Independence - how would you vote?

[Saor Alba]

List of UK Prime Ministers

The following UK Prime Ministers attended university at either Oxford or Cambridge. Thus, of the 55 Prime Ministers to date, 41 studied at Oxbridge, That's very near 4 in 5.

11 did not go to university, and only 3, Earl Russell, Neville Chamberlain, and Gordon Brown, went to other universities (Edinburgh, Birmingham and Edinburgh respectively).

PM PM dates College

Robert Walpole 1721-1742 King's, Cambridge

Earl of Wilmington 1742-1743 Trinity, Oxford

Henry Pelham 1743-1746 Hart Hall, Oxford

Earl of Bath 1746 Christ Church, Oxford

Duke of Newcastle 1754-1756 Clare, Cambridge

George Grenville 1763-1765 Christ Church, Oxford

Marquess of Rockingham 1765-1766, 1782 St John's, Cambridge

Earl of Chatham 1766-1768 Trinity, Oxford

Duke of Grafton 1768-1770 Peterhouse, Cambridge

Lord North 1770-1782 Trinity, Oxford

Earl of Shelburne 1782-1783 Christ Church, Oxford

Duke of Portland 1783, 1807-1809 Christ Church, Oxford

William Pitt 1783-1801, 1804-1806 Pembroke, Cambridge

Henry Addington 1801-1804 Brasenose, Oxford

Baron Grenville 1806-1807 Christ Church, Oxford

Spencer Perceval 1809-1812 Trinity, Cambridge

Earl of Liverpool 1812-1827 Christ Church, Oxford

George Canning 1827 Christ Church, Oxford

Viscount Goderich 1827-1828 St John's, Cambridge

Earl Grey 1830-1834 Trinity, Cambridge

Viscount Melbourne 1834 Trinity, Cambridge

Robert Peel 1841-1846 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Derby 1852, 1858-1859, 1866-1868 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Aberdeen 1852-1855 St John's, Cambridge

Viscount Palmerston 1855-1858, 1859-1865 St John's, Cambridge

William Gladstone 1868-1874, 1880-1885, 1886, 1892-1894 Christ Church, Oxford

Marquess of Salisbury 1885-1886, 1886-1892, 1895-1902 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Rosebery 1894-1895 Christ Church, Oxford

Arthur Balfour 1902-1905 Trinity, Cambridge

Henry Campbell-Bannerman 1905-1908 Trinity, Cambridge

Herbert Asquith 1908-1916 Balliol, Oxford

Stanley Baldwin 1923-1924, 1924-1929, 1935-1937 Trinity, Cambridge

Clement Atlee 1945-1951 University, Oxford

Anthony Eden 1955-1957 Christ Church, Oxford

Harold Macmillan 1957-1963 Balliol, Oxford

Alec Douglas-Home 1963-1964 Christ Church, Oxford

Harold Wilson 1964-1970, 1974-1976 Jesus, Oxford

Edward Heath 1970-1974 Balliol, Oxford

Margaret Thatcher 1979-1990 Somerville, Oxford

Tony Blair 1997-2007 St John's, Oxford

David Cameron 2010- Brasenose, Oxford

14 attended Cambridge (including 6 at Trinity), and 27 attended Oxford (including 14 at Christ Church). For more info on UK Prime Ministers, try Wikipedia.

[ Source: http://www.blanchflower.org/alumni/pm.html ]

List of Old Etonian Prime Ministers

19 UK Prime Ministers (including David Cameron) were educated at Eton as well as elsewhere. That's more than 1 in 3 in the history of the UK.

Robert Walpole 1721-1742

John Stuart, 3rd Earl of Bute 1762–1763

George Grenville, 1763-65

William Pitt the Elder, 1st Earl of Chatham 1766-1768

Frederick North, 2nd Earl of Guildford 1770–1782

William Grenville 1806–1807

George Canning 1827

Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington 1828–1830 & 1834

Charles Grey, 2nd Earl Grey 1830–1834

William Lamb, 2nd Viscount Melbourne 1834 & 1835–1841

Edward Smith-Stanley, 14th Earl of Derby 1852, 1858–1859 & 1866–1868

William Gladstone 1868–1874, 1880–1885, 1886 & 1892–1894

Robert Cecil, 3rd Marquess of Salisbury 1885–1886, 1886–1892 & 1895–1902

Archibald Primrose, 5th Earl of Rosebery 1894–1895

Arthur Balfour, 1st Earl of Balfour 1902-1905

Anthony Eden 1955–1957

Harold Macmillan, 1st Earl of Stockton 1957–1963

Alec Douglas-Home 1963-1964

David Cameron 2010-

[ Source: http://nickcleggsfault.blogspot.co.uk/2010/05/list-of-old-etonian-prime-ministers.html ]

It would be interesting to know how many UK Deputy Prime Ministers and Mayors of London as well as other high heads of Westminster (London) governments AND opposition party leaders have attended Oxford, Cambridge and Eton wouldn't it?

