Independence - how would you vote?

[Paulo Sergio]

Anyone watching this auld Lib Dem duffer slavering on Scotland Tonight?

[ForzaDundee]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-22345610

[lichtgilphead]

No, he was not. He was against the suggestion that the franchise should be varied from the general franchise rules. An issue they've since relented upon.

So, even though he specifically demanded "a simple, clear franchise which is the same as the Scottish Parliament one" (which has a minimum voting age of 18), he was really reaffirming his unequivocal support for the party policy of reducing the voting age to 16.

Thanks for clearing that up.

[Paulo Sergio]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-22345610

Doesn't Scotland subsidise the principality?

[DeeGas]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-politics-22345610

Wales and England have been family for hundreds of years.

Union.

Better Together.

[vikingTON]

.

We could do it a month after the capital flight like the Czechs and Slovakians had to when their first efforts went tits up.

School yourself fat boy.

The SNP Government has been clear that if Scotland secedes from the United Kingdom then our

currency will remain the Great British Pound. Twenty years ago a strikingly similar series of events

occurred in what is now the Czech Republic and Slovak Republic. Following the dissolution of

Czechoslovakia, the Slovaks and Czechs agreed to a currency union for a minimum of six months.

This union lasted only thirty-eight days. It appears that it is the same lessons which were learned

then which are currently being learned in the Eurozone. As the man who oversaw the split in the

Czech Republic, Václav Klaus, said regarding European Monetary Union: “I am convinced of the

inevitability of the one-way street, of the inevitability of the path: monetary union – fiscal union –

political union”. The importance of the relationship between political union and monetary union

today should be more pertinent than ever.

Much of the reasoning behind the success of the Movement for a Democratic Slovakia, favouring a

more autonomous Slovakia, in the 1992 elections can be put down to factors which could be loosely

compared to Scotland’s relationship to the United Kingdom. The Czechs and Slovaks felt more Czech

and Slovakian rather than Czechoslovakian due to the fact that the Czechoslovakian state which

existed between 1918 and 1992 failed to create a strong enough collective identity. As well as this;

Slovaks were more hostile than Czechs to the rapid privatisation following the Velvet Revolution in

1989 which saw Czechoslovakia change from a state-run economy to a market economy.

As a result of these factors, the MDS under Vladimir Meciar, managed to secure 37% of the votes in

Slovakia. The results of these elections created political deadlock in the federal government due to

an inability for a centre-left, centre-right or a pro-federation coalition to form. As a result, Klaus and

Meciar agreed that the federation would be dissolved and the modern Czech Republic and Slovak

Republic would take its place without a referendum.

Meciar publicly had doubts about the stability of the Slovakian economy after the split and so

proposed that there would remain a customs and monetary union between the Czech Republic and

Slovakia, keeping the old Czechoslovakian Koruna for a minimum of six months. This currency union

existed with two central banks which were governed by a joint monetary committee with equal

representation between the Czechs and Slovakians. This benefitted the Slovakians due to the fact

that the Czech population outnumbered them two-to-one. The monetary union could be dissolved

if either state; had a budget deficit of over 10%, foreign exchange reserves fell below one month’s

worth of exports, inter-republic capital transfers was over 5% of total deposits in banks and if the

committee could not reach agreement on fundamental issues regarding the union.

It became clear after the split that these conditions could not be met. Although Meciar passed a

balanced budget, there was still expected to be a 9 billion Koruny deficit. This was not aided by

Czech demands for 90 billion Koruny as compensation for the amount of shares in Czech companies

given to Slovaks during the privatisation of the Czechoslovakian economy. The Slovak economy also

had issues surrounding its reliance on the Czech economy, an uncompetitive economy based on

industries such as arms and chemical production, labour mobility between states was not as high as

expected and as a result capital flooded from Slovakian to Czech banks in anticipation of a currency

split. After just thirty eight days, the Czech-Slovakian Monetary Union failed. By the end of the

union, Austrian and German banks had ceased trading in the Koruna and following a devaluation of the Slovak Koruna, the Czech Koruna could buy 100SKK for 80.15 CZK.

Oh dear.

So, to be clear, you are attempting to compare currency policy between two states emerging from communism towards a free-market economy, facing rampant inflation and unemployment, with one of the richest countries in the world?

I'll repeat: Oh dear.

[xbl]

They're bang to rights on this. Tavish was appalling earlier today on Politics Scotland. The Tories are actually warmly welcoming this development. The Scottish Lib Dems aren't anti-Scottish, but they're certainly violently, pathologically and unnecessarily anti-SNP.

Thats fair comment. I personally don't have a strong opinion either way, I mean look at the OBR in London. It seems to be a political patsy, but as you know, economics isn't my thing!

[Ad Lib]

Thats fair comment. I personally don't have a strong opinion either way, I mean look at the OBR in London. It seems to be a political patsy, but as you know, economics isn't my thing!

There were fears it might do that, but in truth it's actually been quite critical of the UK government at times. Cameron was a bit the worse for wear when they rebuked him for implying that slow growth could be accounted for solely by faltering trade with the Eurozone.

[Reynard]

Oh dear.

So, to be clear, you are attempting to compare currency policy between two states emerging from communism towards a free-market economy, facing rampant inflation and unemployment, with one of the richest countries in the world?

I'll repeat: Oh dear.

I see the Welsh are also telling the SNP to get to f**k over the currency union debacle.

Oh dear.

