xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 No you didn't. Those stats you dug up were for...the present which has f**k all to do with what we were discussing. Why don't you go and read what I wrote and "school yourself". I'm not holding your hand through your special needs learnign session, do it form your fucking self and then come back and admit I was right all along. Or else tell us all why Swinney was voicing grave concerns in private and yet was wheeled out the very next day after the leak to tell ther Scottish public what his boss wanted them to hear? Nope, those stats were projected to 2035, the exact date you also used. Source of your stats? I provided my link to the official british stats. Where is your link? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Until you stop telling so many lies, you have lost the right to ask questions, just like Tryfield. I proved you wrong. Defend yourself or acknowledge it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demented Zebra Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 I was all for Independence, however now my mind is changing to stay with the Union and I hear the same thing from friends and family. The problem is I am hearing absolutely no substance for Independence. Today In the Scotland On Sunday I read Salmond saying if Rabbie Burns was alive today he would vote independence. FFS give me a break that is all I am hearing from the SNP nationalism with no substance. The Unionist debate from where I am standing is winning hands down at this moment. Here is hoping the nationalists are not relying on national pride during the Commonwealth Games to win votes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Airdrieonians. Do keep up. I think he was being overly generous. You are still Clydebank in the eyes of morality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 I was all for Independence, however now my mind is changing to stay with the Union and I hear the same thing from friends and family. The problem is I am hearing absolutely no substance for Independence. Today In the Scotland On Sunday I read Salmond saying if Rabbie Burns was alive today he would vote independence. FFS give me a break that is all I am hearing from the SNP nationalism with no substance. The Unionist debate from where I am standing is winning hands down at this moment. Here is hoping the nationalists are not relying on national pride during the Commonwealth Games to win votes. Exactly what detail do you want? Or is this an excuse to disguise your fear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Incidentally, the Sunday Herald apparently shreds the no campaign today, and also reveals that some of those within the campaign call it "Project Fear". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 I was all for Independence, however now my mind is changing to stay with the Union and I hear the same thing from friends and family. The problem is I am hearing absolutely no substance for Independence. Today In the Scotland On Sunday I read Salmond saying if Rabbie Burns was alive today he would vote independence. FFS give me a break that is all I am hearing from the SNP nationalism with no substance. The Unionist debate from where I am standing is winning hands down at this moment. Here is hoping the nationalists are not relying on national pride during the Commonwealth Games to win votes. What is it about the Unionist debate that sounds so attractive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Demented Zebra Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Exactly what detail do you want? Or is this an excuse to disguise your fear? Tax levels Pensions Welfare Sate UK debt What is going to happen to our banking sector given how close it is to London Really the financial side of things , would like to see the SNP concentrate on that side and really push it out to the public as I’m sure that’s what most of us want to know the bottom line. Also hearing conflicting views on keeping sterling with the no camp saying we can’t keep Sterling. With my limited knowledge on that I’m sure keeping Sterling is the right thing to do for trade within these islands. Maybe I am wrong but dose Westminster not say we cannot have Sterling? Don’t see Europe being a problem for sure we will be welcome into the EU. There are things I know would be good for Independence controlling your own destiny locally is no bad thing but it’s the finance side I would like to hear more of. How to balance the books and invest at the same time. For sure the Union will not let North sea oil revenue go easily. How can we control that. A lot of questions ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Incidentally, the Sunday Herald apparently shreds the no campaign today, and also reveals that some of those within the campaign call it "Project Fear". Quite liked Gordon's summary of the whole thing: "In other words, Better Together will set the SNP a series of impossible tests. And then fail them" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pink Freud Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 I was all for Independence, however now my mind is changing to stay with the Union and I hear the same thing from friends and family. The problem is I am hearing absolutely no substance for Independence. Today In the Scotland On Sunday I read Salmond saying if Rabbie Burns was alive today he would vote independence. FFS give me a break that is all I am hearing from the SNP nationalism with no substance. The Unionist debate from where I am standing is winning hands down at this moment. Here is hoping the nationalists are not relying on national pride during the Commonwealth Games to win votes. That's a rather bizarre bit of reckoning. Independence is simply a starting point - a point where your vote will be a worthwhile one regarding the future shape of your country. Now, don't get me wrong, I find xbl, Swampy and many others on the Yes side teeth gnashingly annoying with their constant