Example:

Nicholas William Peter "Nick" Clegg (born 7 January 1967) is a British politician who has been Deputy Prime Minister of the United Kingdom and Lord President of the Council (with special responsibility for political and constitutional reform) since 2010. He attended the University of Cambridge.

Edward Samuel Miliband (born 24 December 1969) is a British Labour Party politician, currently the Leader of the Labour Party and Leader of the Opposition. Born in London, Miliband graduated from Corpus Christi College, Oxford.

Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson (born 19 June 1964) is a British Conservative Party politician, who has served as Mayor of London since 2008. He was educated at the European School in Brussels, at Ashdown House School and at Eton College, where he was a King's Scholar. And graduated from Oxford.

Surprise, Surprise, Surprise!

Do you believe that Westminster (London Rule) is best for Scotland? If you do, maybe you ought to Think Again!

[Swampy]

As much as I'm pro-independence, I don't think the fact that elites gravitate towards power is a compelling reason for it. The same will happen in an independent Scotland, just as it happens in most liberal democracies. You could argue, I guess, that the likes of Edinburgh are at least closer to the average reality for people than is Oxbridge, but either way there's likely to be a considerable opportunity and achievement gap between a PM and the average citizen no matter what.

The institutional structure of the Scottish Parliament is a much better reason. It is infinitely superior to the juvenile, late-medieval nonsense of Westminster. That plus the simple, undeniable fact that Scotland is different by most demographic measures.

[xbl]

Im inclined to agree with Swampy. I don't think the fact that a lot of prime ministers went to Oxford or Cambridge is of all that much relevance.

[Saor Alba]

As much as I'm pro-independence, I don't think the fact that elites gravitate towards power is a compelling reason for it. The same will happen in an independent Scotland, just as it happens in most liberal democracies. You could argue, I guess, that the likes of Edinburgh are at least closer to the average reality for people than is Oxbridge, but either way there's likely to be a considerable opportunity and achievement gap between a PM and the average citizen no matter what.

The institutional structure of the Scottish Parliament is a much better reason. It is infinitely superior to the juvenile, late-medieval nonsense of Westminster. That plus the simple, undeniable fact that Scotland is different by most demographic measures.

Sweet. I agree on all of your points with the exception of your belief that "the same will happen in an independent Scotland". However, I do accept that to a small extent that it will do so, just not to anywhere near "the same" extent as has gone on in the so-called UK under the rule of the Oxbridge/Eton Mafia which has favoured London and the South of England always to the detriment of the rest of the so-called UK. The Oxbridge/Etonian Mafia have always used the divide and rule tactic across the entire so-called UK and that is the one and only reason why they have gotten away with all of their frauds and deceptions for so many centuries. That and the fact that their divide and rule tactics ensured that large numbers of disgruntled Scots, Welsh, Irish and Northern English marching upon Westminster to protest has never have been possible. I honestly don't believe that a Scottish government in an Independent Scotland, a small nation, would ever attempt to divide its people for the benefit of a small few knowing that such foolish actions would not be beneficial to anyone in Scotland including the children, grandchildren and relatives of any government attempting such doings.

[Saor Alba]

Im inclined to agree with Swampy. I don't think the fact that a lot of prime ministers went to Oxford or Cambridge is of all that much relevance.

Seriously?

You don't think that the fact that very close to 80% of them have attended Oxbridge and 35% of them have attended Eton is of all that much relevance in regards to how the so-called UK as a whole has been divided and ruled over during the past few centuries?

In the lands of the blind the moneyed men (and women) really are kings (and queens), and no bloody wonder when they find it so easy to deceive the people of those lands.

