MJ - The story so far!

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

I haven't been keeping up with this thread because it's been a clusterfuck from start to finish, so I've just come across this.

It's totally unfair of you to say that I've been "unequivocal in my condemnation" of MJ. I don't like him and have condemned him on many occasions, but I have always done so with justification and have also been more than happy to stick up for the guy when I think folk have levelled unfair or inaccurate accusations at him.

Your post was the first that I've heard of this plan to have me "independently verify" these results. Nobody from the Trust has contacted me about it and I honestly didn't even know there was a survey planned.

I promised myself I'd avoid this thread from now on, but here's a link to where they stated that was their plan.

http://killiefc.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=78743&page=2

[craigkillie]

Haven't been on there since the start of November so I hadn't seen that.

No further comment on your attack on my credibility though? If they did ask me to do it and I helped them out, do you believe that I would doctor the results? My career is in statistics and I'm hardly going to jeopardise my professional integrity for the sake of some survey which is more than likely going to have a pretty clear and predictable outcome anyway.

[padster]

The chairman recently stated that no such proposal had even been made via the Kilmarnock Standard. So are you now saying the Chairman has lied?

Ahem, he has lied through his teeth numerous time's. E.g it was the kilmarnock fan's that gave their season tickets to rangers fans for there title party, to name an own goal. Keep the trolling

[Paper Rose]

The inference that I am Marie Osmond is tedious, she appeared once at the club. I very much doubt she would register on a Scottish football internet forum to voice her opinion.

they was on to me man, but I've crossed the river and thrown them off the scent.

Originally posted by baz

"SDS who are running it go on holiday on Friday so we'll take a look at what we have up to that point, but keep it running over the festive period until they come back and we'll close it off then. Our plan is to ask Craig who does the SPLstats stuff to analyse the results as he is not on the Trust Board and can view it independently."

this is still the festive period, but they probably should have asked Craig earlier before the usual troublemakers stirred it up.

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

Haven't been on there since the start of November so I hadn't seen that.

No further comment on your attack on my credibility though? If they did ask me to do it and I helped them out, do you believe that I would doctor the results? My career is in statistics and I'm hardly going to jeopardise my professional integrity for the sake of some survey which is more than likely going to have a pretty clear and predictable outcome anyway.

The predictable others had been completely ignoring my point, thus why I ignored their protestations until now. Call me a cynic, but when an institution publishes its own results, I'm normally quite skeptical. I personally have no reason to doubt whether you would doctor the results or not, but my point was merely that others could look at it and become instantly wary. I know you're no part of the Trust per se, but you do share similar ideals to them.

You're clearly not one of them, but there are people in your profession that 'doctor' results in return for financial reward. How many times have you seen a study carried out, that just happens to have been sponsored by the company the poll favours?

An even bigger bugbear for me though was that the poll was only carried out online, yet will be presented as being a fair representation of the Killie support. It can't have been that well advertised either, if one of our biggest online presences was unaware of the polls very existence.

[Paper Rose]

the poll isn't going to need much doctoring anyway so christ knows why QLP is in such a tizzy about it.

it will be well above the 90% already with only qwerty, Mclean and whatever TWC and QLP's names are on there supporting MJ, if that ain't they two already.

[Nutz_the_Squirrel]

However, it turns out that...... the plan of the trust is to have the results "independently verified" - by 'craigkillie'. The same person that has been unequivocal in his condemnation of MJ online and in print. Not only that, but the survey itself is heavily weighted to garner the response that the creators were looking for.

QLP never said that craigkillie would manipulate the responses. It's a classic QLP move however to point out that he could manipulate them and would have a motive for doing so because he has spoken out on the subject on which data is being collected. As with most of his posts, it achieves nothing but looks a wee bit controversial. It's as good as saying craigkillie will distort the outcome of the poll without actually saying it. Shitebaggery in the extreme.

You're clearly not one of them, but there are people in your profession that 'doctor' results in return for financial reward.......

