GingerSaint Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Agreed - apart from Brady was drafted 199th in the 2000 draft, not 166th. I was close! Not sure why I thought it was that, I've heard about it enough times from smug Pats fans. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Big plays like this? So the knock on Teddy is that he's only as good as franchise QB's Matt Ryan and Phillip Rivers? Must've missed that one, were there many more? That's pretty much what I'm saying. Rivers and Ryan are good QBs but will never be 'elite'. I can see a situation where Manziel and Bortles are 'elite' at some point in their careers, but I just can't see it with Bridgewater for whatever reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 There's currently 4 "elite" QB's. Peyton Manning picked 1st. Aaron Rodgers picked 24th. Drew Brees picked 32nd. Tom Brady picked 199th. Basically it's pretty much impossible to tell how well someone will do, or how good they'll become, but Bridgewater is certainly the best QB on offer in this draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtie23 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Il not so sure on Manziel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerSaint Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Must've missed that one, were there many more? That's pretty much what I'm saying. Rivers and Ryan are good QBs but will never be 'elite'. I can see a situation where Manziel and Bortles are 'elite' at some point in their careers, but I just can't see it with Bridgewater for whatever reason Russell Wilson-esque (Super Bowl winning QB). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Using Brees as an example, was he 'elite' when he was at the Chargers? My point is that saying a QB will 'never be elite' is pretty silly. For a number of reasons. Nope. Indeed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerSaint Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 My last (and favourite) Teddy gif. Such a pro ready player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 I absolutely detest the word 'elite' in this context, but why? Me too, that's why I put what was supposed to be air quotes around it. My reason for saying it is because (need to use it again, sorry) 'elite' guys can make a shite team good and haul everyone around them up to their level. Brady made the playoffs this year with probably the worst patriots team I've seen since I started watching the sport. Ryan had a chance to do it this year and couldn't and actually had a good team last year and still done next to nothing. Rivers has had plenty of chances with the players he's had around him, I can't see them getting much better than they were this season. There's currently 4 "elite" QB's. Peyton Manning picked 1st. Aaron Rodgers picked 24th. Drew Brees picked 32nd. Tom Brady picked 199th. Basically it's pretty much impossible to tell how well someone will do, or how good they'll become, but Bridgewater is certainly the best QB on offer in this draft. My point was of the top 3 guys, Bridgewater has the lowest ceiling. Still pretty damn high for sure but I cant see him turning a <5 win team into playoff contenders without having other great players around him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 My point was of the top 3 guys, Bridgewater has the lowest ceiling. Still pretty damn high for sure but I cant see him turning a <5 win team into playoff contenders without having other great players around him. But you can see Bortles or Manziel doing it? Manziel is flaky as f**k. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerSaint Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Brady made the playoffs this year with probably the worst patriots team I've seen since I started watching the sport. He did it by having a similarly bad season. He wasn't the only one that played well and dragged his team out of the shit as everyone seems to think. Belichick was the real man behind it. He moulded the offense into a power running team and got the best out of a finished Legarrette Blount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerSaint Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 But you can see Bortles or Manziel doing it? Manziel is flaky as f**k. Spot on analysis of Manziel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 My last (and favourite) Teddy gif. Such a pro ready player. Never said he wasn't pro-ready, he definitely is, much more so than the other two Nope. Indeed. Did he ever get a chance to play at the chargers? Also never said Bridgewater would never be 'elite' ( ), I said I cant see it. It's certainly possible but if I was to make a prediction I would say no. I hope he proves me wrong because he's coming to The Pups in the Dynasty League this year Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 But you can see Bortles or Manziel doing it? Manziel is flaky as f**k. He is but if he gains a bit of consistency and adapts to a more pro style offence he could be up there with Cam Newton. Could well be a Tebow like bust but could end up being a top 5 guy. Next to nothing, like leading the team to the NFC Championship game? I agree that the two QBs aren't in the 'elite' category. But it may happen. That's the one I must be thinking of the season before maybe. Either way you look at the players he had last season who were at the top of their game like Jones, White and Gonzalez. Put any of the not-shite QBs in that position and they could do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Did he ever get a chance to play at the chargers? He played 4 season for the Chargers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Nah. Yeah they could, plug Nick Foles in and he could do it. Or Rivers. Or Stafford. Or Flacco. Or Luck. Hell Schaub could probably have done it before this season! Matt Ryan is good but he's been made to look better by the players around him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lichtie23 Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Matt Ryan is a superb QB in my opinion Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 2, 2014 Share Posted March 2, 2014 Matt Ryan is a superb QB in my opinion I'd say there are 10 better and 4/5 around the same level, just slightly behind Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BishyTON Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 I'd say there are 10 better and 4/5 around the same level, just slightly behind The only starters who are clearly better than Matt Ryan imo are Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. I would put him in a fairly close group with the likes of Russell Wilson, Cam Newton, Matthew Stafford and Andrew Luck and slightly ahead of Nick Foles, RG3, Tony Romo, Big Ben etc. Basically I see him as a Top 5-10 QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 The only starters who are clearly better than Matt Ryan imo are Aaron Rodgers, Drew Brees, Peyton Manning and Tom Brady. I would put him in a fairly close group with the likes of Russell Wilson, Cam Newton, Matthew Stafford and Andrew Luck and slightly ahead of Nick Foles, RG3, Tony Romo, Big Ben etc. Basically I see him as a Top 5-10 QB. He's not as good as wilson or rothlisberger, those guys won superbowls with less than extraordinary offences to help them out. Cam's talent has barely scratched the surface, other than a rapidly declining Steve Smith and Greg Olsen he basically has no one who can reliably catch the ball and 2 running backs who are mediocre at best. I'd put him alongside Foles, although theres a question of whether Foles is a product of a good scheme fit and if he went elsewhere he'd be awful. He's better than Stafford, we seen this year what he can do without Calvin - effectively nothing - but is around that same area. My point is that Ryan's not the kind of player who has proven he can win against the odds. If Julio Jones gets injured again and he can still take that team to a winning season then I'll change my mind... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stewbo Posted March 3, 2014 Share Posted March 3, 2014 So why say this about him and not Ryan? Cam is going to be 'elite' in your eyes soon (I assume). Ryan can still reach the 'elite' level. He may not of course, but why is it possible for one player and not another? You keep saying that Ryan has weapons. Yes, but have you seen how much time he has to pass the ball? Not much use having these weapons if you have 2 seconds to throw the ball. The worst O-line in football bar none. Because Newton has produced despite his lack of support. He's already shown he can make the same kind of impact that a great player can have on a shitty team, I honestly don't think Ryan has ever done that. Second part is a fair point actually, he's never really had a good offensive line to play with (although I'd argue the Giants O-line this year was the worst by far). If they ever decide to sort that out and he manages to win a superbowl then I'll change my tune, until then though I just don't rate him as highly as some of you obviously do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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