Scottish Independence - How will you vote? MkII

[xbl]

In an independent Scotland, we won't have phones, internet, or tv?

[AberdeenBud]

In an independent Scotland, we won't have phones, internet, or tv?

I know.

He seems to think BT will either be completely disbanded or massively scaled back in an Independent Scotland.

Project fear has set in deep with some people, especially when their livelihood is concerned, but I'm slowly convincing him otherwise. The CWU attempting to remain "neutral" and repeating some of the other BT's nonsense has seemingly not helped either.

Scotland's broadband take up and investment actually lags behind the rest of theUK, IIRC, and hopefully this is something BT Scotland and a Scottish Government could address.

[Broccoli Dog]

BT is a private company, they won't be going anywhere. Though maybe we could consider renationalising telecommunications in an independent Scotland.

[Baxter Parp]

If I actually go to the polling station you'll probably be right. Despite what I've said previously in this thread, I couldn't see myself ticking the no box, I expect the temptation of being able to vote yes would be too much.

Pretty much. They've seemingly been told as much internally and Westminster have publicly said that it's very likely:

http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/scottish-independence-dfid-would-leave-scotland-1-3185333

Humza Yousaf gave a glimmer of hope that the jobs may be retained post-independence in the link below, but his argument was too flimsy for me to get my hopes up about it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-24756219

What would Westminster have to do with jobs in the Scottish Civil Service?

[ayrmad]

Err, nothing. DFID is a UK government department.

Might get a job in the SDFID, just a thought, we're surely not going to turn into a self-centred fcuk everybody else bunch of b*****ds if we vote YES.

[Baxter Parp]

Err, nothing. DFID is a UK government department.

Like Ayrmad says, what's stopping us from having a Department for International Development?

[Swampy]

I thought we wouldn't be able to afford embassy buildings, plus we're going to get vetoed from the EU by Spain anyway, so we shouldn't really get ahead of ourselves. We can maybe have a diesel train to England (allowing for delays at the heavily-fortified border) to carry essentials such as mail and scallops.

[banterman86]

Humza Yousaf gave a glimmer of hope that the jobs may be retained post-independence in the link below, but his argument was too flimsy for me to get my hopes up about it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-scotland-politics-24756219

"Mr Yousaf told the committee the UK government may wish to retain its existing presence and expertise East Kilbride after independence.

"I have no aversion whatsoever to DfID having a continued presence in Scotland post-independence, if they want, for the continuation of projects," he said."

That doesn't really make sense, I assume what is more likely is that people at DfiD would be transfered elsewhere in the Scottish Civil Service - like a Scottish foreign office perhaps?

Edit to add - on the further assumption that a scottish DfiD wouldn't have the same level of staffing as itd be delaing with a reduced budget.

Edited December 4, 2013 by banterman86

[ayrmad]

I thought we wouldn't be able to afford embassy buildings, plus we're going to get vetoed from the EU by Spain anyway, so we shouldn't really get ahead of ourselves. We can maybe have a diesel train to England (allowing for delays at the heavily-fortified border) to carry essentials such as mail and scallops.

The scallops just buckled me.

[Baxter Parp]

 

 

We might well have one, I don't really know how far up the list of priorities it would be for the government post-independence. I'll need something a bit more concrete than "might get a job in a department that might exist" if I'm going to alter my current plans though.

.

Something like "your dad will have a job for life even though the UK government is committed to cutting public spending by £3bn on Thursday and has permanent austerity forever as its stated ambition" you mean?

[wingsoverperthshire]

Commenting on the debate in the House of Commons today on the Lords amendment to the Energy bill - and in particular Amendment 54 which removed the Scottish parliament’s powers in respect of renewables obligation in Scotland, SNP Energy spokesman Mike Weir said :

“This is an outrageous example of the unionist parties ganging up to remove powers from the Scottish parliament . Worse still they did so by introducing last–minute amendments in the un-elected House of Lords, rather than even having the courage to debate it on the floor of the House of Commons.

“There was no consultation with the Scottish Government or the Scottish Parliament prior to the introduction of this amendment, nor when challenged in the Commons did the minister or his Labour front bench counterpart have any reasonable explanation as to why this happened in such an underhand manner.

“This is yet another example of Tories and Labour ganging up at Westminster against Scotland’s interests and removing powers from Scotland. Whilst the NO campaign talk about vague promises of more powers if people vote NO, the reality is they are removing Scotland’s existing powers by stealth.