[Squirrelhumper]

This thread was never going to be pretty but I didn't expect it to make my eyes bleed.

Ditto.

[TheWeekThatWas]

The chairman recently stated that no such proposal had even been made via the Kilmarnock Standard. So are you now saying the Chairman has lied?

Ahem, he has lied through his teeth numerous time's. E.g it was the kilmarnock fan's that gave their season tickets to rangers fans for there title party, to name an own goal. Keep the trolling

I think you should re-read the post and the one it was in response to, to see the context in which that comment was posted. There was no attempt at trolling.

With regards to the chairman's conduct, I think his track record is there for all to see. I am not on any "side" therefore I have no interest in trolling or bias.

I think the best chance the club has of surviving is through external investment, the club attracting more fans back, or a combination of both.

I only care about the football club, individuals, chairmen etc come and go.

[Paper Rose]

It is safe to say now that the club's proposal for the debt to be written off has been rejected by the bank.

in an attempt to try to clear things up a wee bit.

why would you think it is "safe to say" when no-one, or at least none of the plebs have heard anything, and would this outcome please you or displease you?

if it displeases you I would argue you couldn't really be accused of trolling.

[TheWeekThatWas]

in an attempt to try to clear things up a wee bit.

why would you think it is "safe to say" when no-one, or at least none of the plebs have heard anything, and would this outcome please you or displease you?

if it displeases you I would argue you couldn't really be accused of trolling.

I was just reporting on what has been widely reported by Killiefc.com and what I had heard from those close to the club. Namely that the idea of the debt being written off was dead in the water.

The outcome neither pleases or displeases me. I would rather we paid back any debt we owed, especially to local small business's. The debt was never going to be written off by the bank. I think a much more prudent course and the one being sought by the club, is to restructure that debt and amend the loan interest repayments. Giving the club more space to financially operate in and still paying our dues. The debt is apparently viewed as impaired, meaning the bank realise full repayment is not going to occur. It may well be that a portion of that debt is written off in the future. I cannot envisage the bank, part public owned, will ever write it all off. That is not an emotive viewpoint, merely a logical one. Would I like Kilmarnock Debt free, yes. Do I think it will occur through the bank suddenly deciding they don't like 6 figure sum interest repayments, no I don't. If you or me are overdrawn and fail to pay, they fair chase you up via correspondence etc. I can't imagine a 7 figure debt is something they will just write off. A portion of it perhaps.

The term "safe to say" was my way of saying "beyond all doubt" etc. It was a turn of phrase, not one with any emotive attachment.

[Solongaswekickthemout]

Let's nail this one good and proper - Billy Bowie told fellow Trust Board member Gary T and I this morning that without a shadow of a doubt had it not been for fans staying away and withholding their money that he would not have got involved at the club. Yes, we are talking about the guy who is bankrolling the club at the moment. To the likes of Higgy who is now going back and to the other guys who rightly or wrongly have decided to continue their boycott, your efforts have neither failed nor been in vain. Whether it can have much more of an effect is again up to individuals to decide.

Quoted from Baz on Killiefc.com

Intresting news ?

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

Let's nail this one good and proper - Billy Bowie told fellow Trust Board member Gary T and I this morning that without a shadow of a doubt had it not been for fans staying away and withholding their money that he would not have got involved at the club. Yes, we are talking about the guy who is bankrolling the club at the moment. To the likes of Higgy who is now going back and to the other guys who rightly or wrongly have decided to continue their boycott, your efforts have neither failed nor been in vain. Whether it can have much more of an effect is again up to individuals to decide.

Quoted from Baz on Killiefc.com

Intresting news ?

So basically, one person saying something he has no proof of to try and get people to keep following his actions? Does Baz have a messiah complex?

Why would Billy Bowie, a member of the board, tell Baz anything? He's not daft, and would know that the first thing Baz would do is post it online. It makes no sense for Bowie to leak a story that advocates people still continuing to boycott the club. Unless of course, he's playing a game with regards to taking over himself - however then he would have just leaked things without having his name linked to it.

