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Independence - how would you vote?

Independence - how would you vote  

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Amusingly, in a hoist by one's own petard way, from the article that you skipped your morning bowl of cornflakes to post here, :-

. There would be an expectation that an independent Scotland would take on an equitable share of national debt, to be negotiated.

“The continuing UK would need to seek to ensure that a fair settlement applied to assets and liabilities.

Oh dear!

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Exactly thats why its good to see the article,in a murdoch paper aswell

Thing is, this isn't even true.

It would be like starting divorce negotiations with "well, if i don't get the Milli Vanilli signed poster, then i'll walk outside and shit on the front lawn. That'll show you". Well, it will show the neighbours that you are a lunatic, yes. And we both know you won't actually do it, so what are you taking about?

What the SNP should be doing is finding the most advantageous way of splitting the debt and building a case based on that, be it population, GDP etc. In fact, i'm sure this is exactly what they are doing. Just in case the great referendum miracle of 2014 comes to pass.

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Yep, spot the difference. This needs to go up billboards pronto.

The Tories want to be tougher on welfare

Labour want to be tougher on welfare.

The Tories want to be tougher on immigration.

Labour want to be tougher on immigration.

The Tories want to introduce means-testing for more benefits.

Labour want to introduce means-testing for more benefits.

The Tories want to end free tuition in Scotland.

Labour want to end free tuition in Scotland.

The Tories support workfare and want to extend it.

Labour support workfare and want to extend it.

The Tory plan for cutting the deficit is a decade of brutal austerity.

The Labour plan for cutting the deficit is a decade of brutal austerity.

The Tories want to spend tens of billions replacing Trident.

Labour want to spend tens of billions replacing Trident.

The Tories introduced the bedroom tax for social rented tenants.

Labour introduced the bedroom tax for private rented tenants.

(And refuse to say they'll abolish it.)

The Tories don't plan to reintroduce the 50p income tax rate.

Labour don't plan to reintroduce the 50p income tax rate.

The Tories have vague, non-specific, non-committal plans for devolution which offer more responsibilities rather than more powers, and which aren't supported by the party's Westminster MPs or leadership.

Labour have vague, non-specific, non-committal plans for devolution which offer more responsibilities rather than more powers, and which aren't supported by the party's Westminster MPs or leadership.

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Once again, with regard to our pet lawyers, I refer to my signature.

How is it "derailing" to, uh, answer your questions?

Please provide a response to post 7500. You asked me the questions, and I had the decency to answer them. Don't pretend that post doesn't exist as a pathetic attempt to keep peddling the same myth, please.

Edited by Ad Lib

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How is it "derailing" to, uh, answer your questions?

Please provide a response to post 7500. You asked me the questions, and I had the decency to answer them. Don't pretend that post doesn't exist as a pathetic attempt to keep peddling the same myth, please.

Round and round we go. Face it, the Lib Dem Better Together group as well as the UK Government have made it clear. Some of the debt, none of the assets, and of course, we get to keep *some* of our sea. They might have dressed it up in flowery language, but thats what it boils down to.

Unless of course, we are NOT going to be a new state?

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I know you are reapeating this drivel for amusement, as even you know it is complete and utter bullshit, but just to continue with the charade, what is "flowery" about :-

"“The continuing UK would need to seek to ensure that a fair settlement applied to assets and liabilities."

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Yip scrambling

Perhaps you can outline how exactly this rubbish is relevant for negoatioations between NewScotland and the United Kingdom?

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Round and round we go. Face it, the Lib Dem Better Together group as well as the UK Government have made it clear. Some of the debt, none of the assets, and of course, we get to keep *some* of our sea. They might have dressed it up in flowery language, but thats what it boils down to.

Unless of course, we are NOT going to be a new state?

You are a cesspit sir. A cesspit.

I provided specific examples of the sort of "share of the assets" we would get. I've explained why some things ARE assets but other things are named state specific rights, thus not "assets". Engage with that.

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You know, this almost makes me pine for chicmac's return.

At least he was amusing.

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Nice to see the bitters scrambling on a sunday morning

To be fair, Ad Lib supports independence. So he says.

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To be fair, Ad Lib supports independence. So he says.

You didn't answer the question.

What is "flowery" about :-

"“The continuing UK would need to seek to ensure that a fair settlement applied to assets and liabilities."

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To add to the list of unanswered questions by xbl, what is "flowery" about anything I said in post 7500.

Explain to me why what I said in any way boils down to "none of the assets".

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Oooohh Flowery is todays buzzword

Well it is just that. A buzzword. Because xbl has no argument here. He is wrong. Completely wrong. And he knows he can't engage with the actual points made against his claims because he has no answer.

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Which in keeping with this thread means that he will disappear for a while and come back with "Anyway, we've been told we are getting none of the assets, so why SHOULD we take on the debt" in a couple of days time.

Predictable as it is pointless. I guess a sign that this thread has pretty much played itself out at this stage.

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Up until now all the chat about the share of the debt has been "The most equitable way to decide on the share of debt is population share." as the starting point in any negotiation.

I don't disagree with that, but it's not where the negotiation would start. Since it's unlikely that Scotland will want to keep a nuclear submarine, or demand that an equitable share by value of the contents of the British museums/art galleries be redistributed, it's highly likely that the debt will be lower than the rUK by population share.

Actually, maybe we should demand that art thing.

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