Ad Lib Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 When did Abu Dhabi or Dubai buy these things then? Trident-nuclear-submarine-006.jpg At least the Emirates spent their money on infrastructure and buildings, not the ability to destroy them. Infrastructure and buildings overwhelmingly for the benefit of their elite and Western multi-millionaires to have a timeshare. We did invest in intrastructure and buildings too. Aberdeen and its surrounding area has been transformed by the oil wealth of the last few decades. Tens of thousands of new homes built in and to the West of the city. We've seen the maintenance of a welfare state that is still much more generous than anything you'd get in the UAE. For all you throw Trident into the mix, consider this: the UAE spends 6.9% of its GDP on defence. The UK spends 2.5% of its GDP on defence. If anyone's spending money on developing the ability to destroy stuff, I think we can safely say it's the UAE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davi3j Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 Infrastructure and buildings overwhelmingly for the benefit of their elite and Western multi-millionaires to have a timeshare. We did invest in intrastructure and buildings too. Aberdeen and its surrounding area has been transformed by the oil wealth of the last few decades. Tens of thousands of new homes built in and to the West of the city. We've seen the maintenance of a welfare state that is still much more generous than anything you'd get in the UAE. For all you throw Trident into the mix, consider this: the UAE spends 6.9% of its GDP on defence. The UK spends 2.5% of its GDP on defence. If anyone's spending money on developing the ability to destroy stuff, I think we can safely say it's the UAE. UAE GDP = 360.2 billion USD UK GDP = 2.435 trillion USD **shakes head in disbelief** Ad Lib pretends that 6.9% of 360 billion is greater than 2.5% of 2.4 trillion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeeperDee Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 UAE GDP = 360.2 billion USD UK GDP = 2.435 trillion USD **shakes head in disbelief** Ad Lib pretends that 6.9% of 360 billion is greater than 2.5% of 2.4 trillion. Sterling work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 I laughed til I had a tear in my eye at some of the gutrot put forward by HB and Adlib - show this to your children about the perils of spending too much time on the internet "learning about the world" and not enough actually going out and, you know, engaging in old fashioned speaking to actual people. The above photo is the best bit. This is supposed to "represent" poverty in the UAE. Go on HB, make us laugh. What's the poverty here? Oh, I see, you saw a black man in the street and a Pakistani man "in pyjamas" (not, of course, the normal national dress of Pakistani workers) and thought they must be slaves. Ha ha ha, ya daft racist. God, I love steps. Steps demonstrate wealth and power. Gan on yersel steps. This was supposed to demonstrate the contrast of the beauty of Glasgow and your third point was "we have steps". Kneel down world and marvel. Ah, I see what you've done there. You've said "the Middle East" and the likes of "Qatar" are the same. What you haven't done is actually any homework. For example, how much oil does Dubai have? Not much is the answer, a little bit of gas but Dubai operates as a free market economy based on trade, comparing Scotland's oil income to Dubai is like boasting that Antarctica gets more snow than Miami. So, a family is worse off than Easterhouse? No, as the workers of Dubai (and Middle East) come without their wives and children. Also, they get housing/ utilities etc paid. Their wage - around 2,000dhs a month (330 quid) is literally to pay for them and their food. Now, tell me a family in Easterhouse with one member working 20 hours a week on minimum wage is better off? Hilarious. Put the thesaurus away Champ, you're talking balls. Oh look, it's the victim blaming scumbag who defends the UAE for jailing rape victims for the heinous crime of being raped. I don't think we'll be taking any advice from you champ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joozy Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 At least the Emirates spent their money on infrastructure and buildings, not the ability to destroy them. For all you throw Trident into the mix, consider this: the UAE spends 6.9% of its GDP on defence. The UK spends 2.5% of its GDP on defence. If anyone's spending money on developing the ability to destroy stuff, I think we can safely say it's the UAE. UAE GDP = 360.2 billion USD UK GDP = 2.435 trillion USD **shakes head in disbelief** Ad Lib pretends that 6.9% of 360 billion is greater than 2.5% of 2.4 trillion. Are you just wilfully missing the point? No-one would dispute that in absolute terms the UK spends more than the UAE on defence. The fact is, as was correctly pointed out, that the Emirates spend a far greater proportion of their money on defence than the UK. Military spending per head in the Emirates is around the highest in the world (if not the highest). It was you who originally stated that the Emirates weren't spending money on growing their capability to 'destroy buildings' - this clearly isn't the case. Trying to create a straw man argument by 'shaking your head in disbelief' at something Ad Lib never even said, is just ridiculous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 Are you just wilfully missing the point? No-one would dispute that in absolute terms the UK spends more than the UAE on defence. The fact is, as was correctly pointed out, that the Emirates spend a far greater proportion of their money on defence than the UK. Military spending per head in the Emirates is around the highest in the world (if not the highest). It was you who originally stated that the Emirates weren't spending money on growing their capability to 'destroy buildings' - this clearly isn't the case. Trying to create a straw man argument by 'shaking your head in disbelief' at something Ad Lib never even said, is just ridiculous. I couldn't have put it better myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 I couldn't have put it better myself. One thing worth pointing out is that the defence budget of the UK has never traditionally included the cost of Trident - this has always come from a different budget, at least until 2010 - but I'm not sure how far they ever got with making that come out of the main defence budget, or whether it was quietly dropped. Not that it would take you up to the 6% that the UAE spends, but it has always been higher than the 2.5% currently spent, and that for the money you spend, Trident gives you a wee bit more bang for your buck than anything in the UAE inventory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joozy Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 One thing worth pointing out is that the defence budget of the UK has never traditionally included the cost of Trident - this has always come from a different budget, at least until 2010 - but I'm not sure how far they ever got with making that come out of the main defence budget, or whether it was quietly dropped. Not that it would take you up to the 6% that the UAE spends, but it has always been higher than the 2.5% currently spent, and that for the money you spend, Trident gives you a wee bit more bang for your buck than