[ecto]

1. I am not convinced that as a single nation we can generate enough monies to keep taxes as at a affordable level,and retain a decent level of services

2. Not sure Europe will welcome us with open arms, as is being suggested

3 Not convinced we will be an attractive place for big companies to come and set up, or in fact to keep the companies that are already here

4 Not convinced we can become strong enough to retain the best people here, and fend off a "brain drain"

5 Its a hard world when you are on the outside looking in, at least we are at the moment on the inside

6 In 30 years time I do not want us to be a 2011 "Ireland"

It always makes me think, there was a vote in 1979, if we had said "yes" then would we currently be Norway, Denmark or in fact would we be Ireland

As much as the "yes" campaign can "crank" it up, since the announcement of the vote, support for independence in the polls have hardly shifted, even as we get closer to the vote, lucky if 35% vote for independence, will be interested to see after the vote, what the SNP see as an embarrassment of a result

[Reynard]

1. I am not convinced that as a single nation we can generate enough monies to keep taxes as at a affordable level,and retain a decent level of services

2. Not sure Europe will welcome us with open arms, as is being suggested

3 Not convinced we will be an attractive place for big companies to come and set up, or in fact to keep the companies that are already here

4 Not convinced we can become strong enough to retain the best people here, and fend off a "brain drain"

5 Its a hard world when you are on the outside looking in, at least we are at the moment on the inside

6 In 30 years time I do not want us to be a 2011 "Ireland"

It always makes me think, there was a vote in 1979, if we had said "yes" then would we currently be Norway, Denmark or in fact would we be Ireland

As much as the "yes" campaign can "crank" it up, since the announcement of the vote, support for independence in the polls have hardly shifted, even as we get closer to the vote, lucky if 35% vote for independence, will be interested to see after the vote, what the SNP see as an embarrassment of a result

You are about to be hit with a few SNP activist clowns with puckered fundaments telling you that you are 1. scaremongering 2. Talking Scotland down. 3. Accusing us of being too wee too poor.

There may be others I have forgotten about, but that covers more or less everything.

[Reynard]

Seriously?

You don't think that the fact that very close to 80% of them have attended Oxbridge and 35% of them have attended Eton is of all that much relevance in regards to how the so-called UK as a whole has been divided and ruled over during the past few centuries?

In the lands of the blind the moneyed men (and women) really are kings (and queens), and no bloody wonder when they find it so easy to deceive the people of those lands.

You're an arsehole.

Oxford and Cambridge are generally seen as being the best universities, where the most talented people congregate.

The last two genuinely working class people to be Prime Minister in this country were Margaret Thatcher and John Major. Possibly ever Broon, although his background is the manse so you could argue there was some status there back in the day in this country.

Your background is not necessarily going to hold you back, but lack of decent education will. And the bulk of it has been smashed up by leftist government which will, in turn, mean that ordinary people will be held back. Scotland used to have an education system that other countries copied. Now it is shite. That alone will hold back talented people from ordinary backgrounds.

And Scotland is not going to vote for independence. cots have already seen through the SNP and its abysmal campaign. The majority of people are not thick weans on a football site with nothing to lose.

[ecto]

Got a thick skin and broad shoulders, I don't think I am talking Scotland down, based on the campaign so far I cannot find a reason to be optimistic about being an independent nation

[Reynard]

List of UK Prime Ministers

The following UK Prime Ministers attended university at either Oxford or Cambridge. Thus, of the 55 Prime Ministers to date, 41 studied at Oxbridge, That's very near 4 in 5.

11 did not go to university, and only 3, Earl Russell, Neville Chamberlain, and Gordon Brown, went to other universities (Edinburgh, Birmingham and Edinburgh respectively).

PM PM dates College

Robert Walpole 1721-1742 King's, Cambridge

Earl of Wilmington 1742-1743 Trinity, Oxford

Henry Pelham 1743-1746 Hart Hall, Oxford

Earl of Bath 1746 Christ Church, Oxford

Duke of Newcastle 1754-1756 Clare, Cambridge

George Grenville 1763-1765 Christ Church, Oxford

Marquess of Rockingham 1765-1766, 1782 St John's, Cambridge

Earl of Chatham 1766-1768 Trinity, Oxford

Duke of Grafton 1768-1770 Peterhouse, Cambridge

Lord North 1770-1782 Trinity, Oxford

Earl of Shelburne 1782-1783 Christ Church, Oxford

Duke of Portland 1783, 1807-1809 Christ Church, Oxford

William Pitt 1783-1801, 1804-1806 Pembroke, Cambridge

Henry Addington 1801-1804 Brasenose, Oxford

Baron Grenville 1806-1807 Christ Church, Oxford

Spencer Perceval 1809-1812 Trinity, Cambridge

Earl of Liverpool 1812-1827 Christ Church, Oxford

George Canning 1827 Christ Church, Oxford

Viscount Goderich 1827-1828 St John's, Cambridge

Earl Grey 1830-1834 Trinity, Cambridge

Viscount Melbourne 1834 Trinity, Cambridge

Robert Peel 1841-1846 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Derby 1852, 1858-1859, 1866-1868 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Aberdeen 1852-1855 St John's, Cambridge

