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The Star Wars thread (includes spoilers for IX)


DavidMcG

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16 hours ago, Detective Jimmy McNulty said:

I'll put this I spoilers incase people haven't seen the latest episode, but hasn't...

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The episode absolutely obliterated the ' The last time we met I was but a learner, now I am the Master' line from A New Hope. Seeing as a near prime Vader has just dragged an aging Kenobi through the fire.

 

Spoiler

My real issue is that the message from Leia to Obi Wan in "A New Hope" is all about him serving her father in the Clone Wars. Unless she goes through some sort of memory wipe after this, you'd have thought something like "Hi Ben, remember me? You made an arse of trying to save me when I got kidnapped a few years back" seems more appropriate now

 

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17 hours ago, Detective Jimmy McNulty said:

I'll put this I spoilers incase people haven't seen the latest episode, but hasn't...

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The episode absolutely obliterated the ' The last time we met I was but a learner, now I am the Master' line from A New Hope. Seeing as a near prime Vader has just dragged an aging Kenobi through the fire.

 

Not quite yet, I would imagine the broken Obi-Wan will get his "Get up ya bum" Mickeyesque talk from a force ghost of a fallen Irishman before having one last battle with Vader.  Vader to get the Clubber Lang treatment

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1 hour ago, Loki said:

 

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Not quite yet, I would imagine the broken Obi-Wan will get his "Get up ya bum" Mickeyesque talk from a force ghost of a fallen Irishman before having one last battle with Vader.  Vader to get the Clubber Lang treatment

 

Spoiler

If it goes like that then it will be even more of a cop out given what we just seen, vader is completely and utterly full of rage, which fuels his strength, obi wan has barely done anything for ten years, theres no way within the time frame of the show that obi wan should be able to overcome what vader has become now, 

Obi wan could barely wield a lightsaber, vader was not only holding him hostage with the force, but at the same time setting the ground on fire, and his force power is now so strong he can put out flames with the force with a simple hand movement

The only way they can end the show imo (whatever series it does) is if something big happens and vader thinks obiwan is dead, that then allows them to kinda keep the meeting in a new hope on track (doesn't fix the vader master and apprentice line) 

 

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8 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said:
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If it goes like that then it will be even more of a cop out given what we just seen, vader is completely and utterly full of rage, which fuels his strength, obi wan has barely done anything for ten years, theres no way within the time frame of the show that obi wan should be able to overcome what vader has become now, 

Obi wan could barely wield a lightsaber, vader was not only holding him hostage with the force, but at the same time setting the ground on fire, and his force power is now so strong he can put out flames with the force with a simple hand movement

The only way they can end the show imo (whatever series it does) is if something big happens and vader thinks obiwan is dead, that then allows them to kinda keep the meeting in a new hope on track (doesn't fix the vader master and apprentice line) 

 

Spoiler

To keep it in any way credible and to keep the dialogue in A New Hope relevant, in the final confrontation between Kenobi and Vader in this series, Obi Wan is going to have to defeat Vader using purely wit, rather than saber or Force.

 

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47 minutes ago, Detective Jimmy McNulty said:
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To keep it in any way credible and to keep the dialogue in A New Hope relevant, in the final confrontation between Kenobi and Vader in this series, Obi Wan is going to have to defeat Vader using purely wit, rather than saber or Force.

 

Spoiler

As long as he doesn't try to run away, cause he's no very good at that given vader got the jump on him 3 times lol

 

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6 hours ago, 54_and_counting said:
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If it goes like that then it will be even more of a cop out given what we just seen, vader is completely and utterly full of rage, which fuels his strength, obi wan has barely done anything for ten years, theres no way within the time frame of the show that obi wan should be able to overcome what vader has become now, 

Obi wan could barely wield a lightsaber, vader was not only holding him hostage with the force, but at the same time setting the ground on fire, and his force power is now so strong he can put out flames with the force with a simple hand movement

The only way they can end the show imo (whatever series it does) is if something big happens and vader thinks obiwan is dead, that then allows them to kinda keep the meeting in a new hope on track (doesn't fix the vader master and apprentice line) 

 

There might just be a spanner in the works of our argument, that has stretched back many pages.  In that the likelihood there could be other seasons to go with this one.  So that line you refer to in Episode IV might not even be finished in this season.  By the time they have told the story, the line will still be true.  However I would imagine Obi-Wan will prevail using the flawed character traits of Anakin and his wits, rather than over powering him.

 

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On 28/05/2022 at 13:15, 54_and_counting said:
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Only laughable bit is obi wan, ex jedi master being outran by a fucking ten year old lassie across rooftops lol

 

Spoiler

I am a wee bit annoyed at how badly Obi-Wan has deteriorated. I mean I know he's been in hiding etc but ffs.

 

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Posted (edited)
Quote

 

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Obviously it doesn't fit in with the "Look! A plot hole!" stuff that we all need to get involved in but...

...regardless of their meeting in this series "When I left you I was but the learner; Now I am the master" still holds true. He does say "We meet again" in A New Hope but that obviously isn't the same as saying "When we last met I was a learner". I don't really see the issue.

I'm not overly enamoured with the prospect of a second series though. There's too much content.

