H_B Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 I don't get this excuse that people 'need' to know more. It really only comes down to whether you believe the decisions about Scotland should be taken by the people living in Scotland. If you don't then it's up to you to tell us why and articulate what "Better Together" means. People will try and justify it by asking impossible questions of the Yes campaign about the future but won't ask have the slightest idea of what Westminster's intentions are. The "too many unanswered questions" excuse just doesn't hold. Agree that the polls are largely meaningless though... Any chance of you coming back to a question of some pages ago. Namely why you felt the poll here is "telling"? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 You can take polls with a "pinch of salt" and each side will always put their own "spin" on them as is their want, but I do think if the "yes" campaign will do well to get 40% in the referendum vote anyway I think they'll do a little better than 40%. You're removing the don't knows and the von't votes (well, ignoring the few tenths of a percent who will spoil their ballot paper or otherwise f**k it up. As I've said before, we are just skirting round the edges of the defeat in the next 12 months. For the Nationalists it's about making it respectable. Anyone from the Yes side like to pick a number in the 40s they would consider a good result for the Yes campaign. I think if they could get something close to 46 or 47 % they will feel they have won a watch. I think Salmond and co would take 47% if you offered them it right now. It saves humiliation. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Nah, canna see them reaching the high 40's , the sides that is lagging behind always claims a high percentage of the "don't knows" that's normal politics, I think Salmond would take 42 or 43% as a no bad result 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bula Bairn Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Any chance of you coming back to a question of some pages ago. Namely why you felt the poll here is "telling"? Unlike most, it just asks the question with no preamble, selective group or leading questions before it. It's also at odds with the msm telling us that the vast majority of young people will be voting No. It also tells us that most people who have read up on the subject online will be voting Yes - in the next year more and more people will ditch the print media (circulations falling weekly) and read up online, which is telling... You'll probably come back with the number of aliases on here but I'm not sure that would account for such a lead?? Any chance you can explain what "Better Together" means for Scotland? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Nah, canna see them reaching the high 40's , the sides that is lagging behind always claims a high percentage of the "don't knows" that's normal politics, I think Salmond would take 42 or 43% as a no bad result Look, turnout isn't going to be 100%. It'll be a miracle if turnout gets to 70%, so we can eliminate 30%+ of the electorate straight away. Of the, lets say 65% remaining, the Yes campaign are going to have the more motivated voters, because they want change and have something to aim for, so lets just say that the hardcore 30% of the remaining 65% are going to vote Yes. Of the No vote, they have a similar size base, but they are so negative that they are working on keeping their base scared, and the voice of status quo is going to be less motivated to turn out (my opinion, much like yours and HB's opinions), so lets say that they get their 30% base. When you get rid of the apathetic and the lazy, who will overwhelming be nominal no voters due to a lack of engagement, then you actually only need to convert a few don't knows to Yes to get a win. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tamboyd Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Turnout will be 75%-80% imo. I predict the outcome will be Yes 49% N0 51% 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 75% to 80% that's about what I think, but cant see the result being as close as that, think 59% to 41% to keep the union, 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrysnotter Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Am i imagining things or did NewsNet Scotland actually publish a scathing article on a Better Together staff member because he had the audacity to comment on Ricky Burns getting "pumped" last night? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Bully Posted September 8, 2013 Author Share Posted September 8, 2013 Am i imagining things or did NewsNet Scotland actually publish a scathing article on a Better Together staff member because he had the audacity to comment on Ricky Burns getting "pumped" last night? You are not imagining it, but you are missing (perhaps deliberately) the point of the posting. I suspect the point is that he posted that RB was almost inevitably going to get pumped after a "three verse Flower of Scotland". 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kejan Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 I'll go with turnout about 70% Yes 44 No 56 Hope I'm wrong regards the result. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mushroom Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 When you get rid of the apathetic and the lazy, who will overwhelming be nominal no voters due to a lack of engagement, then you actually only need to convert a few don't knows to Yes to get a win. On seeing the word "only" there, I kind of feel the need to watch for complacency. Sure a yes vote is achievable and we shouldn't be letting the feart tell us it isn't, but there is much work ahead to get people thinking about this rationally. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
barrysnotter Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 You are not imagining it, but you are missing (perhaps deliberately) the point of the posting. I suspect the point is that he posted that RB was almost inevitably going to get pumped after a "three verse Flower of Scotland". So, what is the point? What's the story? Do you really think the guy was genuinely saying that Burns' poor showing was linked to the anthem performance? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 So, what is the point? What's the story? Its a bit of an irrelevant story imo. We already know that the Unionists hate the idea of Scotland succeeding. It isn't adding anything new. We all know about the MO of project fear. This is just a bit of a weak example. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Incidentally, its interesting that Westminster has the power to sack MSPs that it doesn't like. In the case of that guy who has finally resigned, would it not be more logical to give Scotland the power rather than London? Barry? Surely this is more relevant? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 Incidentally, its interesting that Westminster has the power to sack MSPs that it doesn't like. In the case of that guy who has finally resigned, would it not be more logical to give Scotland the power rather than London? Barry? Surely this is more relevant? "Westminster" has the power to do anything, as a matter of law. The issue here is that the Scottish Parliament can only kick out MSPs in accordance with the Scotland Act (as amended) and the rules concerning the disqualification of an MSP is encompassed by reserved matters. I think the "logic" is that the Scottish Parliament shouldn't have the power to (hypothetically) subvert the electoral system by kicking out elected representatives by passing laws which could exclude them. Of course that logic is found hugely wanting when you consider that the UK Parliament can do exactly this with MPs. Powers concerning administration like this really should be devolved. -1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted September 8, 2013 Share Posted September 8, 2013 So essentially there is no logical reason why this shouldn't be devolved. Well the Scottish government have apparently requested the powers to be devolved. So that should be a routine matter, right? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr.Bojangles Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 (edited) I think we've found a good candidate for the mostly meaningless unlabelled jam tomorrow. Doesn't really achieve much, will rarely be of use and an example of when it would be useful would be fairly fresh in the memory with the added bonus that they can attack the SNP with it in the run up to the general election. Edited September 9, 2013 by Mr.Bojangles 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Rational Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lord Ashcroft has a 7 month poll out today that is saying that Indy is at an all time low. I'm sure our resident statisticians will pour over it for the next 5 pages. Also, Unite are actually excelling at something. They never paid any tax in 2011 or 2012..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 Lord Ashcroft has a 7 month poll out today that is saying that Indy is at an all time low. I'm sure our resident statisticians will pour over it for the next 5 pages. Also, Unite are actually excelling at something. They never paid any tax in 2011 or 2012..... Its pretty much what you've been told. Scots will firmly reject independence, but they have no problem voting for the SNP in the diddy parliament. We are a quite a canny lot really. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Rational Posted September 9, 2013 Share Posted September 9, 2013 If tge polls are correct, we appear to have a problem with the word 'independence' more than anything. We want Holyrood to make all decisions about Scotland which to me is independence, we like the FM and we like the SNP but we have a problem with actually being independent. We just have to try and convert this into yes votes. Off topic, I'm in the weeg today on a works training day, George Square is being dug up. I take it the renovations are going on? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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