Viscount Palmerston 1855-1858, 1859-1865 St John's, Cambridge

William Gladstone 1868-1874, 1880-1885, 1886, 1892-1894 Christ Church, Oxford

Marquess of Salisbury 1885-1886, 1886-1892, 1895-1902 Christ Church, Oxford

Earl of Rosebery 1894-1895 Christ Church, Oxford

Arthur Balfour 1902-1905 Trinity, Cambridge

Henry Campbell-Bannerman 1905-1908 Trinity, Cambridge

Herbert Asquith 1908-1916 Balliol, Oxford

Stanley Baldwin 1923-1924, 1924-1929, 1935-1937 Trinity, Cambridge

Clement Atlee 1945-1951 University, Oxford

Anthony Eden 1955-1957 Christ Church, Oxford

Harold Macmillan 1957-1963 Balliol, Oxford

Alec Douglas-Home 1963-1964 Christ Church, Oxford

Harold Wilson 1964-1970, 1974-1976 Jesus, Oxford

Edward Heath 1970-1974 Balliol, Oxford

Margaret Thatcher 1979-1990 Somerville, Oxford

Tony Blair 1997-2007 St John's, Oxford

David Cameron 2010- Brasenose, Oxford

14 attended Cambridge (including 6 at Trinity), and 27 attended Oxford (including 14 at Christ Church). For more info on UK Prime Ministers, try Wikipedia.

[ Source: http://www.blanchflower.org/alumni/pm.html ]

List of Old Etonian Prime Ministers

19 UK Prime Ministers (including David Cameron) were educated at Eton as well as elsewhere. That's more than 1 in 3 in the history of the UK.

Robert Walpole 1721-1742

John Stuart, 3rd Earl of Bute 1762–1763

George Grenville, 1763-65

William Pitt the Elder, 1st Earl of Chatham 1766-1768

Frederick North, 2nd Earl of Guildford 1770–1782

William Grenville 1806–1807

George Canning 1827

Arthur Wellesley, 1st Duke of Wellington 1828–1830 & 1834

Charles Grey, 2nd Earl Grey 1830–1834

William Lamb, 2nd Viscount Melbourne 1834 & 1835–1841

Edward Smith-Stanley, 14th Earl of Derby 1852, 1858–1859 & 1866–1868

William Gladstone 1868–1874, 1880–1885, 1886 & 1892–1894

Robert Cecil, 3rd Marquess of Salisbury 1885–1886, 1886–1892 & 1895–1902

Archibald Primrose, 5th Earl of Rosebery 1894–1895

Arthur Balfour, 1st Earl of Balfour 1902-1905

Anthony Eden 1955–1957

Harold Macmillan, 1st Earl of Stockton 1957–1963

Alec Douglas-Home 1963-1964

David Cameron 2010-

[ Source: http://nickcleggsfault.blogspot.co.uk/2010/05/list-of-old-etonian-prime-ministers.html ]

It would be interesting to know how many UK Deputy Prime Ministers and Mayors of London as well as other high heads of Westminster (London) governments AND opposition party leaders have attended Oxford, Cambridge and Eton wouldn't it?

Example:

Nicholas William Peter "Nick" Clegg (born 7 January 1967) is a British politician who has been Deputy Prime Minister of the United Kingdom and Lord President of the Council (with special responsibility for political and constitutional reform) since 2010. He attended the University of Cambridge.

Edward Samuel Miliband (born 24 December 1969) is a British Labour Party politician, currently the Leader of the Labour Party and Leader of the Opposition. Born in London, Miliband graduated from Corpus Christi College, Oxford.

Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson (born 19 June 1964) is a British Conservative Party politician, who has served as Mayor of London since 2008. He was educated at the European School in Brussels, at Ashdown House School and at Eton College, where he was a King's Scholar. And graduated from Oxford.

Surprise, Surprise, Surprise!

Do you believe that Westminster (London Rule) is best for Scotland? If you do, maybe you ought to Think Again!

It would be more interesting to see how many folk rose to the top via the grammar school system, and how many comprehensive types, have done it.

I'm quite sure, in the deeply unlikely event of normal Scots buying any of the SNPs pish and actually voting to leap into the dark with them, that in thirty years time we will be whining about the St.Andrews elite or whatever.