 

Edited by yoda
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Posted (edited)

I made my peace with the fact that Star Wars, Empire and Jedi are the only films in the 'Star Wars Universe' I actually like a long time ago (in a galaxy far, far away) but ever the optimist I gave Obi Wan a go and...nah, it's just not for me.

Edited by capt_oats
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On 06/06/2022 at 11:41, yoda said:
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Obviously it doesn't fit in with the "Look! A plot hole!" stuff that we all need to get involved in but...

...regardless of their meeting in this series "When I left you I was but the learner; Now I am the master" still holds true. He does say "We meet again" in A New Hope but that obviously isn't the same as saying "When we last met I was a learner". I don't really see the issue.

I'm not overly enamoured with the prospect of a second series though. There's too much content.

 

I agree. I don't think the 'When I left you...' line is particularly problematic for this series. All you need to do is look at it from a...  certain point of view.

Firstly, just think of it as Vader specifically referring to when he turned from the Jedi and Obi-Wan. That absolutely does not have to be the last time they met.

For me when you accept that take on the line it allows you to see just how insecure Anakin still is under all that armour - and how little he's actually learned by Episode IV. That armour may help him to terrify the galaxy, but he's stuck inside it for a reason. He chose to rant that Obi-Wan underestimated his power rather than heed his clear warning about the high ground. Within moments his limbs were hacked off, the rest of his body was on fire.

With this series he's now also failed to kill Obi-Wan in their first meeting since the battle on Mustafar. Given that smart money is on us seeing another confrontation between them before this series finishes, he'll have failed at least twice by A New Hope.

So the 'When I left you line' works as Vader basically making excuses for why Obi-Wan has survived long enough to even have this confrontation. He's effectively retconning multiple failures to kill his former master, particularly his first and greatest defeat. Back then - and by implication any subsequent encounters they've had before Ep. IV - he was still learning the power of the dark side.

He may be a master now, but the fact he needs to assert it at all is... revealing. Plus, Vader still only eventually wins because Obi-Wan surrenders.

Ultimately, I personally don't think this series has introduced anything so far that really contradicts or undermines the Obi-Wan/Vader duel in Ep. IV. As someone else pointed out on the previous page, the real irreconcilable problem this series looks set to cause for A New Hope increasingly lies in Leia's famous message to Obi-Wan, as well as her lack of reaction to his death.

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I made my peace with the fact that Star Wars, Empire and Jedi are the only films in the 'Star Wars Universe' I actually like a long time ago (in a galaxy far, far away) but ever the optimist I gave Obi Wan a go and...nah, it's just not for me.
Rogue One and the Mandalorian have both been decent from Disney but largely feel the same as you.

I thought episode 3 was awful, not seen 4 yet.

Obi Wan has to be led the entire episode. I just don't see how you get from this useless coward back to the version we see in a New Hope in 3 episodes.

The episode is so poorly edited as well. From the stormtroopers mentioning its a long way to their destination to jumping off the vehicle two seconds later.

Obi Wan killing 4 or 5 stormtroopers easily just to immediately give up when confronted with the same number just to move the plot forward.

The escape tunnel is only showing as a linear path yet Reva somehow gets ahead of Leia and doesn't bump into the Imperial working as a spy.

Darth Vader putting out the flames first time but incapable of doing it a second time and instead watches a droid walking in slowmo pick up Obi Wan
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27 minutes ago, Jack Burton said:

Rogue One and the Mandalorian have both been decent from Disney but largely feel the same as you.

I thought episode 3 was awful, not seen 4 yet.

Obi Wan has to be led the entire episode. I just don't see how you get from this useless coward back to the version we see in a New Hope in 3 episodes.

The episode is so poorly edited as well. From the stormtroopers mentioning its a long way to their destination to jumping off the vehicle two seconds later.

Obi Wan killing 4 or 5 stormtroopers easily just to immediately give up when confronted with the same number just to move the plot forward.

The escape tunnel is only showing as a linear path yet Reva somehow gets ahead of Leia and doesn't bump into the Imperial working as a spy.

Darth Vader putting out the flames first time but incapable of doing it a second time and instead watches a droid walking in slowmo pick up Obi Wan emoji23.png

Given how strong vader is with the force, you have to wonder why, when the spy set the ground on fire, vader simply didn't force grab obi wan and drag him through the flames lol

Also, obi wan is clearly reverted to an utter wuss, but within the next 7 or 8 years, while growing older, he is able to comfortably kill Darth maul (in rebels), the same maul who, at the end of clone wars when order 66 happened, was probably just as strong, if not stronger than vader with the force

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1 hour ago, 54_and_counting said:

Given how strong vader is with the force, you have to wonder why, when the spy set the ground on fire, vader simply didn't force grab obi wan and drag him through the flames lol

I think he's perfectly capable of stopping Obi-Wan's rescue. He chooses to let him go. Whatever his reasons, Vader's clearly furious at himself, judging by the way he's writhing about in the bacta tank and the way he lashes out at Reva when he thinks she's lost them in the latest episode.

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I really didn't think they could top the Leia chase scene but fair fucks to them they've managed it in episode 4.

The episodes are just so poorly shot and nonsensical that it completely over shadows any decent parts of the show.

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