anything in the UAE inventory. Is there a possibility that the budget for Trident didn't come out of the MoD budget but this has been adjusted for when stating the proportion of GDP spent on defence? Essentially, does the defence budget necessarily equal total UK spending on defence and what are these figures based upon? Genuine question, I really don't know the answer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 One thing worth pointing out is that the defence budget of the UK has never traditionally included the cost of Trident - this has always come from a different budget, at least until 2010 - but I'm not sure how far they ever got with making that come out of the main defence budget, or whether it was quietly dropped. Not that it would take you up to the 6% that the UAE spends, but it has always been higher than the 2.5% currently spent, and that for the money you spend, Trident gives you a wee bit more bang for your buck than anything in the UAE inventory. IIRC the running costs of Trident come in at about £2.2 billion a year and the cost of Trident replacement over about 5 years is estimated at about £500 million a year for that period. Even if that were excluded from the UK defence spending total given on Wikipedia as $61 billion or so, that would bring it up to about $65 billion, which shakes out on the same assumptions as about 2.6% of GDP. It's no gamechanger to the analysis that it is untrue to say that the UAE doesn't spend its money on destroying buildings or that it spends less as a proportion of its GDP on such enterprise than does the UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carl Cort's Hamstring Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 UAE GDP = 360.2 billion USD UK GDP = 2.435 trillion USD **shakes head in disbelief** Ad Lib pretends that 6.9% of 360 billion is greater than 2.5% of 2.4 trillion. This is the same logic that wealthy right-wing types use to argue that the rich shouldn't have to pay so much tax. It's stupid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkinFighter Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkingdom/adam-ramsay/scotland-isnt-different-its-britain-thats-bizarre Good read showing it's the UK who are different from the rest of us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkingdom/adam-ramsay/scotland-isnt-different-its-britain-thats-bizarre Good read showing it's the UK who are different from the rest of us. I do feel sometimes that there is a political Americanisation going on in the UK. That the UK doesn't want to be seen as European. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dipped Flake Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 Are you just wilfully missing the point? No-one would dispute that in absolute terms the UK spends more than the UAE on defence. The fact is, as was correctly pointed out, that the Emirates spend a far greater proportion of their money on defence than the UK. Military spending per head in the Emirates is around the highest in the world (if not the highest). It was you who originally stated that the Emirates weren't spending money on growing their capability to 'destroy buildings' - this clearly isn't the case. Trying to create a straw man argument by 'shaking your head in disbelief' at something Ad Lib never even said, is just ridiculous. think you will find that the emirates didn't invade Iraq/Afghanistan, don't have nukes etc so they are not spending money so they can 'destroy buildings'. They live in a very volatile part of the World and so need to spend a lot on defence. They have invested huge amounts of money into their infrastructure so that they can be ready for when the oil and gas runs out. The UK has totally wasted every penny of oil money on trident and debt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted March 21, 2014 Share Posted March 21, 2014 I do feel sometimes that there is a political Americanisation going on in the UK. That the UK doesn't want to be seen as European. I do feel sometimes that there is a political Americanisation going on in the UK. That the UK doesn't want to be seen as European. No kidding, Watson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 http://www.opendemocracy.net/ourkingdom/adam-ramsay/scotland-isnt-different-its-britain-thats-bizarre Good read showing it's the UK who are different from the rest of us. Very very dece article. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LinkinFighter Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Very very dece article.None of our no contingent have commented on the article as of yet, not sure why. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 think you will find that the emirates didn't invade Iraq/Afghanistan, don't have nukes etc so they are not spending money so they can 'destroy buildings'. They live in a very volatile part of the World and so need to spend a lot on defence. They have invested huge amounts of money into their infrastructure so that they can be ready for when the oil and gas runs out. The UK has totally wasted every penny of oil money on trident and debt Lol. Spending money on the "capacity" to "destroy buildings" doesn't require you actually to destroy one single building. The UK has not wasted "every penny" of oil money "on trident and debt". The people of Aberdeen, who never entered a recession at the time of the financial crisis and whose unemployment rate has been consistently down at 3% can testify to the contrary. Where do you think the money has come from for the development of thousands of houses in the last decade or so in Aberdeen and surrounding towns and villages? The magic money tree? It's come from the hundreds of millions of pounds generated in the local economy through oil and gas, derivative sector jobs and more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YOGI IS GOD Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 Just watching Lamont's speech at the Scottish Labour conference. The take-home message seems to be "Don't you hate that Salmond?". Like every speech she has given in the past three years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tubbs Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-26689016 Dennis Canavan is the Chair of Yes Scotland; which I didn't realise before. He spoke quite well; keen to emphasise that Yes Scotland is not party political etc. He was till not that clear on currency etc lots of 'Scottish people will decide' and 'various options' stuff but for me this just highlights that the referendum really does not provide anyone with any kind of mandate to negotiate independence if the vote was for Yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted March 22, 2014 Share Posted March 22, 2014 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-26689016 Dennis Canavan is the Chair of Yes Scotland; which I didn't realise before. He spoke quite well; keen to emphasise that Yes Scotland is not party political etc. He was till not that clear on currency etc lots of 'Scottish people will decide' and 'various options' stuff but for me this just highlights that the referendum really does not provide anyone with any kind of mandate to negotiate independence if the vote was for Yes. He can emphasise all he wants that Yes Scotland is not a political party, but it is, whether he likes it or not Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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