“The only way it can be stopped is with a YES vote next September.”

[Baxter Parp]

 

A simple explanation of how an independent Scotland intends to 'preserve the employment' of the staff at DFiD would be fine really.

Why aren't you asking the UK government the same thing? What is it that makes his job so safe compared to the hundreds of thousands of public workers that have already been punted in the past five years?

[YOGI IS GOD]

An Edinburgh Labour councillor defected to the SNP today http://news.stv.tv/east-central/251633-labour-councillor-alex-lunn-defects-to-snp-in-support-for-independence/

[Mr Rational]

Aye? Who's that?

[ArabianKnight]

Aye? Who's that?

now where has HB gone....

[Baxter Parp]

 

What exactly are you suggesting I do? They may be redundant at some unspecified point in the future, I really don't know. .

That would be my point. There is as much chance of your Dad losing his job with the UK government as with the Scottish.

A Scottish government will need counterparts for all the departments currently in the UK. That much is obvious.

[Mr Rational]

now where has HB gone....

I don't tend to gloat, be smug or feel superior, but I think I can have one day a year

[HTG]

I'm voting Yes even though my job is with a UK Civil Service Dept. I can't watch this opportunity role past because there is a risk I won't get a transfer into a Scottish Govt Dept. If that was the outcome I'd go and work down there for the time it took to get a move back.

I haven't read through the 13 pages on here but why anyone would think that a country with the history we have can't manage ourselves is beyond me. For a start, setting oil aside, the future is surely in harnessing wind and wave energy in a more effective way. Surrounded as we are by water on 3 sides, with our weather carrying a default setting of "shite" we are superbly placed going forward. We're a country of 5 million and we'll have more than enough to hit the export market.

I really can't be done by folk saying we won't have a currency (like we're not going to use the pound or the euro). Of course we will. Common sense tells you that for trading purposes England would be sensible to share the pound given the cross border market. Folk might think that market isn't huge but when you see the reaction to when Ireland needed a wee hand you understand how important their economy was to London.

I work with a fair few folk in the north of England and some of them would be quite content to row in beside us because they have no sense of community with those who make decisions on their behalf.

Look at the people Scotland has produced. Look at the talent we have. We would punch well above our weight as a small country and we'd make a far better fist of things that the Italians, Spanish, Portuguese or Greeks. Anyone who can't see past the confusion of transition isn't looking hard enough. Let's get a govt we vote for and take decisions that we sign up to. I've yet to hear a positive reason for staying as we are that has carried any weight at all.

[Heidthebaw]

A simple explanation of how an independent Scotland intends to 'preserve the employment' of the staff at DFiD would be fine really.

That would DEPEND on who wins the first scottish election after independence, <hint- don't vote tory>

[ayrmad]

I'm voting Yes even though my job is with a UK Civil Service Dept. I can't watch this opportunity role past because there is a risk I won't get a transfer into a Scottish Govt Dept. If that was the outcome I'd go and work down there for the time it took to get a move back.

I haven't read through the 13 pages on here but why anyone would think that a country with the history we have can't manage ourselves is beyond me. For a start, setting oil aside, the future is surely in harnessing wind and wave energy in a more effective way. Surrounded as we are by water on 3 sides, with our weather carrying a default setting of "shite" we are superbly placed going forward. We're a country of 5 million and we'll have more than enough to hit the export market.

I really can't be done by folk saying we won't have a currency (like we're not going to use the pound or the euro). Of course we will. Common sense tells you that for trading purposes England would be sensible to share the pound given the cross border market. Folk might think that market isn't huge but when you see the reaction to when Ireland needed a wee hand you understand how important their economy was to London.

I work with a fair few folk in the north of England and some of them would be quite content to row in beside us because they have no sense of community with those who make decisions on their behalf.

Look at the people Scotland has produced. Look at the talent we have. We would punch well above our weight as a small country and we'd make a far better fist of things that the Italians, Spanish, Portuguese or Greeks. Anyone who can't see past the confusion of transition isn't looking hard enough. Let's get a govt we vote for and take decisions that we sign up to. I've yet to hear a positive reason for staying as we are that has carried any weight at all.

Got me.

Got me.

Got me.

Edited December 4, 2013 by ayrmad