The grammar school system was delivering excellence and was dismantled. THAT'S your issue. Not the fact that others did go to the best school in the land. Its the fact that ordinary people have been held back back the left and their shit policies.

[Reynard]

Got a thick skin and broad shoulders, I don't think I am talking Scotland down, based on the campaign so far I cannot find a reason to be optimistic about being an independent nation

You're not.

I was just predicting the response from our gaelic loving chums.

[Baxter Parp]

1. I am not convinced that as a single nation we can generate enough monies to keep taxes as at a affordable level,and retain a decent level of services

2. Not sure Europe will welcome us with open arms, as is being suggested

3 Not convinced we will be an attractive place for big companies to come and set up, or in fact to keep the companies that are already here

4 Not convinced we can become strong enough to retain the best people here, and fend off a "brain drain"

5 Its a hard world when you are on the outside looking in, at least we are at the moment on the inside

6 In 30 years time I do not want us to be a 2011 "Ireland"

It always makes me think, there was a vote in 1979, if we had said "yes" then would we currently be Norway, Denmark or in fact would we be Ireland

As much as the "yes" campaign can "crank" it up, since the announcement of the vote, support for independence in the polls have hardly shifted, even as we get closer to the vote, lucky if 35% vote for independence, will be interested to see after the vote, what the SNP see as an embarrassment of a result

1/ Scotland pays more taxes than it receives back from Westminster and Westminster insists on buying crap like nuclear bombs that Scotland doesn't particularly want. If we vote no, there will be nothing but more cuts and more misery, shouldn't we be allowed to spend our taxes on the stuff we think is important?

2/Why not? Would Europe really want to reject the vast resources of oil, gas and renewable power we have? Furthermore, the UK may well vote us out of Europe in a couple of years time anyway. Is that a chance you're willing to take?

3/With direct fiscal control we can make Scotland as attractive to businesses as we want. As it stands Scotland is getting more investment than it ever has and that's with the real prospect of independence on the horizon. There's no reason to believe that would change after a Yes vote.

4/ Again, I don't see why not. Look at Norway, it has no problem retaining its best people and it's got an oil fund that allows it to invest in development and technology that makes it an attractive option for any "brain".

5/Yeah, and the Tories want us to be on the outside.

6/In 30 years time I want us to be a 2011 Norway not a 2011 UK. Or even a 2013 UK. Or any kind of UK, it's done nothing for this country.

[YOGI IS GOD]

The Orange Lodge have now started their own "British Together" campaign - http://britishtogether.co.uk/

[Reynard]

1/ Scotland pays more taxes than it receives back from Westminster and Westminster insists on buying crap like nuclear bombs that Scotland doesn't particularly want. If we vote no, there will be nothing but more cuts and more misery, shouldn't we be allowed to spend our taxes on the stuff we think is important?

2/Why not? Would Europe really want to reject the vast resources of oil, gas and renewable power we have? Furthermore, the UK may well vote us out of Europe in a couple of years time anyway. Is that a chance you're willing to take?

3/With direct fiscal control we can make Scotland as attractive to businesses as we want. As it stands Scotland is getting more investment than it ever has and that's with the real prospect of independence on the horizon. There's no reason to believe that would change after a Yes vote.

4/ Again, I don't see why not. Look at Norway, it has no problem retaining its best people and it's got an oil fund that allows it to invest in development and technology that makes it an attractive option for any "brain".

5/Yeah, and the Tories want us to be on the outside.

6/In 30 years time I want us to be a 2011 Norway not a 2011 UK. Or even a 2013 UK. Or any kind of UK, it's done nothing for this country.

1.No it doesn't.

The Scottish governments own GERs report confirms this.

2. Good to know that as I predicted, oil and gas will be given away to Brussels as part of the bargaining process. Ask yourself why Norway and Iceland have decided not to give up control of their two main assets to join the EU? Oil/.fish. The SNP will happily sell us down the fucking swanny so their politicians can get their snouts in the tax free trough of Brussels.

3. We won't have fiscal control under the SNP proposals. The UK central bank will be deciding those for an independent Scotland. Its highly unlikely they will then allow Scotland to undercut the UKs corporation tax rate and try to undercut them.

4. Scotland won't have an oil fund. Any oil revenue money will simply go into plugging the deficit that already exists and as the SNP are NOT committed to spending a penny less than they are now, then don't get your hopes up. Norway has full control over it's oil and gas because it isn't in the EU.

5. The tories don't want us to be on the outside. That is a gross misrepresentation of our political elites. The Tory leadership is as pro EU as any of the other main parties.