I appreciate that you were not born during the exciting era when Communism disintegrated into tiny little bits because it was fucking shite. And that you have been "educated" by a series of Marxist c***s who bent history to promote their agenda and to win impressionable little cretinsminds from damp tower blocks in Greenock. But some of us were alive during that time, and actually understood what was happening. You weren't, and don't.

So scuttle off back under your Marxist stone and leave folk that actually know what they are talking about to get on with these things. You can sit there and seethe about working class stuff and owning the means to production and whatever other 19th century things you imagine to be relevant today.

[Reynard]

Nice to see Oxford educated Northern Irish hack Lesly Riddoch and nationalist leaning journalist Iain McWhirter raking over the rubble of the SNP campaign last night on Newsnicht, Both of them appeared to be highly critical of the whole thing and seemed a bit pissed off with fat Alex and co.

They also rightly dismissed the relevance of the Yes campaign, which consists of about five elected councillors and one list MSP, as nothing more than an irrelevent burr.

I expect to see more of these "where did it all go wrong" type discussions over the next few months, as the SNP make even more of a c**t of themselves.

[Mr Rational]

I thought you would be happy Reynard, today is the day that England turns to UKIP and tells Johnny Foreigner to bugger off.

[Reynard]

I thought you would be happy Reynard, today is the day that England turns to UKIP and tells Johnny Foreigner to bugger off.

I dont live in England, and their local elections have precisely nothing to do with me. But yes, Id be quite happy to see UKIP come along and smash up the lib/lab/con. Although, just like the SNP here, once they get their feet under the table, a ministerial car, and a bunch of flunkeys running about after them, Im sure they will disappoint just like all the rest of them, and become hopeless and arrogant.

[xbl]

I can taste the desperation! Getting scared? Are your conversations with friends not going as expected? Finding the tide turning?

[ArabianKnight]

Two of my friends who can only be described as arch-unionists (only one of them is a The Rangers fan of the glory Hunter type, not G.S.T.Q, watp etc type) have changed their minds recently, both of them citing that by lending their support to YesScotland it gives us a chance to live in a more democratically governed SOVEREIGN STATE (the caps are to emphasise so another debate about country/state/legal international personality shyte doesn't start) as tgey believe Westminster isn't working, hurrrrah!

I said to myself if those two for whatever reason change their mind then its game on for the referendum as they were in my book the most likely to vote NO.

Has anyone else had a similar expierence?

[doulikefish]

Two of my friends who can only be described as arch-unionists (only one of them is a The Rangers fan of the glory Hunter type, not G.S.T.Q, watp etc type) have changed their minds recently, both of them citing that by lending their support to YesScotland it gives us a chance to live in a more democratically governed SOVEREIGN STATE (the caps are to emphasise so another debate about country/state/legal international personality shyte doesn't start) as tgey believe Westminster isn't working, hurrrrah!

I said to myself if those two for whatever reason change their mind then its game on for the referendum as they were in my book the most likely to vote NO.

Has anyone else had a similar expierence?

Loads when you give them a raional debate,reynard is next on my list

[xbl]

I've had similar experiences, most recently from a proper unionist who first became undecided, then went to a yes Scotland meeting and converted!

[xbl]

Nice to see Oxford educated Northern Irish hack Lesly Riddoch and nationalist leaning journalist Iain McWhirter raking over the rubble of the SNP campaign last night on Newsnicht, Both of them appeared to be highly critical of the whole thing and seemed a bit pissed off with fat Alex and co.

They also rightly dismissed the relevance of the Yes campaign, which consists of about five elected councillors and one list MSP, as nothing more than an irrelevent burr.

I expect to see more of these "where did it all go wrong" type discussions over the next few months, as the SNP make even more of a c**t of themselves.

www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/comment/columnists/why-must-scotland-take-a-pounding-in-currency-row.20971556?_=79d7afe4c7338fc6e492a0afe093883fe4ea4470

Ian MacWhirter there, pointing out some facts as to why it makes sense to stick with the pound initially.

[Reynard]

www.heraldscotland.com/mobile/comment/columnists/why-must-scotland-take-a-pounding-in-currency-row.20971556?_=79d7afe4c7338fc6e492a0afe093883fe4ea4470

Ian MacWhirter there, pointing out some facts as to why it makes sense to stick with the pound initially.

Swinney committed to staying with the pound "long term" last week. He was pushed in an interview to make the committment, and he did.

McWhirter is entitled to his view. But he's wrong.

McWhirter was on Newsnight last night moaning about how poorly the SNP have led the referendum campaign so far. He's right about that.

Scotland can unilaterally adopt the pound, the Euro, the Dollar, or any other currency it likes if it wants to. What it cant do is force a monetary union on its terms alone.

[xbl]

Spot of rowing back there I see? As I said, there is real desperation in the air. Its almost like the Unionists know something we dont...

[xbl]

"Countries like Denmark are only nominally autonomous because their currencies are pegged to the euro. Denmark's central bank takes its policy from the European Central Bank but doesn't have any representation on it. The Swiss have been in dire straits because their currency is massively overvalued because of "safe haven" cash pouring into the Swiss franc to escape the euro crisis. The same is true with Norway's krone.

Denmark's central bank had to introduce negative interest rates to stop the inflow of cash that meant depositors had to pay Danish banks for the privilege of lending them their cash. Since a separate Scottish pound would be a petro-currency, this too might rise in value. During a run on the English pound, cash would flow over the border to Scotland, forcing up the currency and rendering Scottish exports more and more expensive."

Pegged to the Euro? How can this be? How do they survive?