denigration of those choosing to vote no. There are so many unknowns, and for those of you (I live in England and have no intention of moving back to Scotland) who have legitimate fears and concerns, it's reasonable to be cautious. But that's the question - what have you seen from Westminster that makes you think that it's a choice of the status quo (Union) or things getting worse (Independence)? Honestly, to me the lower risk for you and your family is a yes vote. I was a pretty convinced unionist from the emotional perspective, and will still be sad to see it go, but from the perspective of Scotland's future, I can see nothing happening at Westminster other than the entrenchment of London business and Home Counties voters' ideals. Better Together? We haven't been together for decades politically, arguably ever. Scotland has a chance to thrive. That chance dies with a no vote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Tax levels Pensions Welfare Sate UK debt What is going to happen to our banking sector given how close it is to London Really the financial side of things , would like to see the SNP concentrate on that side and really push it out to the public as Im sure thats what most of us want to know the bottom line. Also hearing conflicting views on keeping sterling with the no camp saying we cant keep Sterling. With my limited knowledge on that Im sure keeping Sterling is the right thing to do for trade within these islands. Maybe I am wrong but dose Westminster not say we cannot have Sterling? Dont see Europe being a problem for sure we will be welcome into the EU. There are things I know would be good for Independence controlling your own destiny locally is no bad thing but its the finance side I would like to hear more of. How to balance the books and invest at the same time. For sure the Union will not let North sea oil revenue go easily. How can we control that. A lot of questions ? What about tax levels and pensions if we stay in the union? It depends on the government we elect. Just like independence! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Tax levels Pensions Welfare Sate UK debt What is going to happen to our banking sector given how close it is to London Really the financial side of things , would like to see the SNP concentrate on that side and really push it out to the public as I’m sure that’s what most of us want to know the bottom line. Also hearing conflicting views on keeping sterling with the no camp saying we can’t keep Sterling. With my limited knowledge on that I’m sure keeping Sterling is the right thing to do for trade within these islands. Maybe I am wrong but dose Westminster not say we cannot have Sterling? Don’t see Europe being a problem for sure we will be welcome into the EU. There are things I know would be good for Independence controlling your own destiny locally is no bad thing but it’s the finance side I would like to hear more of. How to balance the books and invest at the same time. For sure the Union will not let North sea oil revenue go easily. How can we control that. A lot of questions ? Taxes will be set by the government in power - exactly as they are now in the UK. Scotland will have pensions, yes. ...and a welfare state too. Our debt will be negotiated with the UK government and based on a population percentage. Somewhere around 8.9% of the total. Our deficit, based on UK govet. figures, will be lower than the UKs so we should have a good chance of paying it off at some point. Unlike the UK. Not sure what your point about the banking sector is, it's always been that close to London. As for keeping Sterling, the UK doesn't have much choice. If we become independent then a monetary union using the pound is as an attractive choice for the UK as it is for us. They can't really refuse to let us use the pound, it's a freely tradeable currency. Anybody can use it. Under international and marine law the resources off our coasts and in our waters are ours, they can't dispute that. They can stamp their feet and hold their breath until they turn blue, but the oil is ours. To me the Unionist case is just a bunch of veiled threats and childish petulance. There's no positive case for the union left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Of course they are going on national pride, why do you think we are having it in 2014, also have you noticed how often Salmond makes important announcements, on days that mean something to Scots, St Andrews Day, Burns Night for example Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Of course they are going on national pride, why do you think we are having it in 2014 Do tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Incidentally, if the referendum had neen in 2008, then you would have voted no on the basis of a completely different level of vat and different tax bands. Too much uncertainty? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Good grief, 700 hundred years since Bannockburn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enigma Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Good grief, 700 hundred years since Bannockburn I Know! I remember it as if it were yesterday... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Baxter Parp Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Good grief, 700 hundred years since Bannockburn 24 June 1314, not 18th September. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecto Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 It could not have been on the 24th June that would have been to obvious, but it will be part of the events celebrating Bannockburn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted June 23, 2013 Share Posted June 23, 2013 Good grief, 700 hundred years since Bannockburn Why do you think it was to do with Bannockburn? Why not to celebrate the start of ww1? Or to take advantage of the commonwealth games? Or the ryder cup? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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