EU after a Yes vote is another seperatist plan drawn up on the back of a fag packet. Er awkward... The President of the EU issued a clarification last night saying that Scotland was a totally separate issue - and that he was talking about non-EU members not getting membership in the next 5 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casual Bystander Posted July 16, 2014 Author Share Posted July 16, 2014 Rubbish, 1. Only if they win the next election by an overall majority. 2. Only if they keep the promise to hold a vote on Europe. 3. Only if the majority vote to leave. However a yes is the one that actually ensures that Scotland will not be a member of the EU. There is only one response that is suitable to that myopic and frankly erroneous summary. "Rubbish". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Bastion Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 There is only one response that is suitable to that myopic and frankly erroneous summary. "Rubbish". Your signature? Care to explain it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 I'll explain it. He's a troll. I wonder if it IS Supras. Definitely has the traits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 More fluent though. Still planning to deport all "No" voters chum? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ira Gaines Posted July 16, 2014 Share Posted July 16, 2014 More fluent though. Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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