6. Scotland will never have a Scandinavian style welfare system. In 30/40 years time, Scandinavians won't even have a system like that. They are already starting to slowly cut it all back. See Sweden, Denmark, Finland etc.

You are living in some sort of ridiculous leftarded fantasy world. And you will never win this referendum anyway.

[Newbornbairn]

Re point 3), cutting taxes for businesses and the wealthy. That's not very socialist is it? Given the EU moves towards tax harmonisation to stop corporations dodging tax, I can't see this playing well with the negotiations to join the EU. Nor will it play well with the left wingers who currently support the S N P.

[ecto]

If anybody thinks that an independent Scotland is going to be some kind of political heaven has completely lost the plot, there will be years of difficulty ahead

Anybody who believes that there will not be a deal done over Oil and Gas with the rest of the UK is looking through the world in tartan tinted glasses

A vote out of Europe would be a disaster for the UK, the rest of Europe will make sure of that, we will really become an island state

Again there is no hard evidence that full fiscal powers will encourage companies to come and invest, or for to stay and invest

Does anyone know what the support for a nuclear deterrent in Scotland is?

[Mr.Bojangles]

1. I am not convinced that as a single nation we can generate enough monies to keep taxes as at a affordable level,and retain a decent level of services

2. Not sure Europe will welcome us with open arms, as is being suggested

3 Not convinced we will be an attractive place for big companies to come and set up, or in fact to keep the companies that are already here

4 Not convinced we can become strong enough to retain the best people here, and fend off a "brain drain"

5 Its a hard world when you are on the outside looking in, at least we are at the moment on the inside

6 In 30 years time I do not want us to be a 2011 "Ireland"

It always makes me think, there was a vote in 1979, if we had said "yes" then would we currently be Norway, Denmark or in fact would we be Ireland

As much as the "yes" campaign can "crank" it up, since the announcement of the vote, support for independence in the polls have hardly shifted, even as we get closer to the vote, lucky if 35% vote for independence, will be interested to see after the vote, what the SNP see as an embarrassment of a result

Maybe you haven't been keeping up with things, and that's okay, but all of your points can be discussed away from memory of things that have been talked about on here over the last few weeks.

1. Other nations without oil, whiskey, renewable potential are able to run themselves with similar populations. Look at Denmark. And as was already said, we pay a larger percentage of the UK revenue than we receive.

2. There was an article someone posted just yesterday that stated that the Slovakian foreign minister didn't see any reason Scotland would find it difficult to remain in the EU. The Spanish foreign minister was also quoted as saying that the independence movement in Scotland was not a concern to them with regards to Catalonia because it was being undertaken in a legal way. So he said Spain would not veto. We also have 25% of Europe's renewable potential in onshore, offshore and tidal power. The EU is making a massive push for renewable energy, so it would be strange if they wanted to alienate us.

3. Despite, or maybe because of, the 'uncertainty' associated with the independence debate, inward investment is at record levels.

4. There are many ways to fend off brain drain, but very few are possible when you are in a political union hell bent on the growth of one particular geographical area of the country. The UK economy is designed to boost London at the expense of all other cities. One way we could arrest the migration of our best would be to encourage students to live in Scotland in the years immediately following their graduation. To do this the province of BC in Canada pays off student loans if students work in the industry they studied for for three years following graduation. For the majority of graduates, they stay in whatever city they first work in for years, so many of the most talented stay within the province. I would like to see something similar here, and something similar was mooted by the SNP a few years back.

5. Outside of what? If it's the EU, then I have news for you.

6. Ireland unfortunately has few natural resources and relied heavily on the financial sector. So did we, but we have a more diverse economy that should only become more so following independence.

[xbl]

There was a report out pointing out that despite the best lib dem attempts to stop investment in Scotland, the prospect of independence was seen as a good thing by investors.

Ecto, you might want to try doing some reading. Every one of your claims has been rejected, especially your EU nonsense. We are going to stay in the EU.

[Big Rider]

The Orange Lodge have now started their own "British Together" campaign - http://britishtogether.co.uk/

It's a bit shite isn't it?

No link to the positive case for the union unsurprisingly.

What is it with unionists and fucking flags????

[Reynard]

There was a report out pointing out that despite the best lib dem attempts to stop investment in Scotland, the prospect of independence was seen as a good thing by investors.

Ecto, you might want to try doing some reading. Every one of your claims has been rejected, especially your EU nonsense. We are going to stay in the EU.

Indeed. As a region of the UK.