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5 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Where did I say they weren’t representative?  You argue against FPTP in one post then use the results from this “unfair” system to claim something that never happened in your next post.

You’re all over the place.

A majority of the Scottish electorate were motivated enough to back parties that supported another referendum, enough to gain majority representation in our Parliament. How is this not indicative that majority are in favour? That's the question, if a majority were not in favour why is that not being reflected at the ballot box.

I've not really commented on FPTP or called it unfair, so i have no idea where you get that from.

Our system is more sensitive to swings from one party to another though, so if people were so motivated to oppose they could easily unseat the parties in favour of Indy and remove them from power, but they do not. It's not because they cannot. It's because they are in the minority.

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3 hours ago, Zern said:

A majority of the Scottish electorate were motivated enough to back parties that supported another referendum, enough to gain majority representation in our Parliament. How is this not indicative that majority are in favour? That's the question, if a majority were not in favour why is that not being reflected at the ballot box.

I've not really commented on FPTP or called it unfair, so i have no idea where you get that from.

Our system is more sensitive to swings from one party to another though, so if people were so motivated to oppose they could easily unseat the parties in favour of Indy and remove them from power, but they do not. It's not because they cannot. It's because they are in the minority.

They weren’t.

In 2021 47.7% voted SNP in the constituency vote.  1.3% Green
The regional vote was 40.3% and 8.1% for them respectively.

In the 2019 Westminster election the SNP got 45% of the votes.  I can’t find figures for the greens but if you add up the figures for the other three main parties you can see they got 53.2% so the greens were as trivial as ever.

You don’t need a degree in maths to work out that, contrary to your claim, a majority of people did not vote for parties that back another referendum.

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2 hours ago, Left Back said:

They weren’t.

In 2021 47.7% voted SNP in the constituency vote.  1.3% Green
The regional vote was 40.3% and 8.1% for them respectively.

In the 2019 Westminster election the SNP got 45% of the votes.  I can’t find figures for the greens but if you add up the figures for the other three main parties you can see they got 53.2% so the greens were as trivial as ever.

You don’t need a degree in maths to work out that, contrary to your claim, a majority of people did not vote for parties that back another referendum.

The Snp & Greens are not the only parties that support independence.

On the regional list, Snp (40.3%) plus Green (8.1%) plus Alba (1.7%) equals 50.1%. That's a majority before you even begin to count the independence supporting parties that got less than 1%.

Perhaps you should work on your arithmetic skills.

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9 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

The Snp & Greens are not the only parties that support independence.

On the regional list, Snp (40.3%) plus Green (8.1%) plus Alba (1.7%) equals 50.1%. That's a majority before you even begin to count the independence supporting parties that got less than 1%.

Perhaps you should work on your arithmetic skills.

It's all pretty pathetic.  Who wants to live in the top end of Britain partitioned on a 50%+1 of votes from a thicket of boors, neds and Shinners?  it's no way to build a new country.  Though I appreciate it doesn't matter to the blood and soil ScotchNats.

 

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2 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

It's all pretty pathetic.  Who wants to live in the top end of Britain partitioned on a 50%+1 of votes from a thicket of boors, neds and Shinners?  it's no way to build a new country.  Though I appreciate it doesn't matter to the blood and soil ScotchNats.

 

I note that you don't want to live here now, never mind after Indy.

It's a pity that you no longer support democracy though. 

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5 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

I note that you don't want to live here now, never mind after Indy.

It's a pity that you no longer support democracy though. 

I could move to Glasgow easily.  The tragic governance in the Dumbiedykes Duma and the lack of people calling it out is a problem.  Obviously not for you.  You're quite happy with the shitshow that is NatWit Scotland.

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8 hours ago, FalkirkBairn2021 said:

Hung parliament in the next GE has to be likely. 

Think that's the time for the SNP to be powerbrokers and deliver another Indyref. 

Can understand the reluctance to wait that long though. 

I can't see either the Tories or Labour giving the SNP any such concessions, just for power.

The issue of partition is just too important.  We can't play games with the soul of the country.

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30 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

The Snp & Greens are not the only parties that support independence.

On the regional list, Snp (40.3%) plus Green (8.1%) plus Alba (1.7%) equals 50.1%. That's a majority before you even begin to count the independence supporting parties that got less than 1%.

Perhaps you should work on your arithmetic skills.

So the regional list vote means the majority of voters have backed a referendum?  Is that really what you’re trying to argue?  The other side would simply point to the other two examples I provided.

The statement is clearly false no matter which way you want to try and spin it.

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17 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

I could move to Glasgow easily.  The tragic governance in the Dumbiedykes Duma and the lack of people calling it out is a problem.  Obviously not for you.  You're quite happy with the shitshow that is NatWit Scotland.

Please don’t. I’m sure you’re far happier cleaning glasses for your superiors in a Brexity, bigoted favela - and god knows, everyone in Glasgow is happier without your brand of extremism.