Baz and his cohorts, instead of using their energy to come up with a protest plan (or have an open discussion to work out a protest plan) are simply bricking it because plenty of Killie fans, like the aforementioned SquirrelHumper, have realised that the previous 'NAPM' plan hadn't worked in the way they had all hoped. Instead of admitting they were wrong, and trying to engage with those supporters that don't think MJ is the man to lead us into the future (Hiya Baz! Hiya pal!), they are still trying to justify the original plan that they led.

[rea]

So basically, one person saying something he has no proof of to try and get people to keep following his actions? Does Baz have a messiah complex?

Why would Billy Bowie, a member of the board, tell Baz anything? He's not daft, and would know that the first thing Baz would do is post it online. It makes no sense for Bowie to leak a story that advocates people still continuing to boycott the club. Unless of course, he's playing a game with regards to taking over himself - however then he would have just leaked things without having his name linked to it.

Baz and his cohorts, instead of using their energy to come up with a protest plan (or have an open discussion to work out a protest plan) are simply bricking it because plenty of Killie fans, like the aforementioned SquirrelHumper, have realised that the previous 'NAPM' plan hadn't worked in the way they had all hoped. Instead of admitting they were wrong, and trying to engage with those supporters that don't think MJ is the man to lead us into the future (Hiya Baz! Hiya pal!), they are still trying to justify the original plan that they led.

Just a Quick comment but Billy Bowie is not a Director of Kilmarnock Football Club, at least not as of this morning.

[deadasdillinger]

So basically, one person saying something he has no proof of to try and get people to keep following his actions? Does Baz have a messiah complex?

Why would Billy Bowie, a member of the board, tell Baz anything? He's not daft, and would know that the first thing Baz would do is post it online. It makes no sense for Bowie to leak a story that advocates people still continuing to boycott the club. Unless of course, he's playing a game with regards to taking over himself - however then he would have just leaked things without having his name linked to it.

Baz and his cohorts, instead of using their energy to come up with a protest plan (or have an open discussion to work out a protest plan) are simply bricking it because plenty of Killie fans, like the aforementioned SquirrelHumper, have realised that the previous 'NAPM' plan hadn't worked in the way they had all hoped. Instead of admitting they were wrong, and trying to engage with those supporters that don't think MJ is the man to lead us into the future (Hiya Baz! Hiya pal!), they are still trying to justify the original plan that they led.

Alternatively, Baz has always been very careful about what he posts online so as not to leave himself open to claims of slander etc. I can't see him posting the above unless he and BB know that the conversation really took place.

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

Just a Quick comment but Billy Bowie is not a Director of Kilmarnock Football Club, at least not as of this morning.

According to this article, he is > http://www.kilmarnockfc.co.uk/articles/20130809/local-businessman-invests-in-kilmarnock-fc_85961_3343390

It mentions him "joining the board" and MJ says "I'm delighted to welcome Billy Bowie to the board."

And this one > http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/businessman-billy-bowie-explains-ploughed-2362971

Where it mentions him being "the co-director responsible for running the club."

[deadasdillinger]

Believing MJ... That's your first problem, QLP.

[Nutz_the_Squirrel]

QLP- just for the record, are you saying that Baz is lying?

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

Alternatively, Baz has always been very careful about what he posts online so as not to leave himself open to claims of slander etc. I can't see him posting the above unless he and BB know that the conversation really took place.

I guess we'll see how long it remains online then. He (and others) have posted things before that have been removed, so we'll see if this is the case here.

[Quitongo's Left Peg]

Believing MJ... That's your first problem, QLP.

You mention Baz being careful of not saying inaccurate things online, yet you think MJ is going to do the same? Even ignoring that .co.uk article, the Daily Record interview with Bowie himself mentions him being the "co-director".