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7 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

I could move to Glasgow easily.  The tragic governance in the Dumbiedykes Duma and the lack of people calling it out is a problem.  Obviously not for you.  You're quite happy with the shitshow that is NatWit Scotland.

I note that you don't disagree with the accusation of denying democracy.

Anyway, I'm not happy with the current shitshow in Scotland. That's why I vote for independence from the increasingly right-wing rUK.

Incidentally, do you consider me to be a boor, ned or shinner? If so, can you give reasons for coming to that conclusion

6 minutes ago, Left Back said:

So the regional list vote means the majority of voters have backed a referendum?  Is that really what you’re trying to argue?  The other side would simply point to the other two examples I provided.

The statement is clearly false no matter which way you want to try and spin it.

Do you have reading problems as well as being bad at arithmetic?

I specifically stated that more than 50% of voters on the list voted for independence supporting parties. That statement is 100% true.

You forgot that there were multiple parties that support Sindy. That's pretty dumb.

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27 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

It's all pretty pathetic.  Who wants to live in the top end of Britain partitioned on a 50%+1 of votes from a thicket of boors, neds and Shinners?  it's no way to build a new country.  Though I appreciate it doesn't matter to the blood and soil ScotchNats.

 

There is no 'new country'.  A growing number of people simply seek a better country.  And minus the Ruritanian enclaves of Royal Deeside and parts of the Borders the demographics are steadily moving in that direction.

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1 minute ago, lichtgilphead said:

Anyway, I'm not happy with the current shitshow in Scotland. That's why I vote for independence from the increasingly right-wing rUK.

2 minutes ago, lichtgilphead said:

Incidentally, do you consider me to be a boor, ned or shinner? If so, can you give reasons for coming to that conclusion

Undoubtedly a boor.  Reason?  See your answer above.

SCO is being run in to the ground.  You acknowledge this.  You're too boorish to put the blame where it belongs.  Pretty tragic.

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5 minutes ago, O'Kelly Isley III said:

A growing number of people simply seek a better country. 

15 years of backing the tragedy that is the SNP shows this is a piece of nonsense.

Total control over health, transport, education and local government.   A (pre covid) Barnett Bonus of £2,000 ppa and the Nats contrive to make SCO worse.  Against common sense.  Yet you keep voting for these clowns.

You have everything at your disposal to make SCO better but you vote to make it worse.

Partition is nothing to do with good governance.  

Edited by The_Kincardine
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4 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

Undoubtedly a boor.  Reason?  See your answer above.

SCO is being run in to the ground.  You acknowledge this.  You're too boorish to put the blame where it belongs.  Pretty tragic.

I would disagree with your viewpoint. In my opinion, Brexit & other Tory policies are doing far more damage to Scotland than any actions of the Scottish Government.

Anyway, a boor is defined as "a rough and bad-mannered person"

In what way is the statement "I'm not happy with the current shitshow in Scotland. That's why I vote for independence from the increasingly right-wing rUK." rough and bad-mannered?

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53 minutes ago, The_Kincardine said:

Undoubtedly a boor.  Reason?  See your answer above.

SCO is being run in to the ground.  You acknowledge this.  You're too boorish to put the blame where it belongs.  Pretty tragic.

The balance from tomfoolery taking in impertinence and onwards to the partisan is important.

Under normal circumstances I'd trust you to be a good judge of this so if there is anything that is troubling you, don't hesitate, you've got a friend. 

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5 hours ago, Left Back said:

They weren’t.

In 2021 47.7% voted SNP in the constituency vote.  1.3% Green
The regional vote was 40.3% and 8.1% for them respectively.

In the 2019 Westminster election the SNP got 45% of the votes.  I can’t find figures for the greens but if you add up the figures for the other three main parties you can see they got 53.2% so the greens were as trivial as ever.

You don’t need a degree in maths to work out that, contrary to your claim, a majority of people did not vote for parties that back another referendum.

In 2021 The SNP won the majority of the vote, it was the largest single party. Majority does not mean they command overall or outright majority on their own but hey do command the largest voting preference at the ballot box.

Here's example ballot that may help your misunderstanding.

Simple election vote. 100 votes total.

4 Candidates A,B,C and D. A get 40 votes B, C & D get 20 each.

Who won the majority of the votes? A

Who wins the seat. A.

The other 60 don't count as a unitary block, because their share is split 3 ways with only 20 each.

Now, this is my question to you. IF the SNP were to command 50% or greater, what would change? What threshold in law are we attaining? I can't find any. This requirement appears to be just another arbitrary hurdle. One of many set by opponents who lost at the ballot box.

Because the fact is if they were polling at greater than 50% yet unable to command the legislature then they would not be able to hold a referendum, and the opposition party that presumably would be in power wouldn't be minded to bring one forward on the basis of polling.

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